Sentencing and beyond- JA General Discussion #7

[RickshawFan]

Thing is, we know that the tile cleaner was assembled and chairs from the dining room put on the living room sofa sometime after both Zach and Enrique left in the morning, and before Enrique returned around 6pm.

I don't think the LE report is clear about whether Zach saw the cleaner out, etc. when he returned at 3, or later, when he returned a second time later in the evening, well past Enrique's return.

I wish we knew for sure that Zach saw those things at 3- would help figure out the timeline. But.....one bottom line is that Travis did begin to clean downstairs on the day of June 4.

Either he began cleaning when she was there, he began cleaning before he knew she was there, or he began cleaning after he thought she'd left.

No matter which version, none matches the tale the wanted to tell of that day, of TA staying up all night for her, of sex shortly after they woke up, of hanging out and trying to look at photos documenting their glorious shared days of travelling together, and then his cute objections, quickly overcome, to being photographed, nude, trusting, and defenseless in the shower.

The fact Travis put together his new floor tile cleaner, a task he had put off for weeks, and began cleaning downstairs, screams of different version of events she wouldn't want known, including....he was so so so done with her and just wanted her to get out, to go away, to move on, to leave him in peace.

Bottom line: he'd rather assemble a machine and wash a floor than spend time with .

 

[pocketaccent]

It makes 100% sense. No one stores thumb drives in their linen closet, especially a neat freak.

Maybe stored the gun, knife and other stuff in there and not the clothes closet. The pin drive fell out of a pocket.

His linen closet doesn't look neat and looks disturbed when compared to his walk-in closet.

You may be right. She hid the gun and the knife under that blanket towel looking thing. The linen closet is right in front of the shower too, so easy to grab the gun or knife.

 

[pocketaccent]

Tidbits from the full transcript of LE's interview (not Flores) with Dallin, Michelle L's boyfriend:

1. NAPOLEON: On the night his friends found Travis dead in the shower, the doggie gate was still in place where the had left it, or it had been put back up by Enrique or Zach after the 4th, perhaps because Napoleon was insistent about getting into TA's room. The gate was in place between the 2 and 3rd stair of the steps going upstairs to TA's room. Napoleon could not go upstairs.

One of TA's friends rang his doorbell that night he was found. Napoleon immediately began barking and didn't stop, and acted "crazy" after friends entered the house. Michelle thought to get Napoleon out too after Mimi called 911 and LE told her that everyone needed to get out of the house.

Napoleon could barely be kept restrained when outside. He wanted to go back into the house.

2. Dallin noticed tile cleaner attachments on a coffee table in TA's living room.
-----

From Enrique's initial interview (not with Flores). He said he returned home at 6:15 on the day Travis was found, was downstairs for a few minutes, then went up to his room and watched TV. He went to Temple around 7:30pm. (Helpful somewhat if he was a man of routine, and kept same schedule on June 4).

This is so incredibly sad. About Nap. wow...
I hope Nap doesn't have any memory of that week. :tears:

 

[geevee]

I don't recall what actual day the Flickr acct was opened(iirc we had once thought we knew it...) and all it says now is June 2008. Anyway, if she had got to Mesa early, could she have gone to the Freeman's first... snuck in and got her "stuff" from there, then went to TA's? Did Dan ever testify about her having spent time on their pc or would it have been his brother Joshua that would have known that? I still wonder if she had anything to do with his suicide the day of her arrest.... she destroys anything she touches.

Anyway, could it have been early on the 4th when the account was made and the pics uploaded, and that's why the CDs were laying out? I just can't get her comments about how the Freeman's house layout was the same as TA's and that she'd either forgotten some CDs there or had made them there. All of the Flickr pics, even the 2005 one, had been modified with "Adobe Photoshop CS2 Windows" software so I have little doubt it was her handiwork, perhaps she had planned to post the shower pics online too. Heck, for all we know she did in some obscure little site.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/27308599@N07/with/2547017803/

IIRC I believe the Flickr account was opened earlier that night on the 2nd, and the pics were uploaded that night going into early morning the 3rd (between 11:00 p.m. and 1:00 or 2:00 a.m.), it used to give that info on a More Info (or similar) link but they must have taken it out in a redesign as I haven't been able to find it again. But I do recall the account being opened and the pics added occurred within an hour or so of each other.

 

[Hope4More]

Dallin only met TA briefly, once when TA threw a joint bday party for Michelle L. As he told LE, what he knew about TA came from others, primarily his GF Michelle.

