UK UK - Corrie McKeague, 23, Bury St Edmunds, 24 September 2016 #19

[suzyjackson]

I can hardly bear to write this, but looking at the pictures of the landfill search and what they are looking through, there doesn't seem to be many 'large chunks' of rubbish. There's also millions of plastic bags so it must be nigh on impossible to distinguish between a bag and a scrap of pink shirt for example. I'm not naive and I know what they're searching for (100% agree with Totallyodds's post and would rather he was found anywhere but there) but is it actually feasible to find remains in this vast space? SP are saying if he's there they'll find him but what if they don't? Does that mean he's not there? Or does it mean he could be missed? Awful to even think of this, N and M must be in a complete state of disbelief.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

If they are sifting through the whole area even if they find nothing else bones would still be intact.

I'm interested in how much SP are following up with the bin driver and Biffa to make sure that finally they have the full facts about what they do with the rubbihs they collect. I hope they aren't closing rank to protect their reputation.

 

[FlashyHydra]

I would like to 'rewrite' the ending of the search for him. I am really hoping that the info that Aye gave last night/early this morning, will lead to giving help in locating C. In doing so, ideally I'd like C to be found somewhere nice, but realising that this is unlikely, I would like him to be found anywhere but the landfill. Somewhere pretty where the spring flowers are starting to bloom, where the sun always shines and where he is at peace.

Well that was something out of the blue...very touching :deepbreaths:
(did you cry Reallyodd?)

 

[Amonet]

I can hardly bear to write this, but looking at the pictures of the landfill search and what they are looking through, there doesn't seem to be many 'large chunks' of rubbish. There's also millions of plastic bags so it must be nigh on impossible to distinguish between a bag and a scrap of pink shirt for example. I'm not naive and I know what they're searching for (100% agree with Totallyodds's post and would rather he was found anywhere but there) but is it actually feasible to find remains in this vast space? SP are saying if he's there they'll find him but what if they don't? Does that mean he's not there? Or does it mean he could be missed? Awful to even think of this, N and M must be in a complete state of disbelief.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I would conjecture that they'll be looking for bones and for man-made materials, not scraps of material. It will be like looking for a needle in a haystack but I'm thinking say half a pelvis or a mandible...maybe the buttons from his shirt or the zipper from his jeans. Depending on whether anything went through processing maybe the car keys will be there or a piece of mobile phone casing or sim card.

Even archaeological digs don't go through this much volume in a 10-week period (to my knowledge) so I think it's a phenomenal task ahead of them. And then anything they find will have to go back to the lab to be tested.

I think they'll have to use their knowledge of the processing prior to landfill (if there was any) and then the feelings of the searchers as to whether something could have been missed (if they end the search without confirmation that Corrie did go there).

But they wouldn't be quite back to square one. They've seen the CCTV. They've identified the vehicles in the area. They've searched from BSE to Honington, BSE to BM, lots of area around BM. They've seen and spoken to almost all the people who were in town that night, and to Corrie's friends, workmates and family.

They might end up having to say, "we think he was in that collection, but we can't find positive proof of that, and we've now exhausted all lines of enquiry" ..but I hope that won't be the case. I think that would be worse than actually finding his remains there?

 

[Pooks101]

If they are sifting through the whole area even if they find nothing else bones would still be intact.

I'm interested in how much SP are following up with the bin driver and Biffa to make sure that finally they have the full facts about what they do with the rubbihs they collect. I hope they aren't closing rank to protect their reputation.

Good point, I would hope that Biffa have been completely transparent as it would give the search team a better idea of what they're looking for? Somewhere along the line there have been drastic errors with collection, sorting and disposal practices if C is found there. Biffa are going to have to publish something at some point with a full explanation of their code of practice, I can't understand why they haven't released a statement already.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Northern Light]

The detective heading up the search, Detective Superintendent Katie Elliott, insisted she would not call the mistaken weight of a bin during the investigation an 'oversight'.She said: 'I wouldn't describe it as an oversight. We check and recheck data we are provided. It's only when we've gone back and looked through thousands of lines of data we've found this.
Ms Elliot added that she was 'confident' that his body would be found at the site. Speaking as her officers raked through piles of rubbish, she said: 'I have a strong belief that we will find him here.' Ms Elliot described finding out about the correct weight of the load in the bin as 'very sobering'. She added: 'I would have liked to have had the information sooner that would have led us to this point.http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...d-missing-Corrie-McKeague-shares-picture.html It's frustrating for me and I think it must be terribly frustrating for Corrie's family.'

