Rape allegations mount against Bill Cosby #3

[Donjeta]

Steadfastly insisting that Bill Cosby is innocent and a victim of a vicious smearing campaign until proven otherwise and all the accusers are lying is imo the very definition of believing things blindly.

He has not even CLAIMED any such thing, he has said nothing about what he thinks happened, and we have no idea if "i'm innocent and the women are all lying" is his story at all. Actually his lawyers put out a statement that strongly implies that Andrea Constand is telling the truth.

So this hypothesis is not based on the evidence, it's born out of blind faith groping in the dark making things up as it goes, based on nothing except speculation and possibly a bit of starstruck adoration and/or misogyny.

At least with the women we have 30+ personal accounts with various amounts of details and sometimes interviews in their own words and thus we have some material to base our assessments of credibility upon.

Regarding Bill Cosby's version, the one that makes him innocent of all charges, we can only assess the credibility of the stories we made up in our heads all by ourselves. Of course they're going to be just as credible as we want him to be but it says nothing about the veracity of the allegations.

Of course he's not obliged to say anything but personally I would be more inclined to consider the option that all the 30+ women are lying if he had the guts to come out and say so. He's made statements about sweaters and Eddie Murphy and his artworks and his wife and the ethics of the press, he could make a statement saying he's not a rapist.

Instead he just wants people to shut up about the allegations, and assume that he's the bees knees, like it goes without saying that Bill Cosby is an all-around good guy. Well, newsflash, no it doesn't, not if there's three dozen women saying otherwise. (OK well there's three dozen women saying he's a creep who drugs and rapes and harasses women and quite a few other people saying there are other ways that he's a bit of a jerk and not an all-around good guy. Are they all lying too?)

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Steadfastly insisting that Bill Cosby is innocent and a victim of a vicious smearing campaign until proven otherwise and all the accusers are lying is imo the very definition of believing things blindly.

He has not even CLAIMED any such thing, he has said nothing about what he thinks happened, and we have no idea if "i'm innocent and the women are all lying" is his story at all. Actually his lawyers put out a statement that strongly implies that Andrea Constand is telling the truth.

So this hypothesis is not based on the evidence, it's born out of blind faith groping in the dark making things up as it goes, based on nothing except speculation and possibly a bit of starstruck adoration and/or misogyny.

At least with the women we have 30+ personal accounts with various amounts of details and sometimes interviews in their own words and thus we have some material to base our assessments of credibility upon.

Regarding Bill Cosby's version, the one that makes him innocent of all charges, we can only assess the credibility of the stories we made up in our heads all by ourselves. Of course they're going to be just as credible as we want him to be but it says nothing about the veracity of the allegations.

Of course he's not obliged to say anything but personally I would be more inclined to consider the option that all the 30+ women are lying if he had the guts to come out and say so. He's made statements about sweaters and Eddie Murphy and his artworks and his wife and the ethics of the press, he could make a statement saying he's not a rapist.

Instead he just wants people to shut up about the allegations, and assume that he's the bees knees, like it goes without saying that Bill Cosby is an all-around good guy. Well, newsflash, no it doesn't, not if there's three dozen women saying otherwise. (OK well there's three dozen women saying he's a creep who drugs and rapes and harasses women and quite a few other people saying there are other ways that he's a bit of a jerk and not an all-around good guy. Are they all lying too?)

Again, I am saying not the BC is absolutely innocent but that I don't see proof that he is guilty, that is not the same thing. I do believe that some of the stories we heard may not be 100% true.

I get to choose who I believe and who I do not believe. Just like jurors. They look at the evidence and decide who is telling the truth because sadly most times there is always someone lying.

I am not going to defend my right to think how I do. I believe people are innocent until Proven Guilty. This is no different.

 

[Donjeta]

Again, I am saying not the BC is absolutely innocent but that I don't see proof that he is guilty, that is not the same thing. I do believe that some of the stories we heard may not be 100% true.

I get to choose who I believe and who I do not believe. Just like jurors. They look at the evidence and decide who is telling the truth because sadly most times there is always someone lying.

I am not going to defend my right to think how I do. I believe people are innocent until Proven Guilty. This is no different.

Yes but only if said people have been accused of rape by multiple women. If said people are women who say they were raped by Bill Cosby then they're guilty of being lying liars who lie until they can prove themselves innocent of making false allegations with irrefutable proof.

Sorry but this is the impression all your posts thus far have been giving, despite stating that you didn't mean to say that they're lying.

I have no problem whatsoever with saying that he hasn't been proven guilty because of course he hasn't been. That's for the courts to decide. It's also quite possible that not all the allegations are 100% true. Personally I find some of the accusers a bit more credible than some other accusers.

But I think it's quite a leap of blind faith to assume that all the allegations are 100% made up, which is what we need in order to think Bill Cosby is innocent.