Third hand then, Dallin on TA, via Michelle-

-that he could be "overly dramatic" about things.

- that even when he expressed that he was sad or upset, he'd never leave the conversation there, would insist on telling or hearing something funny or uplifting, to "balance" out the negative.

- that TA was consistently "brutally honest" with people, but that his bluntness was more than compensated for by being such a thoroughly "nice guy."

--that the main reason why Lisa was so hurt by his breaking it off with her was thst TA never explained to her why he did. Dallin said the (gossip basically, more than just from Michelle) was that Travis didn't want to go into marriage carrying the debt he had then...ie, financial difficulties, but that he was too proud to tell Lisa that.

--that TA was never comfortable around Mimi, and thought he'd made a mistake in asking her to Cancun.

 

[pocketaccent]

That, or she was afraid the laptop forensics wouldn't show any CD being opened and was just trying to make excuses for why the disc was there at all.

TxJan1971's transcript
29:19
JA: Yes, we had sex a couple of times. Once was in his bed and once was again downstairs in his office. He was looking at some pictures that I had brought for him, but he has a virus on his computer, so when he clicked the Start menu on Windows XP or Windows 2000 or whatever, you have like My Pictures, My Music, My Computer. You can usually click on My Computer and then go into the disc drive and open that. He clicked the Windows and it come up and none of that My Pictures, My Music, none of that would come up, so he had some kind of virus he was dealing with. His screensaver was a bunch of little bugs eating up the screen. It was just weird, and he said that is from the virus, too. I said, “That’s a cute screensaver,” and he said, “Yeah, it’s my stupid virus.” For some reason, that was frustrating for both of us, because we couldn’t look at the pictures, and they were from a lot of our church history trips which are on my other external drive which I haven’t been able to access for a long time, since after Christmas, because it just quit, and I just haven’t had the money to spend to get all that stuff back.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
She was supposed to say 'He was going to look at some pictures that I brought for him....'

She caught herself when she said 'he was looking at some pictures...' then went on to say they couldn't look at the pictures because of the virus and also because she couldn't get them from her broken external drive.
She just kept on lying without even realizing none made any sense at all.

 

[Hope4More]

IIRC I believe the Flickr account was opened earlier that night on the 2nd, and the pics were uploaded that night going into early morning the 3rd (between 11:00 p.m. and 1:00 or 2:00 a.m.), it used to give that info on a More Info (or similar) link but they must have taken it out in a redesign as I haven't been able to find it again. But I do recall the account being opened and the pics added occurred within an hour or so of each other.

IIRC, the acct was opened (at least that) at a time the night of June 2nd that conflicted with the 's story of eating out with MM and his friend, then impressing everyone at a karaoke bar with her singing.

The opening (or upload) couldn't be definitively proven NOT to have been done by Travis in terms of the timeframe for June 2, because he stopped texting that night around 11:30pm, before the acct was opened or photos were uploaded or both, can't remember. There's nothing in his text msgs for June 1-3 about working on photos or his blog.

He spent almost all day June 2 rallying folks to vote for Mimi (for justice of the peace office), including doing FaceBook blasts the no doubt peeped.

---

I don't see the notation all the photos were photoshopped, and with the same program. Is that for sure? Because the photos were taken with 3 different cameras. Only one of those, the Canon, i think belonged to her.

"Trav's Rocky's" from 2005 I'd wager was taken by Deanna. Trav was her pet name for him, and 2005 speaks for itself as not taken by .

The October 2007 photos in Zion...Different camera, a Sony, and I don't think she went on that trip. Given that TA's family used one of those photos for the cover of TA's book, I find it impossible to believe the took those photos either.

One possibility is that TA sent her photos to be photoshopped and asked her to also include on a CD specific photos she'd taken that he didn't have (maybe that is the request they spat about in mid- April).

 

[RickshawFan]

His linen closet doesn't look neat and looks disturbed when compared to his walk-in closet.

You may be right. She hid the gun and the knife under that blanket towel looking thing. The linen closet is right in front of the shower too, so easy to grab the gun or knife.

