CBS - 48 Hours - Buried Truth episode 12 November 2016 - 9pm central

[PositiveLight]

Great theories. I wonder how we got two stories, one tries to return, and the other it was stolen. We know TK lies, so whatever he says is to manipulate, gain sympathy or for financial gain, or as we found out murder. So he buys the bike and it's clear he has no idea what he is buying. Good natured ribbing maybe, or just lots of concern by the pro's that he should consider a lesser bike. He wrecks it a few times, and either lies to mom that they would not take bike back, or they told him, its a wrecked bike and we cannot accept it. He arranges for the bike to be "stolen" and collects insurance or has the lien paid off. Maybe he just hid the bike. Or maybe he just tells the bike got stolen story to mom. The customer who saw him in the store that day never reports seeing any tension. TK is just shopping for a bike. This is what has me confused. Did he buy a bike or not, and whatever happened to it? You would think there would be a stolen bike report somewhere. So i think neither story is completely true. I think he told his mommy years before that he killed them because they made fun of him. The details faded until he refreshed her memory. Maybe he told one story back in 2003 and forgot that lie when he confessed to the sheriff. I think something else happened that day, and he was in the process of committing a crime at the store. Fraud maybe, something. As his mom said when she explained away the kidnapping. What could he do because K would tell the police about shooting Charlie. So he shot those 4 because there was the threat of prison for whatever he was up to. Find me his police report for his stolen bike and maybe i will change my mind. As mom said, what could he do? He had to do it.

I was curious about the same thing!
You explained exactly my thoughts!

 

[PositiveLight]

Re-watching part of the broadcast and this is a direct quote from RT that gave me chills when I first heard it:

"I set everything up so that he could be a productive part of our city, and that he could enjoy the rest of his life and do what he loved doing."

CHILLS.
Exactly WHAT did he love doing Mother? He had been in prison 15 years.... how did he even have a clue what he enjoyed? Or how did SHE know what he enjoyed?
I have a scary feeling mother covered up a lot of earlier crimes that he committed when he was young. She finally got scared enough to send him to his dad's. Obviously she knew he was capable of murder..... otherwise why lock him in his room and lock her own doors?
I need to figure out where exactly he lived growing up before his crime that got him arrested.
I wouldn't be surprised to find very young kids missing or found dead near where he grew up. This monster started early.

 

[PositiveLight]

There was previous discussion here as to whether or not there was any AC given how hot it would have been when she was abducted. I haven't seen any confirmation, but I would guess not. He didn't really care if she survived or not. But RT in normal fashion jumps to defend how chivalrous TK was to his victims. Like how he walked the girl back to her house after holding a gun to her head and raping her at knife point.


https://htv-prod-media.s3.amazonaws.com/files/1987-presentence-investigation-report-1478284242.pdf

Don't forget...
She weathered Hurricane Matthew during her captivity. Can you imagine the horror of hearing that in the container? Plus the heat and humidity after the hurricane. Bless her heart! I pray every day for her healing. I can't even imagine.

 

[PositiveLight]

In my heart and mind, I have been defending mommy. But geez, that interview. Not defending her anymore. Bless her heart, as we say down here.

I think it's clear that all these years of defending little Todd have warped this woman. Imagine being his mother and knowing you're the only person who can try to save the world from him. I have a more or less mentally ill grown daughter. Thank God she doesn't have homicidal tendencies, but it's a struggle every day to keep her employed and from making bad decisions. (Hubby and I also have tried our best to set her up as a productive community member, so I know where that woman is coming from.)

You can blame her all you want, and from that interview, I'm pretty sure she SHOULD share the blame, but I firmly believe "mama tried." I think she was in denial after Super Bike. And I pray that her words were edited unfavorably toward her. (But I don't think so.)

OT - I was trying to watch last night when the tot in my house had the most violent episode of stomach distress ever, all over my husband (and I mean all over). You should've seen me ducking back and forth to the tv trying not to miss a word while trying to clean him up. Sorry that was gross, but you can imagine it was kind of funny afterwards.