Not just "innocent until proven guilty in a court of law" innocent but actually innocent, as in "not a rapist who drugs and molests women and gets away with it".

For Bill Cosby to be factually and actually innocent we need 36 women to be criminals who make up defamatory allegations and (sometimes) make false police reports.

JMO and if I was a juror and I had to consider the merits of the case I'd think that the odds that Bill Cosby is a lying liar who lies to save himself and because that's what sociopaths do are better than 36 women being lying liars who lie for no apparent reason and benefit to themselves.

If even a few of them told the truth he's a rapist.

 

[Donjeta]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_accusation_of_rape

A false accusation of rape is the intentional reporting of a rape by an alleged victim when no rape has occurred. Studies have found that police typically classify between 1.5 and 8% of rape accusations as unfounded, unproven or false, however researchers say those determinations are often dubious. The "conventional scholarly wisdom," according to American law professor Michelle J. Anderson, is that two percent of rape complaints made to the police are false. The United States Justice Department agrees, saying false accusations "are estimated to occur at the low rate of two percent -- similar to the rate of false accusations for other violent crimes." However, others say eight percent or more of rape accusations are false, and as a scientific matter the answer remains unknown.[1]

I suppose it's impossible to know for a fact because often it's word against word and no one really knows except the people who were there. But let's take the higher 8 % estimate to allow for the possibility that celebrities attract more false accusations because people want the fame or the payday or crazy people start imagining things about them.

Assuming the probability of one being a liar is independent of the probability of the others being liars (if it was a conspiracy against Cosby that they're all in this wouldn't be true but so far there's no evidence of such a conspiracy and we don't want to believe things without proof) :

If there's only one accuser, the odds of her being a liar are 0.08.
Now, there's two accusers. The odds of them both being liars are 0.08 x 0.08 = 0.0064
Now, take a third accuser. The odds of all three being liars are 0.0064 x 0.08= 0.000512
Now, a fourth. The odds of all four being liars are 0.000512 x 0.08 = 0.00004096
Now a fifth. The odds of all five being liars are 0.00004096 x 0.08= 0.0000032768

Conversely, the odds of the first accuser being a truthteller are 0.92.
The odds of the first two both telling the truth are 0.8464.
The odds of the first three all being truth tellers are 0.92 x 0.92 x 0.92 =0,778688
The odds of the first four telling the truth are 0,71639296
The odds of the first five all telling the truth are 0,6590815232.


Someone with a better calculator can calculate the odds of all 36 being liars/ truth tellers.

But the numbers tell a pretty clear story here already. If you add more accusers the chances go up that there's a stray liar among them, but at the same time wise money would never bet on the astronomically small chance that they're all liars and none told the truth.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_accusation_of_rape


I suppose it's impossible to know for a fact because often it's word against word and no one really knows except the people who were there. But let's take the higher 8 % estimate to allow for the possibility that celebrities attract more false accusations because people want the fame or the payday or crazy people start imagining things about them.

Assuming the probability of one being a liar is independent of the probability of the others being liars (if it was a conspiracy against Cosby that they're all in this wouldn't be true but so far there's no evidence of such a conspiracy and we don't want to believe things without proof) :

If there's only one accuser, the odds of her being a liar are 0.08.
Now, there's two accusers. The odds of them both being liars are 0.08 x 0.08 = 0.0064
Now, take a third accuser. The odds of all three being liars are 0.0064 x 0.08= 0.000512
Now, a fourth. The odds of all four being liars are 0.000512 x 0.08 = 0.00004096
Now a fifth. The odds of all five being liars are 0.00004096 x 0.08= 0.0000032768

Conversely, the odds of the first accuser being a truthteller are 0.92.
The odds of the first two both telling the truth are 0.8464.
The odds of the first three all being truth tellers are 0.92 x 0.92 x 0.92 =0,778688
The odds of the first four telling the truth are 0,71639296
The odds of the first five all telling the truth are 0,6590815232.


Someone with a better calculator can calculate the odds of all 36 being liars/ truth tellers.

But the numbers tell a pretty clear story here already. If you add more accusers the chances go up that there's a stray liar among them, but at the same time wise money would never bet on the astronomically small chance that they're all liars and none told the truth.

I find it odd that you are so focused on my opinion of this case. Why not just let people be with their thoughts and not dog them because they don't match up to yours?

I will not believe it until I see something more here.

 

[Donjeta]

I find it odd that you are so focused on my opinion of this case. Why not just let people be with their thoughts and not dog them because they don't match up to yours?

I will not believe it until I see something more here.

I did not mention you in that post whatsoever.

