Canadian hostage, wife & children freed from Afghanistan, Oct 2017 #1

[Lilibet]

I was going to ask, is this another 'tennis court' thing? LOL
Must read the Sherman thread to get the humour. Sorry, its far to late to be up.

:seeya: JGD. Not sure what the “tennis court thingl is, but I forgot what thread I was on, if you’re talking about my post just above ending up on the Sherman thread briefly.

 

[Lilibet]

I can't find where, but I read in another article or on this forum that CC had liver issues as well. I questioned what they were, because depending on what it was it can possibly discredit JB on the miscarriage/death of the other infant daughter and show the kidnappers were correct in that they did not kill the baby or cause a miscarriage. I'm brainstorming here.....

I have 3 children. Apparently, once you get this condition you will get it for all future pregnancies. I did not have this condition with my first child. But my second and third I had obstetric liver cholestasis. Essentially, your liver stops performing and processing food as efficiently as normal. Bile will back up. It is absolute hell. The noticeable symptoms are jaundice and itchiness, especially in legs, feet and hands. And it is hell. The itching in the legs for me was unbearable, I can't even tell you. And I had a mild version of it. When you go into labor, a spontaneous stillbirth will happen. The doctor's still have not figured out why as the baby will have a heartbeat even at the start of the labor. Immediately after you have the baby, and I mean immediately, all symptoms disappear.

This is my guess: I suspect what kills the baby is all the toxins and bile that your liver is supposed to have been processing for nine months is stored and then released all at once during delivery. The baby is still attached to the mother and it's system cannot handle this so it causes the stillbirth. This is just my theory and I'm certainly not a doctor.

I've wondered if CC had this condition which explains the miscarriage, especially if she went into labor early. But, this article states CC always had liver issues. So that has thrown my theory out the window. I thought I'd still post my insight as there is still so much speculation.

Yikes! What a horrible condition Bellbaby. No matter what, it’s good to know about these things, even if it didn’t necessarily apply to CC. I’m surprised she was able to survive without whatever meds she had to take, let alone deliver 3 babies...in those conditions.

 

[chinacat67]

His wife is an adult, can do as she wishes. IMO

RSBM.

I very much get the sense it is much more complicated than that for CC.

There are both mental issues clearly (to me) and the children together... I believe she has been living coerced for a long time...and not by the kidnappers. It would be incredibly difficult to mentally break away, again, especially with 3 children.

MOO

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[JDG]

RSBM.

I very much get the sense it is much more complicated than that for CC.

There are both mental issues clearly (to me) and the children together... I believe she has been living coerced for a long time...and not by the kidnappers. It would be incredibly difficult to mentally break away, again, especially with 3 children.

MOO

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

Agree. Thats part of the reason I'd like to see the children taken into care. Hopefully, she would be offered the chance to break away, even temporarily, with her children and placed far away from the influence of JB. After a period of time and with some help, she may heal and be able to recover enough to break free permanently.

There was a famous case in Europe, think the father held the woman in his basement and fathered her kids. When she was allowed to go with the children and knew she was safe from the father, she recovered quite well over time.
IMO, there are similarities in this case.....although it was her husband IMO.

****Boyle made his court appearance and its been pushed over to Jan 15th. ****

 

[Intermezzo]

Boyle will seek bail, has Crown's case against him, court hears
http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local...-bail-has-crowns-case-against-him-court-hears Jan 8, 2018

Defence lawyer Ninetta Caparelli said in court that Boyle’s defence team, which is led by Lawrence Greenpson, needs a further week to complete a bail plan.

Prosecutor Kerry McVey said the Crown disclosed evidence against Boyle to his defence team on Jan. 3 and wants to proceed with the scheduling of meetings between defence lawyers and prosecutors, then between both parties and a judge, even as the bail process gets underway.

“The Crown would like to see the matter move along,” McVey said.

 

[Intermezzo]

I can't find where, but I read in another article or on this forum that CC had liver issues as well. I questioned what they were, because depending on what it was it can possibly discredit JB on the miscarriage/death of the other infant daughter and show the kidnappers were correct in that they did not kill the baby or cause a miscarriage. I'm brainstorming here.....

I have 3 children. Apparently, once you get this condition you will get it for all future pregnancies. I did not have this condition with my first child. But my second and third I had obstetric liver cholestasis. Essentially, your liver stops performing and processing food as efficiently as normal. Bile will back up. It is absolute hell. The noticeable symptoms are jaundice and itchiness, especially in legs, feet and hands. And it is hell. The itching in the legs for me was unbearable, I can't even tell you. And I had a mild version of it. When you go into labor, a spontaneous stillbirth will happen. The doctor's still have not figured out why as the baby will have a heartbeat even at the start of the labor. Immediately after you have the baby, and I mean immediately, all symptoms disappear.

This is my guess: I suspect what kills the baby is all the toxins and bile that your liver is supposed to have been processing for nine months is stored and then released all at once during delivery. The baby is still attached to the mother and it's system cannot handle this so it causes the stillbirth. This is just my theory and I'm certainly not a doctor.

I've wondered if CC had this condition which explains the miscarriage, especially if she went into labor early. But, this article states CC always had liver issues. So that has thrown my theory out the window. I thought I'd still post my insight as there is still so much speculation.