View attachment 100308

Yes there. JM knew she was lying about the clothes closet because a) it was too tidy; b) she couldn't reach the top shelf and c) if she had stepped on a shelf, it would have tipped or collapsed. I think JM just needed to make it plain that she was lying about the whole closet chase, but he didn't need to establish where she did, in fact, keep the weapons or clothes; they just weren't where she said they were. She probably changed her clothes in the downstairs bathroom and went down there with nothing on. She could have removed TA's towels from the master bathroom and then said something like "Let me find you a towel" while she was taking photos, so she'd have an excuse to go into the linen closet. The gun and/or knife was in there behind the towels.

 

[Hope4More]

I rewatched DBrewer's testimony listening for something else, and caught 2 things I don't remember hearing before, one relating to her appeals (a big hearty LOL on that one), the other about the morning of June 3.

About appeals, since it seems her attorneys might be preparing to argue due process was denied because of excessive trial publicity:

JM asked Brewer about a conversation he had with the after her 48 Hours interview, during which she told Brewer she WANTED as much publicity as possible because publicity meant $$$$ for her (from fans).

Does it get any better than that? The same greed for attention and money that helped convict her will also help ensure her convinction and sentence stick. Lol, lol, lol!

What I also don't remember hearing is JM's question to Brewer-- "and you saw MM that morning too, right? (June 3). Brewer said no, JM didn't follow up. All his questions in that part of his cross were based on the DT's investigator's notes. JM seemed to be dropping little bombs, one after another.

Interesting, though, the possibility the may not have finished with MM yet that morning. She went to DB's around 7AM, used his computer, sold him stolen goods for cash (IMO), and didn't linger. She didn't return to DB with the remote until 10AM.

She made her bank deposits around 10:15, and didn't leave the general Monterey (MM area) and Salinas until the afternoon. Lots of time in there to do whatever with MM.

(Fwiw....the 1st of 2 identical texts sent by the same unidentified person to Travis asking if he had a room available was sent at 8:17am on June 3. The second was sent on June 4 exactly at 4pm).

 

[RickshawFan]

TxJan1971's transcript
29:19
JA: Yes, we had sex a couple of times. Once was in his bed and once was again downstairs in his office. He was looking at some pictures that I had brought for him, but he has a virus on his computer, so when he clicked the Start menu on Windows XP or Windows 2000 or whatever, you have like My Pictures, My Music, My Computer. You can usually click on My Computer and then go into the disc drive and open that. He clicked the Windows and it come up and none of that My Pictures, My Music, none of that would come up, so he had some kind of virus he was dealing with. His screensaver was a bunch of little bugs eating up the screen. It was just weird, and he said that is from the virus, too. I said, “That’s a cute screensaver,” and he said, “Yeah, it’s my stupid virus.” For some reason, that was frustrating for both of us, because we couldn’t look at the pictures, and they were from a lot of our church history trips which are on my other external drive which I haven’t been able to access for a long time, since after Christmas, because it just quit, and I just haven’t had the money to spend to get all that stuff back.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
She was supposed to say 'He was going to look at some pictures that I brought for him....'

She caught herself when she said 'he was looking at some pictures...' then went on to say they couldn't look at the pictures because of the virus and also because she couldn't get them from her broken external drive.
She just kept on lying without even realizing none made any sense at all.

Great catch.

 

[Val1]

IIRC, the acct was opened (at least that) at a time the night of June 2nd that conflicted with the 's story of eating out with MM and his friend, then impressing everyone at a karaoke bar with her singing.

The opening (or upload) couldn't be definitively proven NOT to have been done by Travis in terms of the timeframe for June 2, because he stopped texting that night around 11:30pm, before the acct was opened or photos were uploaded or both, can't remember. There's nothing in his text msgs for June 1-3 about working on photos or his blog.

He spent almost all day June 2 rallying folks to vote for Mimi (for justice of the peace office), including doing FaceBook blasts the no doubt peeped.

---

I don't see the notation all the photos were photoshopped, and with the same program. Is that for sure? Because the photos were taken with 3 different cameras. Only one of those, the Canon, i think belonged to her.

"Trav's Rocky's" from 2005 I'd wager was taken by Deanna. Trav was her pet name for him, and 2005 speaks for itself as not taken by .

The October 2007 photos in Zion...Different camera, a Sony, and I don't think she went on that trip. Given that TA's family used one of those photos for the cover of TA's book, I find it impossible to believe the took those photos either.

One possibility is that TA sent her photos to be photoshopped and asked her to also include on a CD specific photos she'd taken that he didn't have (maybe that is the request they spat about in mid- April).