I feel you with the tot!
Grandbaby has a virus right now! :scared:

 

[PositiveLight]

I wonder if she either knew or suspected and was too scared to ask. Sounds unthinkable but watching her justify his actions I could imagine them having some kind of pact where she knew about the Superbike murders and he promised that if she didn't go to police he'd never to do it again. Roll on 13 years and he gets caught for another murder and kidnap and knows now that his mother will realise he didn't keep that promise,so first thing he does is request to speak to his mother.

And promise there's no other bodies....
Refresh my memory.... did she know prior to their discussion, that there was possibly 2 other bodies on the property? I can't remember at the moment. :thinking:

 

[PositiveLight]

Yes spelly, that is the full episode

Here are the 2 'Web Extras'

Todd Kohlhepp's mother: "He wasn't a serial killer"
http://www.cbsnews.com/videos/todd-kohlhepps-mother-he-wasnt-a-serial-killer/
(brace yourselves)

The two sides of Todd Kohlhepp
http://www.cbsnews.com/videos/the-two-sides-of-todd-kohlhepp/

OMG.First link.
The interviewer seems dumbfounded! LOL
Anyone in real estate can answer a question for me? How often can someone sell a house a day?... In the market at that time.... Is it just me or was he really selling his mom some BS?
"Easy for him to entertain himself..." no kidding... :banghead:
"They embarrassed him..." OMG :banghead:
WHY in the heck does she tell the story of him hiding from her when he was little? Trying to distract much, mother?
UGH.
"It's not like daily he went out and killed somebody. There was a lot of time between the first ones and the others"
Hey lady... those victims have names. :gaah:
"But he wasn't a serial killer *fake cries* "
OMG. This woman is trying to DEFEND him.
I did catch an earlier ss of her during this video from when he was young. It may not be anything but...
I see a little bit of similarities between his mother and victims.... I almost added the female from the superbike murders but I don't think those killings had the same motivations.
Mods if this photo isn't allowed feel free to remove it. I just found it ..."interesting" once I saw what she looked like as a young mother.

 

[PositiveLight]

I know her statements towards the end of the 1st video are the most shocking, but something else also caught my attention. RT tells a story from TK's childhood about calling the fire department when she couldn't find Todd. It turned out he was hiding in the clothes hamper and he laughed when the firemen found him there. So much I want to say about this little story I don't know where to start. In no particular order:

1. She launches into the "hiding in the clothes hamper" story while reflecting on how she can't believe he killed people. Reporter asks her what she said to TK when she she found out he killed 7 people and she says, "How could you do this? Because I didn't understand. I didn't understand, how in the world this little boy that hid on me one day when he was little in the clothes hamper..." And she tells the story. What was her reason for bringing this up in relation to her not being able to understand his crimes? Is this story meant to show he was harmless? Or that she was clueless? Or she still sees him as mischievous child?

2. While telling the story she mentions she called the fire department because, "Isn't that what all good mothers do?" It's as if the story is being told to illustrate how good a mother she is and not to show anything about Todd. She was responsible and tried to get him help and he just laughed when they found him.

3. Does anyone believe this story actually happened? I wonder if there is record of it anywhere? Maybe it's because I follow too many missing persons cases but I have not read of any missing child case, EVER, where the parent called specifically the FIRE DEPT. They call 911 or they call the police to file a missing report. And when calling about a missing child the first to respond would not be the fire department, would it? And she describes that they showed up "In all their gear." for a missing child? Really?

4. I'm reminded of the 1970's TV show, Emergency where the fire department was portrayed as going out to rescue kittens from trees and other mild things in between the more serious calls for fires and car accidents. But Todd was MISSING, he wasn't stuck in a tree or in a car accident. Why would she call the fire department, specifically, and why would they be the first to respond if she called the general emergency number?
And if a volunteer firefighter DID hear the call on the radio about a missing child and show up first, I highly doubt he would have put on ALL his gear to go find a child. There was NO fire! There was a woman who didn't know where her child was. And firefighter gear is heavy-- it would hinder their searching for the child.

