Found Deceased CA - Rachel Nguyen, 20, & Joseph Orbeso, 21, Joshua Tree Nat'l Park, 27 July 2017 #1

[iscaremyself]

[url]http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/Lack-of-Any-Trace-of-Missing-Hikers-Frustrates-Searchers-438432343.html?_osource=SocialFlowTwt_LABrand


[/URL]

 

[LadyL]

I've seen so many lost hiker stories lately & this is the first I've seen this suggested - great idea and IMO should be standard hiking gear, along with water, snacks, compass, phone, flares, matches ... what else?

That's a smart thing to do. Something I'd suggest carrying is surveyors ribbon as well, especially if going exploring off trail. Easy to mark your way with

 

[Seajay]

I've seen so many lost hiker stories lately & this is the first I've seen this suggested - great idea and IMO should be standard hiking gear, along with water, snacks, compass, phone, flares, matches ... what else?

Maybe one of those little Mylar blankets that can be used for warmth, shelter, as a reflector?

 

[Elainera]

a knife

 

[GigTu]

http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/l...438432343.html?_osource=SocialFlowTwt_LABrand

There's enough track evidence," said George Land, a ranger and spokesman. "We believe they're still in the park."Rachel Nguyen and Joseph Orbeso, recent students at Cal State University Fullerton, were last seen setting out from their airbnb rental for a hike a week ago Thursday, Land said. The property owner cautioned them to bring plenty of water.

I find it hard to believe they are still walking around in the park, yet no one can find them. Are they in a cave?

 

[tarabull]

a knife

Funny you say THAT Elainera :facepalm:

They say Joseph should have that covered, snipped...

...Orbeso, who attended Lakewood High School, took Nguyen to Joshua Tree National Park to celebrate her birthday, said Young, adding the pair had dated but most recently were friends. Orbeso, a security guard at a Long Beach golf course, loves the outdoors.

“He’s in very good shape, always carries knives when hiking and is a survivalist,” Young said. “He is also the most respectful, honest, and straight-forward person you will ever meet.”

 

[Seajay]

Funny you say THAT Elainera :facepalm:

They say Joseph should have that covered, snipped...

That answers one question for me. So now my concern is the fact the searchers are saying they are not finding any evidence that they passed by, empty water bottles, snack wrappers, clothing, etc. If he is a survivalist, then they should be finding something that can track them, he would know to leave clues, tearing up pieces of clothing to tie to brush as they pass, some kind of signs. Unless he is the one who got injured. But then she has 10 years of Girl Scout training so she should have some working knowledge of what to do if lost. I'm hoping anyway.

 

[killer Chaser]

JT is not good place to be this time of year, even for experienced hikers. Today is exceptionally cool at 84 degrees. I've been out there when it's 105, not really fun.

My apologies if this has already been shared. Here is a shot of the trailhead and overviews showing the terrain.

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Here is a very detailed description of the trail with an interactive map. I may just end up on this trail on my next outing.

https://modernhiker.com/hike/hiking-the-maze

Years ago me and a friend were out hiking deep in a canyon when we came across a dead mule dear. Half of it's rib cage was tore out, obvious signs it was taken down by a mountain lion. We didn't waste any time leaving as we didn't want to find out if it was still around. Not to say this is what happened to our two missing hikers but you just never know what you'll run into out in the wild.

I'm certain they went off trail and probably into one of the many slot canyons. It can be very difficult to find the trail in the desert once you are off it.

They said this isn't far from were Laura Bradbury went missing, they only found her skull cap, makes me wonder if a mountain lion got her.

 

[MelmothTheLost]

Would drones be able to pick up something missed by the thermal imaging planes and helicopters?

Maybe it's just me but I'm wondering what use thermal imaging is going to be during the daytime when the temperatures are higher than human body heat.

Maybe they're using thermal imaging after dark when temperatures have presumably fallen somewhat.

 

[MelmothTheLost]

a knife

A small hand mirror.

