Australia Claremont Serial Killer, 1996-1997, Perth, Western Australia - #8 ARREST*

[Paramau]

I think everyone is definitely overthinking what happened. I think the girls were attacked in a dark place and pulled into his car. Maybe Jane liked the guy (MM) and went willingly. Maybe not. These things (bad decisions) happen in a heartbeat to people not anticipating bad things happening. The only thing that puzzles me is, after Sarah went missing, why the other girls were taken, or not more worried about bad things happening in that vicinity. When you are young you do tend to feel bulletproof, or at least I did. Just be careful what you say on this forum, as Carl O'Callaghan cautioned. Thank god they have finally nabbed him.


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[mandy.maree]

The only way he didnt assault the Claremont victims is if he physically couldn't or was interrupted for some reason imo.
The rapes were what it was all about if he is responsible for the cemetery and home invasion ones. I think he only escalated to murder so there were no witnesses. Much like Adrian Bayley was probably likely to continue doing if he wasnt arrested after Jill Meaghers murder

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[Frankie1972]

The three men who saw CG said she leaned over and had a fair discussion with who we suspect may be the CSK>>> this also indicates its most likely there was only 1 person in the car visible to her, i.e. nobody in the passenger seat or you don't lean over.

If he has a gun or a knife she does not lean into the window and have a discussion, she either instantly follows his orders or runs/screams

It's more likely he said I am headed to perhaps the cottesloe exchange to fix some phone lines, emergency call-out, I can give you a lift.
Cottesloe borders mosman park for a long distance, its a very plausible reasoning.

The thing is.... I am assuming had he gone with the soft approach he MUST have tried this on others girls that said no thanks and then he would drive off.

there was no car that stop that night. CG walked right passed us at the bus stop and right down the road.

 

[mandy.maree]

I think everyone is definitely overthinking what happened. I think the girls were attacked in a dark place and pulled into his car. Maybe Jane liked the guy (MM) and went willingly. Maybe not. These things (bad decisions) happen in a heartbeat to people not anticipating bad things happening. The only thing that puzzles me is, after Sarah went missing, why the other girls were taken, or not more worried about bad things happening in that vicinity. When you are young you do tend to feel bulletproof, or at least I did. Just be careful what you say on this forum, as Carl O'Callaghan cautioned. Thank god they have finally nabbed him.


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I agree.
And I guess because SS wasnt found and they didnt know her fate at the time,it maybe seemed safe to continue going out

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[meticulously]

So back to the kimono - I went and got the paper out of the bin and used a magnifying glass to read the newspaper cutting in this picture

The text says :
"The West Australian, Perth Wednesday Feruary 17 1988
Kimono clue to a brutal killing
by Cyril Ayris
This kimono may be the clue that helps
solve the brutal killing of Victoria Heather
Clark, 30, in Victoria Park last September.
It was dropped by a man that walked
into a Huntingdale house early on Monday
morning and lay on top of a sleeping
18-year-old girl...
The kimono is the first good clue the police
have been given in recent sex attacks in the area.
Det-Sgt Max Kiernan said the man
apparently walked into the house..."

I still don't see what the link is??

Just research ; david masters , who was charged with clarkes murder . And you can then realize how imo guess, the newspaper article attempts to link the two incidents . Ends up being that they were wrong but at the time it was a hopeful lead to capture masters who had killed clarke ,hope this helps.
Thanks for the article , would really like to see that mega story in the "west" newspaper . More is welcomed

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[Alessi]

Thanks for the analysis. When I read it my impression was that he was rather pompous in tone and that he brought up negative points which he blamed on others.
I found his grammar and expression to be rather poor, particularly his misuse of apostrophes and numerous spelling errors which should have been corrected in a document that was going to be published.

Your analysis is much more detailed. Thanks for going to the trouble. You made some pertinent observations.

http://www.blac.asn.au/add_files/club_portal/reports/report2009.pdf

I will have a go at analysing his president's report of 2009.