5. IMO, she either embellished this story drastically or made it up out of whole clothe. :moo: I just can't figure out WHY she would make it up, or even tell it at that point in the conversation. What was she trying to portray? I'm baffled by RT's statements and I'm wondering how true any of her stories are now. :scared:

You always catch the things I find curious too!
Makes me wonder if this is where TK got his tall tale story telling from. (Lying basically.)
I agree on everything you mentioned! My same thoughts!

O/T but once my brother caught his head in a spiral staircase between the rails, at a local store. They called the fire dept. They got his head out... without full gear on... and obviously he wasn't missing...... He passed away almost 6 years ago (Thanksgiving is the anniversary) and when I remember these little things it always makes me laugh and smile. Mainly because I was worse than him at getting stuck in things all the time! LOL But I learned it from the master! lol

 

[soanyway]

After reading your post, I had to remind myself that TK would've been 32 years old at the time, not 12. The way RT tells the story, TK is a little boy being forced to ride a bike with no experience in a field of high grass. Of course he fell. He was set up. Then they all laughed at TK, victimizing him even more. I do believe his ego was in play. Recalling that he was 32, is it possible that he had the bike insured, wrecked it, said it was stolen and went to SB to get another, bigger bike? I have to believe TK could have just as easily gone to another bike shop. But he wanted to walk in with something to prove to them. Maybe they doubted the story of the 1st bike being stolen, too.

This is a really smart way of thinking about it Kadoober. I had similar thoughts that maybe all the stories were true but in reverse order of what you have and perhaps a few added parts. My thought was that the order of events went something like this:

1. TK buys a motorcycle, test drives in in the field and falls. The SB employees all laugh in fun.
2. TK leaves with the motorcycle he bought, even though he doesn't know how to ride it
3. TK's mom sees him scraped up from falling in the field and TK tells her about them laughing and says he tried to return the bike but they wouldn't give him his money back (In my scenario this part is a lie, I'll explain why below).
4. The bike gets stolen, TK goes to buy another bike and they joke about, "is this one going to get stolen too?"
5. TK leaves upset that the SB employees laughed at him again, comes back 2 weeks later and shoots them all.
6. TK's mom remembers that the Superbike shop would not allow TK to return a bike and she suspects he shot them for it (Whether she suspects this in 2003 right after it happens or thinks of it in 2016 is up for interpretation)

The reason I think he lied to his mother about trying to return the bike is one word: Ego. Someone with an ego like TK would not have been able to admit to himself and the Superbike employees that he didn't know how to ride and should return the bike. I don't believe he actually tried to return it. That would mean he realized he made a bad purchase decision right away. I think he left with a few bruises or scrapes from falling. I think his mother noticed the scrapes and asked him and when he said he fell off she told him he should return the bike. I think he lied and said they wouldn't take it back. This would fit with his "blame everyone else" mentality in order to get his way. Another reason I think this is that, although they may NOT have been able to take the bike back, a small business like that would offer something else to try to make the customer happy. They were a successful owner-run business and you don't get that way in a small town without being very understanding of your customers. Perhaps the victims' families remember that TK was buying another bike because his bike was stolen. Perhaps it was even noted somewhere that he was a repeat customer who had been in the shop recently and that is why he was put on the highlighted list.

All this is just my opinion of course. I agree that both stories could be parts of whole story or multiple interactions that led to TK's anger-induced shooting.

 

[jstkiddn]

And promise there's no other bodies....
Refresh my memory.... did she know prior to their discussion, that there was possibly 2 other bodies on the property? I can't remember at the moment. :thinking:

She mentioned a second visit. I seem to remember the second visit was after he had already shown them the 2 grave locations.