 

[Gardener1850]

I find it hard to believe they are still walking around in the park, yet no one can find them. Are they in a cave?

That quote is from several days ago, I believe. The news is just recycling it for the most recent story. Yes, they are probably still in the park but I doubt they are walking around. :moo:

 

[Cryptic]

Oh I completely agree. I was thinking like someone else mentioned possible foul play, that something may have happened to them outside the park and the car was placed there as a decoy. It's farfetched, I know.

Maybe "less likely" would be a better term. One thing that bothers me is the hood being left up. If they came back to the car and it would not start, the more common reactions would be to wait for another car and ask for help, or run out of patience and walk the road back.

Even if they decided to try a short cut across the desert, I have never left the hood up on a disabled car unless I was just going into my house or apartment to get a tool. Rather, I think most people would close the hood and then leave. I agree that foul play is unlikely, but the hood just seems strange.

 

[Gardener1850]

Maybe "less likely" would be a better term. One thing that bothers me is the hood being left up. If they came back to the car and it would not start, the more common reactions would be to wait for another car and ask for help, or run out of patience and walk the road back.

Even if they decided to try a short cut across the desert, I have never left the hood up on a disabled car unless I was just going into my house or apartment to get a tool. Rather, I think most people would close the hood and then leave. I agree that foul play is unlikely, but the hood just seems strange.

I think the police put the hood up to check the vehicle out and the media just happened to take a picture of it at that moment. JMO.

 

[Cryptic]

I think the police put the hood up to check the vehicle out and the media just happened to take a picture of it at that moment. JMO.

Thanks, that ,makes sense.

 

[roadrunnermt]

Funny you say THAT Elainera :facepalm:

They say Joseph should have that covered, snipped...

That's even more bothersome. If he carries knives, why no marks or evidence anywhere? Maybe there was and the rain washed them away?

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[Elainera]

Sad to see they still haven't been found.

That answers one question for me. So now my concern is the fact the searchers are saying they are not finding any evidence that they passed by, empty water bottles, snack wrappers, clothing, etc. If he is a survivalist, then they should be finding something that can track them, he would know to leave clues, tearing up pieces of clothing to tie to brush as they pass, some kind of signs. Unless he is the one who got injured. But then she has 10 years of Girl Scout training so she should have some working knowledge of what to do if lost. I'm hoping anyway.

bbm - yes that is really odd and concerning. No sign at all apart from (on the first day of searching I believe) foot prints leading away from the car into the desert, and again footprints a few days later indicating they might be going in circles. Why didn't leave signs or a message behind? Maybe they expired fairly quickly?

Some of my thoughts today:

Water is the crucial element here in their survival. It looks like they only planned a one day trip, possibly one night to look at the stars because it was her birthday? How much water would they have taken, being advised to take "plenty"? A gallon each?

I drink at least a gallon of water a day (plus juice) in the summer heat here in India (upwards of 100 degrees), and that is when I'm not going out into the sun much. If I'd be out all day in the heat and sun I would drink at least two liters more, if not more.

What I mean to say is, water is heavy, so I doubt they took more than 5 liter each. They might have used their supply up within 24 hours, especially if they didn't realize they were lost and were not rationing it.

Best case scenario imo, if they were careful with their water it might have lasted 48 hours, until Saturday.

Hopefully they were able to collect some rain water on the weekend. What else could they have done to be able to stay alive? There must be some dew in the morning. How much can you collect?

Are there edible plants that hold moisture within? Cacti? Joseph's knife would come in handy.

Small bugs? Small reptiles, etc?

I once saw a program about someone who was lost in a desert and he drank his urine. Of course, after a few days the urine will be very dark and it becomes less and less helpful to drink it (and really bad tasting too). Nevertheless he drank it for days and it helped him to survive. I can't remember though for how long he was lost.

It's Friday morning, it's been 8 days since they set out. Hopefully they will be found today!