BBM

Here is the article that mentions the liver condition

http://www.phillymag.com/news/2016/10/22/caitlan-coleman-taliban-joshua-boyle/ Oct 22, 2016

But even if they’re handling Caitlan and Joshua humanely, there are other concerns that keep their friends up at night: Caitlan has a liver condition that requires her to undergo regular medical treatment, which may not be available wherever she’s being held. And then there’s the fact that she’s gone into labor twice in captivity.

That’s another part of this ongoing nightmare that came as a complete surprise to Caitlan’s friends — that’s made them feel as if they might be living inside a screenwriter’s head. Caitlan’s parents found a sonogram of their grandson only after she’d disappeared. “She didn’t tell anyone,” says Lindsay. “We would have tried to talk her out of going. I kick myself. I should have told her, ‘Don’t do it.’”

 

[Stunned]

Agree. Thats part of the reason I'd like to see the children taken into care. Hopefully, she would be offered the chance to break away, even temporarily, with her children and placed far away from the influence of JB. After a period of time and with some help, she may heal and be able to recover enough to break free permanently.

There was a famous case in Europe, think the father held the woman in his basement and fathered her kids. When she was allowed to go with the children and knew she was safe from the father, she recovered quite well over time.
IMO, there are similarities in this case.....although it was her husband IMO.

****Boyle made his court appearance and its been pushed over to Jan 15th. ****

Unfortunately, this will play right into the victim hood mentality of JB.

 

[Stunned]

Although I really don’t care how JB views his world.

 

[Jealoushe]

He must not have anyone to be a surety.

 

[Intermezzo]

He must not have anyone to be a surety.

I wonder if it would he his parents? I wonder if they may be involved somehow in his bail plan

His lawyers asked for another week in order to complete the bail plan. The Crown, of course, had no issue with keeping JB in jail another week while his lawyers work things out and then schedule a bail hearing.

 

[Grace.212]

He must not have anyone to be a surety.

Would his father not be able to do it because he is a Judge?

 

[Jealoushe]

I wonder if it would he his parents? I wonder if they may be involved somehow in his bail plan

His lawyers asked for another week in order to complete the bail plan. The Crown, of course, had no issue with keeping JB in jail another week while his lawyers work things out and then schedule a bail hearing.

In my experience, saying the lawyer needs more time means - no surety yet.

Would his father not be able to do it because he is a Judge?

Exactly. Or if they have in the past proven they are not capable of following orders when it comes to rules for him. I honestly doubt his parents would even volunteer to be one.

The victim can also put forth evidence to the court, to show why so and so would not be a good surety.

 

[Grace.212]

Newbie question. Do you have to live with your sureties?

 

[Stunned]

Newbie question. Do you have to live with your sureties?

Lol! Just looked it up, it is a word! Had me baffled!

 

[dyannaON]

First and last time I was my sons surety and he was under my house arrest. He could only go where I approved of. I also was able to be able to call said appointments and check in.
I had to take the stand and I was grilled.
I will never do it again. He broke his bail terms within one week. I was so mad that I finally caved and bailed him out when I refused every previous time.
So now he sits in jail.
He had a previous surety and he wasn't under house arrest of any kind.
Jmo.


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[AzPistonsGirl]

Newbie question. Do you have to live with your sureties?

Ummm, in the states, no. In Canada, I'd be surprised if that were the case. My guess is no, but it's just a guess.

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

I don't understand "surety" and what's occurring. If Josh can post the bail amount, is it required that he has a surety? Is a surety similar to an American bail bond company?

 

[SybilMoss]

A surety is a person who agrees to monitor the accused to ensure they comply with the bail conditions, and are liable for financial penalties if the bail conditions are broken. It is a pretty serious commitment (and yes, usually requires living with your sureity under house arrest). JB being held without bail for so long is very unusual, it speaks to a lack of a support network that trusts him. His dad can be a sureity but is obviously choosing not to at this time.

We don't have bonds up here. I don't think any money even has to be deposited into the court in order to recieve bail. I think it is more of a deterrent to not break the bail conditions, but I may be wrong. My experience has been with bail in low dollar amounts where it is more of a promise to pay if the conditions are broken.

 

[Grace.212]

A surety is a person who agrees to monitor the accused to ensure they comply with the bail conditions, and are liable for financial penalties if the bail conditions are broken. It is a pretty serious commitment (and yes, usually requires living with your sureity under house arrest). JB being held without bail for so long is very unusual, it speaks to a lack of a support network that trusts him. His dad can be a sureity but is obviously choosing not to at this time. .

WOW, that says a lot if his parents wont do it. That means to me they dont trust him.

 

[lilacc]

I can't help but wonder if the second victim is one of JB's parents. They made that statement acknowledging how bizarre his media statements have been. Now we hear JS and CC moved out of his parents' house, that living there was "intolerable" (according to JB). No word of thanks or acknowledgment towards his parents for their help, just that the single room was "intolerable". And now it appears his parents are refusing to post bail or act as a surety for JB. Sounds like they've had a falling out with their son. Maybe they tried to intervene with what was going on with CC, and got threatened, assaulted, etc. by their son as a result.