 

[soanyway]

I can't even begin to imagine. I think often about the total darkness inside the container. I personally didn't like the references to her being chained like a dog. Who would treat a dog that way? RT said she had a pet store, was she also desensitized by his treatment of animals? Then, as a child, he begins to transfer this abuse to people. Wasn't it reported that KB's dog crate was missing from their apartment? I pray that she is surrounded by loving support and remains strong through her healing.

A neighbor reported that he once locked her son in a dog kennel cage and then rolled him over until her son was crying, according to the records. The woman said Kohlhepp just laughed, a probation officer reported.

http://www.greenvilleonline.com/sto...ng-case-kohlhepp-called-devil-chain/93311850/

Don't forget...
She weathered Hurricane Matthew during her captivity. Can you imagine the horror of hearing that in the container? Plus the heat and humidity after the hurricane. Bless her heart! I pray every day for her healing. I can't even imagine.

 

[soanyway]

IIRC, TK failed to tell RT about JC and MC being murdered and buried on the property when he met with before confessing to the SB murders. Maybe he thought she couldn't handle it all at once. But she now says that he's assured her there are no more. Hmmm....

And promise there's no other bodies....
Refresh my memory.... did she know prior to their discussion, that there was possibly 2 other bodies on the property? I can't remember at the moment. :thinking:

 

[soanyway]

I wonder if RT felt betrayed?

She mentioned a second visit. I seem to remember the second visit was after he had already shown them the 2 grave locations.

 

[PositiveLight]

She mentioned a second visit. I seem to remember the second visit was after he had already shown them the 2 grave locations.

Ok thank you! I couldn't remember!

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

 

[PositiveLight]

I can't even begin to imagine. I think often about the total darkness inside the container. I personally didn't like the references to her being chained like a dog. Who would treat a dog that way? RT said she had a pet store, was she also desensitized by his treatment of animals? Then, as a child, he begins to transfer this abuse to people. Wasn't it reported that KB's dog crate was missing from their apartment? I pray that she is surrounded by loving support and remains strong through her healing.


http://www.greenvilleonline.com/sto...ng-case-kohlhepp-called-devil-chain/93311850/

Woah. Wait. She owned a pet store? When????? Holy crap! I did not remember this!
This is jarring to me for some reason. She makes the statement that she had set him up for success doing what he loved to do....
Did she also allow him to take his anger out as a child on innocent pets from the store? What was her statement regarding controlling his anger?
If she did in fact own a pet store when he was young, no one would mention a dog or cat that goes missing from the store. She could simply say it died or was purchased. No one other than employees would even notice. Probably they may have even suspected him and didn't say anything in fear of loosing their job? Just speculating here mind you.
But serial killers start with animals usually. I would almost bet he killed a child before he was arrested for the rape. Let's not forget if that gun hadn't misfired, that victim wouldn't have survived. I almost want to believe he actually intended to kill her. When the gun misfired, he changed up his plans. Maybe he planned on taking the gun he was holding when the LE arrived to return to her home to kill her. Why else would he be holding a gun like that immediately after committing that crime? I also think his daddy may have killed some girls. And he witnessed it. He knew way to much to successfully pull that crime off without a hitch. He was way too confident too in regards to letting her go. I think he rethought it and was heading to kill her when LE arrived. JMOO but that wasn't his first major crime by far. I think we do need to look into young victims before that crime. Ones he could easily control and scare.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

 

[PositiveLight]

Maybe she did call the fire department when TK went missing as a toddler. It would have been pre 911 most likely. Most people would call the police but we aren't talking about Madame Curie here.
Something that has bothered me is the list of customers provided by the family of SP. TK was on it. Did i hear it right, that he was a highlighted customer on the list? Meaning I suppose the family thought he should be checked out? I am not understanding that. The person who left right before the shooting said another man was in the store looking at one of the super bikes and he thought it strange since the man appeared to have little or no knowledge of motorcycles. It is assumed this last customer was TK. We know TK's mom said he was embarrassed at the store because he could not ride well and fell over. So did that happen on an earlier trip to the store? What had he bought before to be on a list and what happened that made him stick out? You would think the police would at least do a background check on the "highlighted" customers. 14 years for a felony kidnapping seems to be a red flag to me. Did i misunderstand the thing about the list?