His style is more theatrical and elaborate than necessary and somewhat smarmy.

He mentions that another club gave him an award so he is not shy at self aggrandisement. He uses the word "I" freely at the beginning and end as though his main interest is in securing his personal standing.

He praises adult officials in a qualified way. For instance he wrote:

" Caroline quickly found her niche "

,which could imply he tried to keep her efforts confined to a narrow interest.

"Indeed we all owe her our gratitude for stepping up to fill a position which has seen her away from her own children all season "

,which could be an attempt for cause her (Caroline) to vacate her "niche" and return to her children because she showed signs of expanding her role at the club. This is consistent with him having few helpers during the course of the season.

He stated:

"our dedicated Short Track Timekeepers"

without mentioning names, which could imply that some were dedicated and some were not.

he then stated of the same timekeepers that:

"The improvement in the time taken to run each event was not obvious at first, but as the season went on and the process was refined the programs did move through faster"

,which means that the "dedicated timekeepers" were slow to catch on, that he monitors the ability of acquaintances to become aware and that he is wary of people with the ability think critically.

He stated that new equipment allowed the club to operate:


"without the need for two video cameras and a team of judges"




,which again shows a desire to dispense with people from club management.

He stated:

"I thank Christine Christie and Noreen Boyd"

,and proceeded to offer fullsome praise of Christine while ignoring Noreen, which implies he much prefers one to the other. He said of Christine:

"when confronted with an obstacle, (she) develop(s) a solution just as quickly"

,which could imply that he, the President, was the obstacle and Christine was easily deflected.

I find this next extract very pertinent:


"In the first half of the season I was so busy on competition days that I rarely had the opportunityto get out and meet the athletes and parents, but as the season went on and the issues were resolved, I found time to sit back and watch the Belmont athletes compete and socialise."

,so having stated his intent to "meet the athletes and parents", he "found time to (only) sit back and watch" so again he kept away from adult inquiry.

His most freely written paragraph which is absent of the controls and qualifiers he uses elsewhere is in regard to the "tiny tots" fun day. Tiny tots have no capacity to inquire his inner thoughts.

His description of the Under 17's athletes as:

"charasmatic"

, shows an interest in them beyond their mere running abilities. It is himself projecting onto their personalities. He then stated of them that:

"you have all performed to the best of your abilities and demonstrated to each and every parent that within each of you there is the potential to be whatever your heart desires"

, which could imply they have no room for improvement and they should follow their "heart(s)", not necessarily confined to athletic pursuits.

He concludes by lamenting the impending resignation of fellow committee members which is probably the result of his management style.

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[JoeDetective]

there was no car that stop that night. CG walked right passed us at the bus stop and right down the road.

So the reenactment on CIA is not accurate?

 

[JoeDetective]

I agree.
And I guess because SS wasnt found and they didnt know her fate at the time,it maybe seemed safe to continue going out

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CG knew about the serial killer, her mother had clearly warned her, and the JR body had been found.

 

[Naccipear]

Well technically it is correct if the bodies are actively decomposed there may be no hard evidence to indicate an assault occurred, but what perhaps they did not say is that there is no indication to say an assault did not happen.
Based on his MO it is highly likely he at the very least attempted assault on all his victims.

<modsnip>I stated that the book purported no sexual assault (or more correctly a direct quote from one of the visiting detectives that advised the Rimmers of Janes discovery. Then went on to state that given the prior assaults and rapes, this was highly unlikely (ie he did rape them) and how could such a statement have been made to the Rimmers given the state of decompensation and length of days (over 50) Jane was left out in the harsh elements.


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[Frankie1972]

So the reenactment on CIA is not accurate?

if a car stop that night we would of seen that

 

[Naccipear]

Did she actually say they weren't sexually assaulted or that there was no evidence of sexual assault?
Because the latter I understand. The former I doubt could be proven for fact considering some time had passed before they were found.