 

[Northern Light]

The detective heading up the search, Detective Superintendent Katie Elliott, insisted she would not call the mistaken weight of a bin during the investigation an 'oversight'.She said: 'I wouldn't describe it as an oversight. We check and recheck data we are provided. It's only when we've gone back and looked through thousands of lines of data we've found this.
Ms Elliot added that she was 'confident' that his body would be found at the site. Speaking as her officers raked through piles of rubbish, she said: 'I have a strong belief that we will find him here.' Ms Elliot described finding out about the correct weight of the load in the bin as 'very sobering'. She added: 'I would have liked to have had the information sooner that would have led us to this point.http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...d-missing-Corrie-McKeague-shares-picture.html It's frustrating for me and I think it must be terribly frustrating for Corrie's family.'

Rechecking thousands of lines of data. I take it this means Biffa Data?

 

[Reallyodd]

Well that was something out of the blue...very touching :deepbreaths:
(did you cry Reallyodd?)

When writing about C, I can remain detached and focus on the whatever the topic is, so no, I didn't cry. That said, if I used his actual name, I wouldn't be so detached because then it becomes more personal. I genuinely would like him to be found anywhere other than landfill or in any other awful place. I think we would all rather it be somewhere else. I can see here that the situation with C is quite upsetting, so what is wrong with writing something nicer than what we are dealing with?

 

[TheTruthWillOut]

The detective heading up the search, Detective Superintendent Katie Elliott, insisted she would not call the mistaken weight of a bin during the investigation an 'oversight'.She said: 'I wouldn't describe it as an oversight. We check and recheck data we are provided. It's only when we've gone back and looked through thousands of lines of data we've found this.
Ms Elliot added that she was 'confident' that his body would be found at the site. Speaking as her officers raked through piles of rubbish, she said: 'I have a strong belief that we will find him here.' Ms Elliot described finding out about the correct weight of the load in the bin as 'very sobering'. She added: 'I would have liked to have had the information sooner that would have led us to this point.http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...d-missing-Corrie-McKeague-shares-picture.html It's frustrating for me and I think it must be terribly frustrating for Corrie's family.'

One thing I find odd about this weight revelation. Why are they only saying "above 100KG"? Surely the "raw data" would give a precise weight?

What could the reason be for being vague about this?

 

[Miss_French]

Good point, I would hope that Biffa have been completely transparent as it would give the search team a better idea of what they're looking for? Somewhere along the line there have been drastic errors with collection, sorting and disposal practices if C is found there. Biffa are going to have to publish something at some point with a full explanation of their code of practice, I can't understand why they haven't released a statement already.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

It's an ongoing investigation and nothing has been found yet at landfill, so it's understandable Biffa not making a statement. When they do, I imagine it will be something from the legal eagles about reviewing processes rather than a full explanation. Plus there could be more than just an in-house review, could be other standards organisations involved.

 

[Shiressleuth]

I've seen the possibility of the phone being trackable posted many times on here and in other places. While I'm not a huge fan of SP's handling of the case I do feel they will have exhausted every avenue wrt being able to locate the phone more accurately.

The special skills of MIS should include basic phone tracking IMO

JMO

I think, Suzy, with the news of the wrong bin contents weight down to human error nothing should be assumed. If something as basic as that was wrong, who knows what other basics need rechecking time and again. That's investigation after all. For all the police and expertise in this case ( family, SP, NP, Scotland Yard, MIT, MIS and MoD) it is really unbelievable, so if things are repeated here several times, it's necessary IMO.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Interesting, and explains how the binman might not have noticed anything:

[video=youtube;FYm2GczXMz4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYm2GczXMz4[/video]

 

[Shiressleuth]

One thing I find odd about this weight revelation. Why are they only saying "above 100KG"? Surely the "raw data" would give a precise weight?