I keep wondering something.
Why did he buy two motorcycles when he had never rode one and couldn't ride one?
I think this is relevant to his EGO. He loved to brag. Maybe he thought having a motorcycle would attract the females. Like his neighbor said he loved to brag about all the things he could buy with his money.
It is like he was trying to fit a certain profile that he pictured in his mind. A nice home, two nice cars, bunches of guns, bunch of land, motorcycles etc. I think he really thought all of the fluff would bring the girls. But he was very wrong. An empty soul is not attractive no matter what you own. People will see that no matter how hard you try.
The police could have easily stopped his murder streak if they had just followed those leads early on.
A simple background check should have been a massive red flag. Totally agree!
Just the idea that he just thought he could hope on a motorcycle and ride it shows how full of himself he was.
I guess in his mind anyone who embarrassed him should die.
I am still trying to swallow the fact that his mother even SAID that. There is no excuse for taking an innocent person's life. Period.

 

[PositiveLight]

I can't even begin to imagine. I think often about the total darkness inside the container. I personally didn't like the references to her being chained like a dog. Who would treat a dog that way? RT said she had a pet store, was she also desensitized by his treatment of animals? Then, as a child, he begins to transfer this abuse to people. Wasn't it reported that KB's dog crate was missing from their apartment? I pray that she is surrounded by loving support and remains strong through her healing.


http://www.greenvilleonline.com/sto...ng-case-kohlhepp-called-devil-chain/93311850/

Just reading the article so many questions come to my mind.
Personally I don't see him as a devil on a chain. Being on a chain would actually mean someone was monitoring him. No one was. He was left alone all the time and he liked it like that. So I would say he's a devil with a ego.
How old was the kid that he shoved in the dog crate? Same age or younger?
I still think he committed at least one murder on a child before he was arrested the first time.
He was home alone the night he committed the rape. So why use duct tape? Unless the other homes were too close by.
I honestly feel he had seen someone being done like that and he copied what he saw.
I'll just leave it at that.
His dad had "30 girlfriends". Just wondering if some of those didn't make it home alive....
He blamed his dad for his crime also.
When asked what he thought the victim thought, he only spoke of how it effected him. Didn't even acknowledge the victim.
Self absorbed to the highest degree.
Also who the hell did he think he was at 15 telling the cops what he would like to be sentenced as (length wise). WTH?
Can I add that I'm glad he was an only child! I have a feeling if he had siblings they would have "accidently" died.
I DO think his mom more than likely covered up some of his earlier crimes.
I do hope that are investigating any leads prior to his first arrest.
The one "girlfriend" he supposedly had sex with once.... I actually think she was a victim and never came forward. That's very common. Especially during the time when he was young. A lot of victim blaming went on. Still does though really.
I do wonder if he was possibly abused by his step father. Maybe mother ignored it or was just blind to it.
This kid was messed up from birth though I think. I ALMOST wonder if maybe he has a mild form of fetal alcohol syndrome. But back then it wasn't really recognised.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fetal_alcohol_spectrum_disorder
"Those affected are more likely to have trouble in school, legal problems, participate in high-risk behaviors"
​JMOO

 

[Spellbound]

I can't even begin to imagine. I think often about the total darkness inside the container. I personally didn't like the references to her being chained like a dog. Who would treat a dog that way? RT said she had a pet store, was she also desensitized by his treatment of animals? Then, as a child, he begins to transfer this abuse to people. Wasn't it reported that KB's dog crate was missing from their apartment? I pray that she is surrounded by loving support and remains strong through her healing.


http://www.greenvilleonline.com/sto...ng-case-kohlhepp-called-devil-chain/93311850/

Woah. Wait. She owned a pet store? When????? Holy crap! I did not remember this!

snipped by me.