From the link, then click on the Exif link for each pic:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/27308599@N07/2547017817/in/photostream/

Trav's Rockys

Rocky Mountain National Park
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Zion Ponder 3 - EF-1

Zion National Park
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Ponder Bryce - EF

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Cumbres & Toltec RR

Cumbres Toltec Railroad
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Balloon Fiesta (3)

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Grand Canyon

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[Val1]

TxJan1971's transcript
29:19
JA: Yes, we had sex a couple of times. Once was in his bed and once was again downstairs in his office. He was looking at some pictures that I had brought for him, but he has a virus on his computer, so when he clicked the Start menu on Windows XP or Windows 2000 or whatever, you have like My Pictures, My Music, My Computer. You can usually click on My Computer and then go into the disc drive and open that. He clicked the Windows and it come up and none of that My Pictures, My Music, none of that would come up, so he had some kind of virus he was dealing with. His screensaver was a bunch of little bugs eating up the screen. It was just weird, and he said that is from the virus, too. I said, &#8220;That&#8217;s a cute screensaver,&#8221; and he said, &#8220;Yeah, it&#8217;s my stupid virus.&#8221; For some reason, that was frustrating for both of us, because we couldn&#8217;t look at the pictures, and they were from a lot of our church history trips which are on my other external drive which I haven&#8217;t been able to access for a long time, since after Christmas, because it just quit, and I just haven&#8217;t had the money to spend to get all that stuff back.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
She was supposed to say 'He was going to look at some pictures that I brought for him....'

She caught herself when she said 'he was looking at some pictures...' then went on to say they couldn't look at the pictures because of the virus and also because she couldn't get them from her broken external drive.
She just kept on lying without even realizing none made any sense at all.

Lol, I thought she had considered herself a grammar goddess ... present tense for the virus?

 

[Val1]

I rewatched DBrewer's testimony listening for something else, and caught 2 things I don't remember hearing before, one relating to her appeals (a big hearty LOL on that one), the other about the morning of June 3.

About appeals, since it seems her attorneys might be preparing to argue due process was denied because of excessive trial publicity:

JM asked Brewer about a conversation he had with the after her 48 Hours interview, during which she told Brewer she WANTED as much publicity as possible because publicity meant $$$$ for her (from fans).

Does it get any better than that? The same greed for attention and money that helped convict her will also help ensure her convinction and sentence stick. Lol, lol, lol!

What I also don't remember hearing is JM's question to Brewer-- "and you saw MM that morning too, right? (June 3). Brewer said no, JM didn't follow up. All his questions in that part of his cross were based on the DT's investigator's notes. JM seemed to be dropping little bombs, one after another.

Interesting, though, the possibility the may not have finished with MM yet that morning. She went to DB's around 7AM, used his computer, sold him stolen goods for cash (IMO), and didn't linger. She didn't return to DB with the remote until 10AM.

She made her bank deposits around 10:15, and didn't leave the general Monterey (MM area) and Salinas until the afternoon. Lots of time in there to do whatever with MM.

(Fwiw....the 1st of 2 identical texts sent by the same unidentified person to Travis asking if he had a room available was sent at 8:17am on June 3. The second was sent on June 4 exactly at 4pm).

Iirc there had been something about how her and MM had taken DB's son to school that morning, then her banking... I had thought it had included taking him for breakfast to McD's too... though I don't recall the circumstances of that as clearly. I'll see if I can find notes or a link..

 

[Val1]

Iirc there had been something about how her and MM had taken DB's son to school that morning, then her banking... I had thought it had included taking him for breakfast to McD's too... though I don't recall the circumstances of that as clearly. I'll see if I can find notes or a link..

Ugh, can't listen to any more clips for now, though I still find it interesting that she said "we had stopped at San Jose first" @14:00-14:25 when talking about what time she had allegedly arrived at MM's in Monterrey early on June 3rd. So who was with her? This was all before going to DB's for the gas cans.

[video=youtube;ZQY1hwcSpY4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQY1hwcSpY4[/video]

 

[RickshawFan]

From the link, then click on the Exif link for each pic:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/27308599@N07/2547017817/in/photostream/

Trav's Rockys

Rocky Mountain National Park
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Zion Ponder 3 - EF-1

Zion National Park
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Ponder Bryce - EF

Bryce Canyon
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Cumbres & Toltec RR

Cumbres Toltec Railroad
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Balloon Fiesta (3)

Albuquerque Ballon Fiesta
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Grand Canyon

The Grand Canyon
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didn't go on that Grand Canyon trip: see date.

