The Case of JonBenet Ramsey-CBS Sept. 18 # 3

[s(he) be(lie)ve(d)]

Colorado First-Degree Murder Statute

http://statelaws.findlaw.com/colorado-law/colorado-first-degree-murder.html

Colorado Revised Statutes Sections 18-3-102: Murder in the First Degree and 18-30-107: First Degree Murder of a Peace Officer or Fireman

Colorado prohibits murder in the first degree, which is any of the following types of killings:

• A deliberate, intentional killing of another
• Causing a death of anyone (besides a criminal participant) while committing, attempting, or fleeing the scene of arson, robbery, burglary, kidnapping, sexual assault, sexual assault of a child, or escape from lawful custody (sometimes called felony murder)
• By causing an innocent person to be convicted and executed due to perjuryor persuading another to perjure
• Causing someone’s death by knowingly engaging in conduct that creates a serious risk of death, because of an attitude of malice and extreme indifference to the value of human life (sometimes called depraved heart murder)
• Causing a child under 18 to die from drug use after illegally selling or dispensing a controlled substance to him or her on school grounds (seespecial offender statute)
• Killing a child under 12 years old when the person was in a position of trust with the victim (abusing a child to death)

Penalty

Crimes in Colorado are divided by class. Class 1 felonies are at the top, murder in the first degree is a Class 1 felony. Class 1 felonies can be punished by at a minimum, life imprisonment, and at a maximum, the death penalty.

Defenses

Some defenses to first-degree murder are common to other cases, such as innocence, self-defense, or insanity. The best strategy depends on the circumstances of the case. For example, intoxication may get rid of the state of mind needed for first degree murder, but the killing could still be second degree murder or manslaughter.
There’s a specific defense in the law for felony murder, when the defendant was charged with first degree murder for a death caused while committing or attempting a violent felony. The defendant isn’t consider responsible for the death if all of the following apply:

• The defendant wasn’t the only participant
• Didn’t commit or aid the killing
• Wasn’t armed with a deadly weapon
• Had no reason to believe the other criminal was armed
• Didn’t intend to cause death or serious physical injury, and
• Tried to leave the crime after realizing the other criminal(s) had weapons or intended to kill

Civil Case

The victim’s family can sue the defendant for wrongful death, even if he or she wasn’t convicted of a homicide crime. This happened to O.J. Simpson, who wasn't convicted
of murdering his estranged wife or her friend, but lost his wrongful death lawsuit. This is possible as civil cases have a lower standard of proof of preponderance of the evidence (basically more likely than not) instead of the criminal case standard of beyond a reasonable doubt.

If you've been served legal papers for a wrongful death, it’s important to immediately consult with an experienced personal injury defense attorney[/TD]

 

[johnjay]

It seems obvious to me that she was dragged by her arms, most likely her wrists, into the WC and left.

Ohhhhhhhh, dragged by the arms - yes that makes sense - thanks! I couldn't visualize how that happened.

They were in the WC, BR was opening gifts to peak inside, JBR said "I'm telling" and started to leave, BR yanked her by her shirt collar, her shoulder brushed against the wall, he smacked her over the head with the flashlight and then pushed her away from himself, she collapsed unconscious, her bladder released and then he dragged her back into the WC by her wrists.

The basement was cold, he calmed down after a while, he could tell she was still breathing and he felt some remorse (or fear of being punished for what he had done) so he fetched her a blanket and a clean nightie. He poked her a few times because she just wouldn't wake up and then covered her and left her behind the latched door. PR heard something and went to check on the kids, discovered JBR not in her bed and BR told her of the 'accident'.

The hysterical staging began with shoelaces and tape from PR's jacket. Then the RN was written as PR willed herself to remain steady in crisis.

The rest is history.

MHO

I can buy that, it makes more sense to me than Burke carrying her down the stairs. Kolar seemed so sure ... I wonder if he would change his mind if he participated in the forum.

 

[Userid]

Well, yes. In my theory, the cord on the wrists and the duct tape are part of the staging; and the papoosing, placement, and favorite nightie are part of the undoing; possibly all done by only one parent, PR. Why? To cover up and to build the IDI story.

I agree with this, but to a point.

I agree that the bindings and the duct tape were simply used for staging. Why? Because the staging is beyond amateur. For example, if JBR's hands were bound and her mouth duct taped, she could have simply removed the duct tape with her wrists still bound, because her hands were "tied" in front of her, not behind. Some will stay the strangulation would still silence her, and that maybe she did remove it, but then that would mean that the killer went out of his/her way to re-tape her mouth after death -- there would be zero reason for the killer to do this, even if you want to believe the intruder/killer was staging the body.