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Page 35 (last paragraph) & page 36 (first paragraph). It wasn't the author that stated it didn't appear Jane was sexually assaulted but the Police. "As far as they can tell" which would be difficult given the state that the author described the body being in.


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[YoureNicked]

Yeah I don't think he would have tapped a phone box.
I haven't heard about the Lakeway Drive-In attack, do you have a link or more information you can PM me?

See this article from the Post newspaper: https://www.scribd.com/doc/289515831/POST-Newspaper-for-14th-of-November-2015

 

[Alessi]

Well that certainly is curious. Another person is still serving time for the murder of Victoria Clark. That particular perpetrator also killed another woman in another state.

I wonder if the newspaper mixed it up or perhaps the poor woman was attacked on two occasions by two different perpetrators.

So back to the kimono - I went and got the paper out of the bin and used a magnifying glass to read the newspaper cutting in this picture

The text says :
"The West Australian, Perth Wednesday Feruary 17 1988
Kimono clue to a brutal killing
by Cyril Ayris
This kimono may be the clue that helps
solve the brutal killing of Victoria Heather
Clark, 30, in Victoria Park last September.
It was dropped by a man that walked
into a Huntingdale house early on Monday
morning and lay on top of a sleeping
18-year-old girl...
The kimono is the first good clue the police
have been given in recent sex attacks in the area.
Det-Sgt Max Kiernan said the man
apparently walked into the house..."

I still don't see what the link is??

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[meticulously]

Well that certainly is curious. Another person is still serving time for the murder of Victoria Clark. That particular perpetrator also killed another woman in another state.

I wonder if the newspaper mixed it up or perhaps the poor woman was attacked on two occasions by two different perpetrators.






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Theres nothing to be confused about though

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[The Hobo]

I just asked my father about Telstra in the 90's and he said that exchanges, even the small, suburban ones were only accessible to staff who worked there. Most exchanges only had a few staff. Most technicians never went to an exchange - they received their jobs via a remote office.

For those few staff authorised to access an exchange, access was via keypad and all entrances were logged electronically at a central base. I didn't get to ask whether there were cameras installed at these exchanges as Mum didn't want talk of such dark things on Christmas Day but I would doubt there were cameras in those days.

There are plenty of exchanges that are still key locked. No electronic logging etc.

I don't recall ever seeing keypads, but the majority are via eacs now, such is just an rfid card swiped on a card reader.

Most exchanges in the mid 90s were key.


I'm not sure the exchanges come into it, the proximity is a coincidence in my mind. There's so many exchanges out there, most crimes will be near one.

 

[The Hobo]

Maybe the girls were wary of taxi drivers. I'm thinking if I was in the area at the time and police are interviewing taxi drivers in relation to disappearances...maybe a stranger offering a lift in a non taxi vehicle could seem a safer option!

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Maybe for CG, but for JR and especially SS, there was no known danger of taxis.

 

[meticulously]

if a car stop that night we would of seen that

Frankie72 has that always been the story you've told?
What do you think now that the perpetrator has been caught ? [emoji319]

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[hateyrgutsloveyrface]

See this article from the Post newspaper: https://www.scribd.com/doc/289515831/POST-Newspaper-for-14th-of-November-2015

I don't think this is BE. The description doesn't seem to match as at the time of this occurring (1989), he would have been 19-21.

 

[Sutton]

I'm really curious about the other peoples clothes found with Claremont victims.
Were they off other victims of his also?? Sure seems to be headed that way.
Maybe he covered his face with them..or maybe he left them as smart *advertiser censored* clues about the others for police

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BBM.

Hi, mandy.maree. Can you link your source(s) for this? Thank you.

 

[Sutton]

Where is papertrail at? His posts look sooooo sus now.

Papertrail has posted since the arrest. If you click his or her user name you can read their latest posts.