MISTRIAL - Sidney Moorer on trial for the kidnapping of Heather Elvis #5

[TTF14]

I think SM and TM or whoever , split up taking care of Heather . All we " know " about SM's movements that night are the Walmart purchase and the pay phone call . His phone powered on at 3:03 and pinged at his home. His phone had a close to 5 minute connection with HE's phone from 3:16- 3:22 and SM's truck was caught on video minutes from PTL and within a few minutes of HE's phone activity then phone silence at PTL.
We do not have any information for TM's actions that morning .

Yes I believe Heather talked with SM during that almost 5 minute phone call, and yes I think he was in the truck heading to PTL. But I think TM's movements hold the other pieces of the puzzle. The State had to have something on her to be able to bring kidnapping charges against her. They couldn't just charge her for kidnapping based on her month old phone threats to HE , or just because she was SM's wife and her rants on Facebook after HE disappeared. IMO, the State has evidence connecting TM with Heather during the morning of the 18th.

Maybe they should have been tried together.

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[jillycat]

Agree, I don't think they were going to say "Oops, our bad" if the test was negative when she took it somewhere else. I believe she was lured to PTL for reasons to do her harm from the evidence presented. So, a question for you and anyone else, if I discounted the pregnancy test, would I be wrong to still find a guilty verdict, since I weighed all the other evidence and testimony and came to that conclusion?

I don't think you can reasonably eliminate the pregnancy test after the state offered it as motive.

 

[escape2sc]

What did he say to her and when? Was it in the first call or the second or both that he wanted to meet at PTL? So she went to Longbeard's because...why?

As for Bri, if I said I found all witnesses credible, so how can I not believe her account? I do think there's a difference between what a witness says under oath, as truthfully as she can, about hearsay from a deceased person who may or may not have told her the whole story.

And I would only put forth a new theory with new evidence, or at the very least I would integrate all movement that morning with their theory. At least if they want a better outcome than they had on the murder charges and this trial. I don't think a creepin around narrative or the claim that she drove to Longbeard's to think about driving to PTL is a sure thing for the state.

I think the State could sell the theory HE met SM at Longbeard's and back it up with HE trying to contact SM at the pay phone number prior to being at Longbeard's and called SM's cellphone immediately after leaving Longbeards to arrange to meet at PTL.

 

[jillycat]

I believe it was the first call. I also believe the "I am going to sleep on it" expression to Bri showed the mindset to be Heather was torn about it. Someone with mixed emotions may drive around to clear their thoughts. Maybe she was debating herself back and forth, hence the stop at Longbeards and then turning around and going back home. I can't imagine the state would put forth a new theory, but they may present it differently. I don't think it would fly that her phone went to PTL and she didn't. I can't imagine if they said something happened to her at Longbeards and then her phone, not her went to PTL with whoever to dump the car. Do you think that would have been more believable to the jury? I seriously don't.

I'm sorry, I just can't buy that she hung out by some dumpsters at Longbeards to decide whether or not to drive to PTL later.

 

[New2MB]

Where is Sticky Fingers located ? Maybe SM was truthful about working at Sticky Fingers that night and the Walmart on Seaboard was closer ?

Sticky Fingers is very close to Seaboard Walmart.

 

[Sunshynn]

I've been thinking..what if the events transpired this way:
*HE/SM affair
*TM finds out and SM calls off relationship with HE
*During October-November, HE believes she could be pregnant; SM spends his nights chained to the bed; TM obsesses over HE
*SM gets wind of supposed pregnancy from someone HE works with
*SM and TM conspire to get rid of their little problem (HE)
*HE goes on date with SS
*SM purchases pregnancy test and then goes to payphone and calls HE who had just returned from her date to tell her he loves her and is leaving his wife.
*HE is upset with this sudden contact from SM and calls BW to discuss. HE tells BW she is going to "sleep on" what to do next.
*HE plays on Tumblr and the "old feelings" for SM start coming back and she decides she wants talk to him-after all, as far as she knows, he's a free man and can come and go as he pleases now.
*HE places phone call to the last number he called her from. No answer. I'm certain that she was unaware this was a payphone.
*HE calls number again. No answer.
*Several more calls go unanswered.
*HE is now desperate to talk to SM and discuss this new relationship he's now laid at her feet, so HE takes a risk and calls SM cellphone.
*SM, who is now home and certainly surrounded by TM, answers the phone and tells HE to meet him at one of their old tryst places-LB.
*HE rushes to LB
*SM and TM travel together to LB to meet HE
*HE starts to get cold feet waiting on SM to arrive and starts to leave, but is met the opposite way by SM/TM pulling up in truck.
*TM confronts HE about supposed pregnancy and affair and every other grievance under the sun and somehow HE is incapacitated somehow at this point.
*SM drives HE car (TM follows in the truck with incapacitated HE) but someone is outside the apartment building so the plan to ditch HE car at the apartment is ditched.
*SM/TM decide to dump the car at PTL because of its isolation
*HE car is parked at PTL and SM/TM take HE to her final resting place.