Scroll down the page to Part2 video
@ 5:40 on Part 2 interview with his mother she states she had a pet shop.

http://wspa.com/2016/11/11/kohlhepps-mom-talks-about-his-childhood-anger-rape-kidnapping/

 

[soanyway]

The tidbit about her having TK not being nice to MK's rat, Harry, and RT owning a pet shop is in the raw interview part 2 (about the 5:00 mark). The jail psych evaluation notes notes that the reason he was holding the gun when they located him after the rape was that he had intended to kill himself. IMO, the someone he is referring to that didn't want him to die could only be his mother. And here we are again with the embarrassment apparently passed on to him. Two misfires that night, maybe user error as in the motor bikes. If only he had stayed so inept with firearms.

He indicted that he felt unwanted, undesirable and that the rape may have been not only retaliation for rejecting him but also a mechanism for externalizing his rage. He has had this rage turned back at himself. There have been suicidal ideations. He describes "I hate myself"; feeling very embarrassed for what he did; putting the gun to his head when the police were outside his home and pulling the trigger but he stated "the gun jammed." At this point, he laughed somewhat inappropriately. He stated "Someone doesn't want me to die yet."

http://wspa.com/2016/11/11/kohlhepps-mom-talks-about-his-childhood-anger-rape-kidnapping/
https://htv-prod-media.s3.amazonaws...evaluation-madison-street-jail-1478284254.pdf

Woah. Wait. She owned a pet store? When????? Holy crap! I did not remember this!
This is jarring to me for some reason. She makes the statement that she had set him up for success doing what he loved to do....
Did she also allow him to take his anger out as a child on innocent pets from the store? What was her statement regarding controlling his anger?
If she did in fact own a pet store when he was young, no one would mention a dog or cat that goes missing from the store. She could simply say it died or was purchased. No one other than employees would even notice. Probably they may have even suspected him and didn't say anything in fear of loosing their job? Just speculating here mind you.
But serial killers start with animals usually. I would almost bet he killed a child before he was arrested for the rape. Let's not forget if that gun hadn't misfired, that victim wouldn't have survived. I almost want to believe he actually intended to kill her. When the gun misfired, he changed up his plans. Maybe he planned on taking the gun he was holding when the LE arrived to return to her home to kill her. Why else would he be holding a gun like that immediately after committing that crime? I also think his daddy may have killed some girls. And he witnessed it. He knew way to much to successfully pull that crime off without a hitch. He was way too confident too in regards to letting her go. I think he rethought it and was heading to kill her when LE arrived. JMOO but that wasn't his first major crime by far. I think we do need to look into young victims before that crime. Ones he could easily control and scare.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

 

[soanyway]

Thanks! I should've check the thread before spending forever and a day searching for this video! I knew I had remembered seeing it.

snipped by me.

Scroll down the page to Part2 video
@ 5:40 on Part 2 interview with his mother she states she had a pet shop.

http://wspa.com/2016/11/11/kohlhepps-mom-talks-about-his-childhood-anger-rape-kidnapping/

 

[Gardener1850]

The tidbit about her having TK not being nice to MK's rat, Harry, and RT owning a pet shop is in the raw interview part 2 (about the 5:00 mark). The jail psych evaluation notes notes that the reason he was holding the gun when they located him after the rape was that he had intended to kill himself. IMO, the someone he is referring to that didn't want him to die could only be his mother. And here we are again with the embarrassment apparently passed on to him. Two misfires that night, maybe user error as in the motor bikes. If only he had stayed so inept with firearms.




http://wspa.com/2016/11/11/kohlhepps-mom-talks-about-his-childhood-anger-rape-kidnapping/
https://htv-prod-media.s3.amazonaws...evaluation-madison-street-jail-1478284254.pdf

I think the "Someone didn't want me to die yet" comment is a common euphemism people use to indicate they think God or some higher power kept them from dying. He probably heard it in a movie he watched.