I read on the candyrose website that the nightie was in the dryer with the blanket immediately before it was found with JBR. The maid knew it was there, and confirmed that the only other person who would have known that both could be found in the dryer was PR. Basically, PR grabbed the blanket out of the dryer in a panic/hurry and the nightie simply "clung" to the blanket. I don't think it was there for any particular staging element; it simply clung to the blanket (which was used for the staging). Why that particular blanket is anyone's guess.

 

[Userid]

Question: do we know if there were even any abrasions around the bindings on the wrists? What color was the flesh immediately around the bindings? If it was yellow, that would mean she was already close to death once they were applied; if it was purple or darker (redish), that would mean her blood was still flowing and she was very much alive before they were applied......right?

 

[CoreyRocks]

I agree with this, but to a point.

I agree that the bindings and the duct tape were simply used for staging. Why? Because the staging is beyond amateur. For example, if JBR's hands were bound and her mouth duct taped, she could have simply removed the duct tape with her wrists still bound, because her hands were "tied" in front of her, not behind. Some will stay the strangulation would still silence her, and that maybe she did remove it, but then that would mean that the killer went out of his/her way to re-tape her mouth after death -- there would be zero reason for the killer to do this, even if you want to believe the intruder/killer was staging the body.

I read on the candyrose website that the nightie was in the dryer with the blanket immediately before it was found with JBR. The maid knew it was there, and confirmed that the only other person who would have known that both could be found in the dryer was PR. Basically, PR grabbed the blanket out of the dryer in a panic/hurry and the nightie simply "clung" to the blanket. I don't think it was there for any particular staging element; it simply clung to the blanket (which was used for the staging). Why that particular blanket is anyone's guess.

I had read somewhere here that the tape was put on to just hold her mouth closed. It had fallen open and during the staging of making her comfortable (seriously she was already deceased she wasn't really in there anymore) they closed her mouth, kept her warm in a blanket with her favorite nightgown and holiday barbie doll nearby. Moo.

 

[Annapurna]

Question: do we know if there were even any abrasions around the bindings on the wrists? What color was the flesh immediately around the bindings? If it was yellow, that would mean she was already close to death once they were applied; if it was purple or darker (redish), that would mean her blood was still flowing and she was very much alive before they were applied......right?

There were no abrasions, no bruising, nothing on her wrists. The bindings were very loose, the one remaining when photos were taken later (JR claiming to have "untied", really just slipping off, the other one) was tied over her sleeves. If it was tied over the sleeves it would be easily wiggled out of by her were she conscious.


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[ukrberserker23]

I have a crazy question and thought. What if the urine in the basement was BR's instead of JBR's? Maybe he whizzed on her for spite after he knocked her out with the flashlight. I would guess that her bladder would let go right after the head blow, but some of you think different. Every new piece of evidence changes the sequence of events. I never read anywhere of a DNA test being done on the urine. Even the urine stains on JBR'S clothes. I believe BR did most of it, but PR or JR may have finished her off. Just 3 amateurs getting away with murder.

 

[Userid]

I had read somewhere here that the tape was put on to just hold her mouth closed. It had fallen open and during the staging of making her comfortable (seriously she was already deceased she wasn't really in there anymore) they closed her mouth, kept her warm in a blanket with her favorite nightgown and holiday barbie doll nearby. Moo.

Such a shame to think about it. I suppose that's possible. To me, the blanket was used to express remorse about the killing -- there was still a need for the parent(s) to nurture the poor girl even after she was murdered. JMO.

 

[Userid]

There were no abrasions, no bruising, nothing on her wrists. The bindings were very loose, the one remaining when photos were taken later (JR claiming to have "untied", really just slipping off, the other one) was tied over her sleeves. If it was tied over the sleeves it would be easily wiggled out of by her were she conscious.


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Thank you for your response. Wow, I can't believe there was no marks at all and that the bindings were tied this loosely. If that alone doesn't scream "staging" I don't know what does.

 

[Userid]

One thing that IDI's always bring up is, the fact that the nylon used to bind and make the garrotte was never recovered from the house, meaning it was brought in -- same as the duct tape. What are people's thoughts about that? I don't know about the nylon strings but I do remember hearing something about the framed picture tha hung in JBR's bedrroom, and that a detective had an ESP-like episode that told him to look behind the picture, and he found that there was tape on the back of the frame that matched the duct tape that was found on JBR -- is that accurate?