 

[Donjeta]

I will hazard a guess that Bill Cosby will not be releasing a statement thanking Snoop Dogg any time soon.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/people/2015/02/20/snoop-dogg-mocks-cosby-on-kimmel/23734031/

I didn't know Samuel Jackson worked on the Cosby show:

Jackson declined to weigh in on whether or not Cosby is guilty, saying "I can't make a judgment about it."

But he added, "I wish that [Cosby] would say something."

"I make my judgment because I have a daughter, I have a wife I love and I have a lot of women in my life," he said. "And I know women are vulnerable in this society and people with power take advantage of them."

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/bill-cosby-samuel-l-jackson-775628

Cosby canceled another show :

Amid ongoing allegations of sexual misconduct by comedian Bill Cosby, his performance scheduled for June 6 at Wells Fargo Center for the Arts has been indefinitely postponed.

http://www.pressdemocrat.com/entertainment/3556301-181/bill-cosby-show-at-wells
No doubt there will be lots of snow on the roads in June and he's thinking about everyone's safety.

 

[Blondie in Spokane]

'Where there's smoke, there's fire': Actor Samuel L. Jackson calls upon Bill Cosby to 'say something' about sexual assault scandal

Jackson appeared on Watch What Happens Live on Thursday

He worked as a stand-in for Cosby for three years in the 1980s

'People with power take advantage of people,' he said on the show

Cosby has been accused of sexually assaulting over 30 women

He has never directly addressed the accusations; lawyers deny the claims

Earlier in the week he thanked Eddie Murphy for not mocking him on SNL

Last week, two former models became the latest to accuse Cosby of drugging them

Former models Linda Brown and Lisa-Lotte Lublin have come forward accusing Cosby of drugging them

Both women are represented by Gloria Allred, whose client list includes seven other Cosby accusers

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...say-sexual-assault-scandal.html#ixzz3SMBPo0s2

 

[Donjeta]

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/02/20/entertainment/feat-cosby-tour-cancellations/

(CNN)The list of canceled Bill Cosby shows has grown this month.

Four shows the comedian had scheduled for February have been canceled: February 8 in Boston, February 21 in Pittsburgh and February 22 in Charlotte, North Carolina.

No reasons were given for the Pittsburgh and Charlotte cancellations. Cosby said weather concerns led to the Boston cancellation, but the date has not been rescheduled.

A fourth show, scheduled for Thalia Mara Hall in Jackson, Mississippi, on Thursday, has been "postponed," Shelia Byrd of the Jackson Mayor's Office told CNN.

Gary Bongiovanni, editor-in-chief of Pollstar -- the concert tour publication -- says it's been challenging to keep track.



"It seems like they're falling like dominoes, one at a time," he said. "The whole thing has gotten a lot shorter than it was."

http://www.democratandchronicle.com.../cosby-cancels-rochester-appearance/23754423/
Embattled comedian Bill Cosby has canceled his show at Rochester Broadway Theatre League in April.

RBTL chairman Arnie Rothschild said he was notified via email that Cosby's upcoming local performance is canceled indefinitely by the comedian's promoter in Worcester, Mass.

 

[Occams Razor]

Cosby's behavior during this whole debacle is very telling. Instead of making a statement or addressing the claims, he's staying silent and trying to manipulate journalists into staying silent too. That's probably how he's kept it quiet all these years. That doesn't work so well in the age of social media. He probably WON'T have his day in court, but he's certainly having his day in the court of public opinion. We're all free to form opinions based on the evidence available. No love lost if you don't agree with my opinion.

My concern is this: Why is the word of one man worth more than the word of 20+ women? Are we in Yemen or Saudi Arabia? If even ONE of these women is telling the truth, Cosby is a rapist who should be sharing a cell with Bubba. Odds are, at least one of them is being truthful. Cosby has every right to a fair trial in a court of law. But nowhere in the constitution is he guaranteed an endorsement deal or a spot on Letterman.

Karma.

MOO.

 

[Blondie in Spokane]

Bill Cosby cancels two New York shows

http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/...cancels-more-shows-albany-rochester/23844245/

 

[Slebby]

Tomorrow night, CNN will air "No Laughing Matter: Inside the Cosby Allegations".


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Donjeta]

Bill Cosby will find the language here offensive:

http://www.salon.com/2015/02/23/richard_pryors_widow_bill_cosby_is_a_fking_hypocrite/

Selected quotes from Richard Pryor's widow, read at your own risk.

 

[Donjeta]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yWta6qgeEPY

The comment section here is interesting.

Who is the woman saying he is an animal?

 

[IzzyBlanche]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yWta6qgeEPY

The comment section here is interesting.

Who is the woman saying he is an animal?

I didn't see that, but those comments are disturbing. And people wonder why rape victims are reluctant to report what happened.