 

[Seajay]

Sad to see they still haven't been found.



bbm - yes that is really odd and concerning. No sign at all apart from (on the first day of searching I believe) foot prints leading away from the car into the desert, and again footprints a few days later indicating they might be going in circles. Why didn't leave signs or a message behind? Maybe they expired fairly quickly?

Some of my thoughts today:

Water is the crucial element here in their survival. It looks like they only planned a one day trip, possibly one night to look at the stars because it was her birthday? How much water would they have taken, being advised to take "plenty"? A gallon each?

I drink at least a gallon of water a day (plus juice) in the summer heat here in India (upwards of 100 degrees), and that is when I'm not going out into the sun much. If I'd be out all day in the heat and sun I would drink at least two liters more, if not more.

What I mean to say is, water is heavy, so I doubt they took more than 5 liter each. They might have used their supply up within 24 hours, especially if they didn't realize they were lost and were not rationing it.

Best case scenario imo, if they were careful with their water it might have lasted 48 hours, until Saturday.

Hopefully they were able to collect some rain water on the weekend. What else could they have done to be able to stay alive? There must be some dew in the morning. How much can you collect?

Are there edible plants that hold moisture within? Cacti? Joseph's knife would come in handy.

Small bugs? Small reptiles, etc?

I once saw a program about someone who was lost in a desert and he drank his urine. Of course, after a few days the urine will be very dark and it becomes less and less helpful to drink it (and really bad tasting too). Nevertheless he drank it for days and it helped him to survive. I can't remember though for how long he was lost.

It's Friday morning, it's been 8 days since they set out. Hopefully they will be found today!

Yes, that's the main thing, water. And as you said, its heavy. That's why I was hoping they were able to harvest some water from the thunderstorms. And also to find some shade somewhere out there. If they were in a slot canyon, they'd find some shade eventually. But canyons are also prone to flooding during thunderstorms.

But even if they had managed to collect some water from the storms, that would also be gone now.

I just hope they have some skills that are helping them through this. I keep looking for what they could do to survive this. I watch too much Dual Survival and Naked and Afraid.

 

[Cryptic]

Hopefully they were able to collect some rain water on the weekend. What else could they have done to be able to stay alive? There must be some dew in the morning. How much can you collect?

I think there is a dew collection method involving plastic tarps and a collection jar. Ideally, dew collects on the tarp, then drains down thorugh a hole into the jar. I dont know how much water you can collect. As for water bearing plants, I am not familiar with those.

Sadly, I think this and other survival methods need a lot of prior practice to move from the "In theory you can do "X" " to the "I can actually do "X"- even when things are not going well". For example, I have met men who could start fires with flint / steel and with friction bows. They could do this even in less than ideal conditions. But, they had practiced for a long time to be able to do it.

 

[thekarmabus]

I think there is a dew collection method involving plastic tarps and a collection jar. Ideally, dew collects on the tarp, then drains down thorugh a hole into the jar. I dont know how much water you can collect. As for water bearing plants, I am not familiar with those.

Sadly, I think this and other survival methods need a lot of prior practice to move from the "In theory you can do "X" " to the "I can actually do "X"- even when things are not going well". For example, I have met men who could start fires with flint / steel and with friction bows. They could do this even in less than ideal conditions. But, they had practiced for a long time to be able to do it.

Not many water bearing plants in JT. Mostly cholla, barrel cacti yield almost nothing and can make you sick, prickly pear cacti one can eat the flesh. Best bet would to be find a Tinajas which could yield water after a storm. It's not looking good for these two. Very sad.


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[Cryptic]

Not many water bearing plants in JT. Mostly cholla, barrel cacti yield almost nothing and can make you sick, prickly pear cacti one can eat the flesh. Best bet would to be find a Tinajas which could yield water after a storm. It's not looking good for these two. Very sad.

And even finding a Tinaja would probably involve knowing where to look ( a low elevation part of a wash with an underlying layer of bedrock?) and a lot of prior practice.
Gosh, I wished I still lived in SOCAL. I would volunteer to help in a continuing recovery effort.