 

[Heymom]

One thing that IDI's always bring up is, the fact that the nylon used to bind and make the garrotte was never recovered from the house, meaning it was brought in -- same as the duct tape. What are people's thoughts about that? I don't know about the nylon strings but I do remember hearing something about the framed picture tha hung in JBR's bedrroom, and that a detective had an ESP-like episode that told him to look behind the picture, and he found that there was tape on the back of the frame that matched the duct tape that was found on JBR -- is that accurate?

The Ramseys left the house without being searched. The cord could easily have been in Patsy's purse, or John's briefcase, or whatever jackets they wore out. Sure the Foreign Faction took the cord and duct tape when they left but forgot to take JonBenet...even dead, she was worth money to them b/c her parents wouldn't have known she was dead before getting the money.

Yet another blind alley to run down thanks to the Ramsey attorneys.

 

[TeaTime]

I think the cord is nothing more than shoelaces with the nibs cut off and there was nothing to throw away.

I think the tape came off of PR's jacket which she had repaired using black tape. I read about the tape in one of the books in which the matching jackets owned by PW and PR were discussed and have remembered it because PR tried to wear PW's home one night, instead of her own damaged one. I thought "wow! That is so PR!"

 

[PositiveLight]

I think the cord is nothing more than shoelaces with the nibs cut off and there was nothing to throw away.

I think the tape came off of PR's jacket which she had repaired using black tape. I read about the tape in one of the books in which the matching jackets owned by PW and PR were discussed and have remembered it because PR tried to wear PW's home one night, instead of her own damaged one. I thought "wow! That is so PR!"

Huh! This would explain why her sweater fibers were on the tape!

 

[Annapurna]

One thing that IDI's always bring up is, the fact that the nylon used to bind and make the garrotte was never recovered from the house, meaning it was brought in -- same as the duct tape. What are people's thoughts about that? I don't know about the nylon strings but I do remember hearing something about the framed picture tha hung in JBR's bedrroom, and that a detective had an ESP-like episode that told him to look behind the picture, and he found that there was tape on the back of the frame that matched the duct tape that was found on JBR -- is that accurate?

I'm not sure about the detective/picture story, but I think it is likely that the cord was used up. There wasn't more to find. One of the ends is heat sealed (on the paintbrush). It seems probable that the cord was used for some project and then the remainder used in the crime. I think that explains the wrist bindings. There was like 15" between her wrists. There was another 17 inches between her neck and the brush (not including the bit in the knots). I know some suspect they could be shoelaces, I'm not totally convinced.


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[TexMex]

I thought it was established the cord was Stansport utility brand..

 

[CorallaroC]

matching cord was found (early on, by BPD detectives) at McGuckins hardware in Boulder as well as a nearly-matching cc receipt of PR purchase a few weeks earlier. Stanport brand? the info is here on JBR thread somewhere. I just can't remember how many feet those packages contained. Anyone recall, or have the WS link handy? We even have photos of the packaged cord same brand, near to the date of the murder.

 

[Heymom]

I think the cord is nothing more than shoelaces with the nibs cut off and there was nothing to throw away.

I think the tape came off of PR's jacket which she had repaired using black tape. I read about the tape in one of the books in which the matching jackets owned by PW and PR were discussed and have remembered it because PR tried to wear PW's home one night, instead of her own damaged one. I thought "wow! That is so PR!"

It's not shoelaces. It's white cording that comes in smallish packages, maybe 40"? It doesn't come in a roll.

 

[flourish]

OT, but reminds me of the duct tape and Caylee Anthony. To this day, and likely forever more, I scan duct tape for logos. I'll never see "Henkel" without thinking about injustice. Sigh. Poor little girls both with tape on their mouths and unpunished murderers and more posed photos than those with genuine spontaneous smiles.

 

[Heymom]

View attachment 103253

I thought it was established the cord was Stansport utility brand..

Yes, that's the same cording.

 

[PositiveLight]

OT, but reminds me of the duct tape and Caylee Anthony. To this day, and likely forever more, I scan duct tape for logos. I'll never see "Henkel" without thinking about injustice. Sigh. Poor little girls both with tape on their mouths and unpunished murderers and more posed photos than those with genuine spontaneous smiles.

Hey Flourish!! *Waves* yeah I look at duct tape the same way now. Both precious children who died terrible deaths and was thrown away like trash.

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