I admit, my memory of the complete timeline of calls isn't the best, but my main thing is trying to explain why HE calls SM on the payphone so many times.

 

[TTF14]

I've been thinking..what if the events transpired this way:
*HE/SM affair
*TM finds out and SM calls off relationship with HE
*During October-November, HE believes she could be pregnant; SM spends his nights chained to the bed; TM obsesses over HE
*SM gets wind of supposed pregnancy from someone HE works with
*SM and TM conspire to get rid of their little problem (HE)
*HE goes on date with SS
*SM purchases pregnancy test and then goes to payphone and calls HE who had just returned from her date to tell her he loves her and is leaving his wife.
*HE is upset with this sudden contact from SM and calls BW to discuss. HE tells BW she is going to "sleep on" what to do next.
*HE plays on Tumblr and the "old feelings" for SM start coming back and she decides she wants talk to him-after all, as far as she knows, he's a free man and can come and go as he pleases now.
*HE places phone call to the last number he called her from. No answer. I'm certain that she was unaware this was a payphone.
*HE calls number again. No answer.
*Several more calls go unanswered.
*HE is now desperate to talk to SM and discuss this new relationship he's now laid at her feet, so HE takes a risk and calls SM cellphone.
*SM, who is now home and certainly surrounded by TM, answers the phone and tells HE to meet him at one of their old tryst places-LB.
*HE rushes to LB
*SM and TM travel together to LB to meet HE
*HE starts to get cold feet waiting on SM to arrive and starts to leave, but is met the opposite way by SM/TM pulling up in truck.
*TM confronts HE about supposed pregnancy and affair and every other grievance under the sun and somehow HE is incapacitated somehow at this point.
*SM drives HE car (TM follows in the truck with incapacitated HE) but someone is outside the apartment building so the plan to ditch HE car at the apartment is ditched.
*SM/TM decide to dump the car at PTL because of its isolation
*HE car is parked at PTL and SM/TM take HE to her final resting place.

I admit, my memory of the complete timeline of calls isn't the best, but my main thing is trying to explain why HE calls SM on the payphone so many times.

See the time line I constructed. Similar but you'll see where yours couldn't make sense (timing of the second convo)

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[New2MB]

If he was doing maintenance work, he wouldn't have "clocked in" to have a time sheet or anything. He's not a Sticky Fingers employee; he's a contractor, so there really wouldn't be work records.

Excellent point!! And that's why I said it would be "easy" for him to "say" that's where he was, since he was wearing that shirt!!

 

[stillwatersc]

But, surely there would have been someone else there when he was working. Or if he was alone, did he have the security code to lock up when he was done?

One of the first witnesses saw texts on Heather's phone that she & SM had relations on the patio of Tilted Kilt. Sounds like SM did have access after hours. (so much for TM's claim on 3x in back seat)

 

[bestill]

I'm close to this theory, as well. There is also the retention pond near Longbeard's. Does anyone know if it was searched? The expert mentioned that Heather's phone could have been between the roadway and the retention pond between 3:11 am and 3:15 am.
I think the state did an excellent job at the trial, though; regardless of the outcome. I guess I just can't keep myself from theorizing.

I agree and posted this earlier, I hope they searched that retention pond thoroughly, This a red flag to me.

 

[pinkshoemama]

Is the theory of her being sold into some kind of international sex slave ring too far fetched at this point?

It keeps nagging at me especially since the mistrial. It also keeps nagging at me WHY they have been able to hold such relentless claim of innocence. I just still want to tie a third person in somewhere.

Am I in complete left field on this one?

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[Surfside]

I remember when I hired contractors (for inventory control) when they submitted their invoice it had to have the time they started and the time they ended and it had to be signed by an individual in management.... I wonder if ANY of the restaurants he contracted with required this type of information or was it just like someone said...2 hours on a particular day?

I worked in restaurants for 15 years, and my Dad used to be an electrical contractor. I also have quite a few friends who are different types of independent contractors. I can only speak to my experiences. It was pretty rare for a restaurant to ask for that kind of detailed invoice. This was for manual labor, so the invoice was based on the job, usually, not the amount of time it took to do it. As for my experience with independent contractors, many of them are just not that regimented. Sure, if you work for a big construction company or plumbing company or something, then yeah, you have to follow company rules and may be more regulated and organized, but TM didn't exactly run a big company, AFAIK.

But, surely there would have been someone else there when he was working. Or if he was alone, did he have the security code to lock up when he was done?

I feel like I remember reading he fled into a nearby restaurant when he was supposedly shot at or threatened on N. Kings Hwy, because he had a key to it. I'm sure it varied from one job to the next. But if he actually worked at SF that night, and if someone was there or he used an alarm code, that goes back to the original point: Why didn't the defense bring that up to alibi him?

Wouldn't sticky fingers have surveillance cameras?