 

[BirdycatNY]

New Cosby accuser: 'Do you remember me?'
By Chris Perry, CNN
Updated 4:44 PM ET, Tue February 24, 2015
http://www.cnn.com/2015/02/24/us/cosby-accuser-heidi-thomas/

"...Thomas says her career was picking up in 1984, but she was questioning whether she wanted the lifestyle of a model. That's when the call came from Annie Maloney, an agent with JF Images, who told her there was a very important person in the industry who was "looking for young talent that he can mentor." She says Maloney told her that she needed to go to Reno, Nevada, because Bill Cosby wanted to work with her -- to coach her and help her act..."

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Bill Cosby's Lawyers to Ask Judge to Dismiss Defamation Suit

http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment...awyers-judge-dismiss-defamation-suit-29200895

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Asked what Pryor, who died in 2005, might have thought of the Cosby scandal, Pryor biographer Scott Saul told The Daily Beast in December ...

[snipped for focus]"I think that Pryor, for all his admiration of Cosby as a performer, would have been suspicious of how Cosby took on the politics of responsibility and portrayed himself as the epitome of moral rectitude over the past few decades. [Pryor] had a fine eye for moral hypocrisy, and I know that a glaring example of it would not have escaped his notice."

Language warning.

http://www.eonline.com/news/629265/...m_medium=rssfeeds&utm_campaign=rss_topstories

 

[Donjeta]

http://www.whas11.com/story/news/lo...omoter-cancel-lexington-performance/23957711/

LOUISVILLE, Ky. (WHAS11) – Comedian Bill Cosby has postponed a performance at the University of Kentucky next month.

The University announced that the March 15 performance at the Singletary Center has been postponed by a mutual agreement with the comedian and the show's promoter.

She was represented by JF Images, considered one of the premier modeling agencies in Denver. Its founder, Jo Farrell, had earned the nickname "Barracuda."

"I'd go into her office and your knees would shake. But then again, as a young talent trying to get started, you look at that kind of intimidation factor and you think, 'Oh, she's-- she knows what she's doing. I am in good hands here,'" Thomas says.


In 1975, the local press reported that Farrell responded to her nickname by saying, "if being a barracuda means I work very hard, protect my people and being a good businesswoman, then I accept it."

CNN reached Farrell, who is retired, by phone, but she declined to comment on Cosby.

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/02/24/us/cosby-accuser-heidi-thomas/

That's the same agent as Bowman and Ferrier.

Farrell plays one of the more unusual roles in the decades-long drama of Cosby and his accusers. She referred two women to Cosby who later alleged he sexually abused them: Barbara Bowman and Beth Ferrier.

Farrell is now 83 and suffering from dementia and Alzheimer’s, according to her daughter, Kathleen, who said in a recent interview with The Post that her mother retired five years ago and knew nothing about the claims of sexual abuse until they appeared in People magazine in 2006. “It’s mind-boggling,” Jo Farrell told the magazine at the time. “I don’t set up interviews in bars. Here I am pulled in on this, and it makes me sad because my reputation has always been golden in this city.”

Farrell’s relationship to Cosby dates back decades. She first met him at the Turn of the Century nightclub, which was near her talent agency. Kathleen Farrell said Cosby worked with a number of the agency’s young female clients through the years, taking them on outings and asking them to auditions. She said she had heard allegations that other men — photographers and bookers — had abused actresses. But she said her mother never mentioned any complaints about Cosby. If she had heard complaints, she said, her mother would have severed her relationship with Cosby “to protect the girls.”

“Nobody ever addressed with her that there was an issue,” Kathleen Farrell said. “She’s a mother hen; she would have addressed it.”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/lifes...074938-718e-11e4-8808-afaa1e3a33ef_story.html

I had read the WP article before but had missed this bit:

In 1996, Valentino was contacted by another former Playboy Playmate, Charlotte Kemp, Miss December 1982, who said she was writing a book called “Centerfold Memories,” which is due out in February.

In an interview, Kemp — whose real last name is Helmkamp — said she videotaped an interview with Valentino during which she talked about her alleged encounter with Cosby. Helmkamp said the account she gave matches the account Valentino provided to The Post.

Videotape from 1996, way before the Constand case became public.

 

[Tulessa]

http://www.whas11.com/story/news/lo...omoter-cancel-lexington-performance/23957711/

LOUISVILLE, Ky. (WHAS11) – Comedian Bill Cosby has postponed a performance at the University of Kentucky next month.

The University announced that the March 15 performance at the Singletary Center has been postponed by a mutual agreement with the comedian and the show's promoter.


http://edition.cnn.com/2015/02/24/us/cosby-accuser-heidi-thomas/

That's the same agent as Bowman and Ferrier.



http://www.washingtonpost.com/lifes...074938-718e-11e4-8808-afaa1e3a33ef_story.html

I had read the WP article before but had missed this bit:



Videotape from 1996, way before the Constand case became public.

GOOOOOOOOOOOO Kentucky!!!