 

[RickshawFan]

From the link, then click on the Exif link for each pic:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/27308599@N07/2547017817/in/photostream/

Trav's Rockys

Rocky Mountain National Park
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Exif Version - 0220
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Zion Ponder 3 - EF-1

Zion National Park
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Taken on October 8, 2007
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Sony DSC-W7(Media Type:Memory Stick)
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Date and Time (Modified) - 2007:10:12 01:15:15
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Ponder Bryce - EF

Bryce Canyon
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Taken on October 5, 2007
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Sony DSC-W7(Media Type:Memory Stick)
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Cumbres & Toltec RR

Cumbres Toltec Railroad
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Taken on October 13, 2007
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Date and Time (Modified) - 2007:11:04 22:50:22
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Balloon Fiesta (3)

Albuquerque Ballon Fiesta
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Taken on October 14, 2007
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Grand Canyon

The Grand Canyon
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Taken on April 27, 2007
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Date and Time (Modified) - 2007:10:06 21:12:31
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didn't go on that Grand Canyon trip: see date. They went in fall, right?

 

[RickshawFan]

Lol, I thought she had considered herself a grammar goddess ... present tense for the virus?

Yes, at least two of those tenses are made up.

 

[Hope4More]

Ugh, can't listen to any more clips for now, though I still find it interesting that she said "we had stopped at San Jose first" @14:00-14:25 when talking about what time she had allegedly arrived at MM's in Monterrey early on June 3rd. So who was with her? This was all before going to DB's for the gas cans.

[video=youtube;ZQY1hwcSpY4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQY1hwcSpY4[/video]

Thank you for looking. For whatever reason, I have no memory of ever hearing that she and Matt may have been together that morning. If true, it sure does emphasize how perfunctory her trip to DB's was. So much for her (lol) deep connection with DB's son, or her manifesto babble that DB was the love of her life. She just wanted to use him, for money and gas cans.

And to check her emails on his computer, at 7AM. Even though she had her laptop with her. And had just spent the night at Matt's house, who owned at least one computer. And even though it would seem Matt came with her to Brewer's house, and she may well have returned to MM's house after her first trip to Brewer's. Or was Matt with her when she went back at 10AM to drop off the remote?

Hinky, all the way around.

 

[Hope4More]

Non sequitur, about his stolen journals etc., that I noticed while skimming through her journals and their texts, looking for mentions of her computer, external drives, or photos and CD's.


All on the same day, April 23, 2008:

They speak by phone, TA responded to her request for support. She texts him thanks at 11:50AM.

TA replies at 11:54, tells her she's in a transitional spot, and the difference between stumbling blocks.....

At 12:25 PM, Travis texts her that he just noticed that in addition to the " first journal that I lost," a second one is missing, and that the 2 contain all their time together. He literally begs for their return.

(btw- she almost certainly read the only journal of TA's we've seen, as she wrote a goodbye in it to Travis; TA had written before her goodbye that his journal was lost, and that he was upset because it contained all the time he had with LISA, not the ).

The didn't reply. TA texted her at 3:33PM, saying that. She waited another hour before replying with her passive aggressive, twisted "please know that I'm very sorry about your loss," etc.

Relevant, maybe, to June 4? She also told him "I guess it's possible they could still turn up. Mine haven't after all these years, but who knows?"

TA doesn't reply.

The waits for about an hour, then sends him a little burst of texts, including, at 5:40pm: "haha, I was checking my domains and forgot I have powertease.com."

No reply.

At 6:12pm she texted: " omigosh I forwarded a cool email. No it's not junk. check it out. I need ideas! "

TA replied at 6:28pm -. that he would check out the email later, but..the wanted to talk with her about buying a camera.......

(April 18 is when she told him she wanted to redo the shaving photos and promised him his CD's, April 20 is when Mimi agreed to go out on a date, TA felt optimistic she might be interested, and he texted friends that he had decided to ask her to go to Cancun; the 20th is also when TA supposedly texted her, in the middle of excited texting about Mimi, that he'd left her a message on her MySpace that he was at a club and reached the conclusion she was the prettiest, yada yada.).

(Btw, both the powertease domain and her urging him to open up a not - junk email texts were traps, IMO)

 

[geevee]

Didn't he buy the camera on April 23rd, or wasn't it until the 24th?