What could the reason be for being vague about this?

Perhaps something simple like the data only shows two digits with 99 being top and anything over 99 just showing as ** or xx for example.

 

[TheTruthWillOut]

Perhaps something simple like the data only shows two digits with 99 being top and anything over 99 just showing as ** or xx for example.

I would find it surprising if the weight system has a limit of 99.9KG before going "round the clock". These bins can (and do at my work) take up to 450KG.

It would also mean a nightmare for Biffa to work out figures based on weight for any customer that goes over this?

I'm going to look for specs on bin weighing systems to see what the weight limit is.

ETA:

Just thought about the fact these weighing systems weigh the empty bin when it comes down. Metal 1100 litre Biffa bins weigh 102KG empty so the weighing system having a 100KG limit seems even more unlikely?

 

[Hexenb]

Interesting, and explains how the binman might not have noticed anything:

[video=youtube;FYm2GczXMz4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYm2GczXMz4[/video]

And no DNA in the bin lorry doesn't sit right me is this another mistake or a cover up?

 

[Amonet]

At night time, especially, it would be hard for the driver to see anything in that bin lorry, from the video Cags has posted

I think there is a definite figure for the bin weight but police are just used to giving approximations for everything, and they're oblivious to our desire for detail.

My hypothesis is that it was 109kg, which rounds up to 110, and if someone thought there was a decimal place in it would look like 11.0, and that 11kg they've said is within the average range for that bin. *How* a mistake like that can happen I can't imagine, but that's what I'm thinking anyway.

 

[TheTruthWillOut]

At night time, especially, it would be hard for the driver to see anything in that bin lorry, from the video Cags has posted

I think there is a definite figure for the bin weight but police are just used to giving approximations for everything, and they're oblivious to our desire for detail.

My hypothesis is that it was 109kg, which rounds up to 110, and if someone thought there was a decimal place in it would look like 11.0, and that 11kg they've said is within the average range for that bin.

Early on it was "under 15KG" and then later more precisely "11KG" so maybe in a few days we'll get the precise figure. I do wonder were all the figures come from if a genuine mistake, though.

 

[TheTruthWillOut]

Had a quick look for the weigh system and if the following (or similar) is what is fitted to that Biffa bin lorry then it seems it has a 2 tonne capacity? The full spec sheet is only available if you register.

http://vwsltd.co.uk/product/rear-end-loader-rel/

 

[Shiressleuth]

I would find it surprising if the weight system has a limit of 99.9KG before going "round the clock". These bins can (and do at my work) take up to 450KG.

It would also mean a nightmare for Biffa to work out figures based on weight for any customer that goes over this?

I'm going to look for specs on bin weighing systems to see what the weight limit is.

ETA:

Just thought about the fact these weighing systems weigh the empty bin when it comes down. Metal 1100 litre Biffa bins weigh 102KG empty so the weighing system having a 100KG limit seems even more unlikely?

Well then IDK why they haven't given the weight assuming they know it. Just another thing SP want to keep up their sleeve. Information is power IMO.

 

[TheTruthWillOut]

Well then IDK why they haven't given the weight assuming they know it. Just another thing SP want to keep up their sleeve. Information is power IMO.

It is one thing I'm waiting on. It could be they are waiting to find him and then make arrest(s). Right now SP are taking a lot of heat, rightly or wrongly, and can't see them doing this to themselves without a payoff at the end of the investigation.

 

[Reallyodd]

Early on it was "under 15KG" and then later more precisely "11KG" so maybe in a few days we'll get the precise figure. I do wonder were all the figures come from if a genuine mistake, though.

I maybe totally wrong, but I find it very convenient that the 'new' figure regarding the load comes to light at the same time as they began the search of landfill. In my mind, it seems almost as if they thought 'we don't know where he is but we have to do landfill now, so let's have a figure to back up the theory of him being in the bin lorry as that's the easiest way.'