They might. It's a small chain, only in 4 states, so then again, they might not. Over the years, I only worked at one restaurant that had security cameras. Coincidentally, it's the only time I ever worked for a large chain.

I don't know if he worked at Sticky Fingers that night, but I know he wasn't working there when he was at Wal-Mart or the payphone, and I doubt he went to work there after those events.

 

[LBDunes]

I'm sorry, I just can't buy that she hung out by some dumpsters at Longbeards to decide whether or not to drive to PTL later.

Well you say hung out by dumpsters, but the man said the data showed she was in the back corner of the parking lot. I don't think that meant literally she was hanging out by the dumpster. I think it meant she was in her car in the back part of the parking lot. I don't think that is totally unreasonable to just park there and go over things in her mind. Also, I think the meeting at PTL was set up in the 2nd call to SM. I misspoke/didn't make that clear. I think the first call was to lure her with the leaving the wife, I miss you ruse. He may have asked her to come out, but she probably resisted at that time.

 

[TTF14]

Is the theory of her being sold into some kind of international sex slave ring too far fetched at this point?

It keeps nagging at me especially since the mistrial. It also keeps nagging at me WHY they have been able to hold such relentless claim of innocence. I just still want to tie a third person in somewhere.

Am I in complete left field on this one?

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Nope. My theory I posted (in long detail) this morning involves an unknown third (or fourth, fifth, sixth....) person.

 

[TTF14]

I worked in restaurants for 15 years, and my Dad used to be an electrical contractor. I also have quite a few friends who are different types of independent contractors. I can only speak to my experiences. It was pretty rare for a restaurant to ask for that kind of detailed invoice. This was for manual labor, so the invoice was based on the job, usually, not the amount of time it took to do it. As for my experience with independent contractors, many of them are just not that regimented. Sure, if you work for a big construction company or plumbing company or something, then yeah, you have to follow company rules and may be more regulated and organized, but TM didn't exactly run a big company, AFAIK.

I feel like I remember reading he fled into a nearby restaurant when he was supposedly shot at or threatened on N. Kings Hwy, because he had a key to it. I'm sure it varied from one job to the next. But if he actually worked at SF that night, and if someone was there or he used an alarm code, that goes back to the original point: Why didn't the defense bring that up to alibi him?

They might. It's a small chain, only in 4 states, so then again, they might not. Over the years, I only worked at one restaurant that had security cameras. Coincidentally, it's the only time I ever worked for a large chain.

I don't know if he worked at Sticky Fingers that night, but I know he wasn't working there when he was at Wal-Mart or the payphone, and I doubt he went to work there after those events.

I'm self employed, and not in any kind of physical labor, but I work by project, not by billable hours. I would never submit an invoice for specific hours worked since I am paid for the work I produce, regardless of how long it takes me. (I don't have to enter buildings in the middle of the night....or ever.).

 

[Surfside]

I'm self employed, and not in any kind of physical labor, but I work by project, not by billable hours. I would never submit an invoice for specific hours worked since I am paid for the work I produce, regardless of how long it takes me. (I don't have to enter buildings in the middle of the night....or ever.).

Same.

 

[DaleTray]

BBM... if that was the case, is there no other payphone that was closer to her apartment? Why go all the way back to Seaboard?

I am no expert but next time yu walk in a convenience store and look at the approx 20-30 types of small cigars. I would guess 99% arent for celebrating. I dont think SM was celebrating. I would guess he just wanted to get high. I may even go so far to speculate maybe he felt he needed to be high to complete his intended deed

 

[LBDunes]

Is the theory of her being sold into some kind of international sex slave ring too far fetched at this point?

It keeps nagging at me especially since the mistrial. It also keeps nagging at me WHY they have been able to hold such relentless claim of innocence. I just still want to tie a third person in somewhere.

Am I in complete left field on this one?

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BBM - They do claim innocence relentlessly, but their behavior to me seems to show quite the opposite. Additionally I can't get past the multiple alibis thrown about by both SM, TM and her family. In the court of public opinion they have not done themselves any favors disparaging the victim either.

 

[jillycat]

Well you say hung out by dumpsters, but the man said the data showed she was in the back corner of the parking lot. I don't think that meant literally she was hanging out by the dumpster. I think it meant she was in her car in the back part of the parking lot. I don't think that is totally unreasonable to just park there and go over things in her mind. Also, I think the meeting at PTL was set up in the 2nd call to SM. I misspoke/didn't make that clear. I think the first call was to lure her with the leaving the wife, I miss you ruse. He may have asked her to come out, but she probably resisted at that time.

He said her phone was located in the north-northeast section of the parking lot where there are dumpsters. And as I said, I don't believe she left her home at that hour and drove to the parking lot of the restaurant to the dumpster area to think about her SM situation.

 

[TTF14]

He said her phone was located in the north-northeast section of the parking lot where there are dumpsters. And as I said, I don't believe she left her home at that hour and drove to the parking lot of the restaurant to the dumpster area to think about her SM situation.

Absolutely not. It was a designated meeting spot.

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