CA - 13 victims, ages 2 to 29, shackled in home by parents, Perris, 15 Jan 2018 #9

[flourish]

View attachment 129527

I did it! I think. I can't edit it, but I found a good blurred photo that still shows some features.

This picture...it must be 10 years old. They look like a fairly normal family, even though we think things were already "off" at the very least in this household.

I can't do it now, but I'll see if I can post some of the Disney side by side in what I believe to be chronological order. I don't think we'll "find" any missing kids or anything, but it is a striking visual to see the kids side by side over time.

Or if someone else understands where I'm coming from and thinks it is a good idea...please do.

Or if you all tell me this is a terrible idea that won't add to the understanding and only serve to derail the thread, I'll leave it alone.

I think it's a good idea and will be helpful

 

[ElizabethAnne]

I did it! I think. I can't edit it, but I found a good blurred photo that still shows some features.

This picture...it must be 10 years old. They look like a fairly normal family, even though we think things were already "off" at the very least in this household.

I can't do it now, but I'll see if I can post some of the Disney side by side in what I believe to be chronological order. I don't think we'll "find" any missing kids or anything, but it is a striking visual to see the kids side by side over time.

Or if someone else understands where I'm coming from and thinks it is a good idea...please do.

Or if you all tell me this is a terrible idea that won't add to the understanding and only serve to derail the thread, I'll leave it alone.

I think the picture you posted is much less than 10 years old, the abuse started happening at least 20 years ago in Texas (and perhaps earlier...maybe 25+ years), and that the abuse did not recently start to happen because of them moving to California. Those that are adults and over 18 (the ones 18+ - 29 years old) have cognitive issues, perhaps permanent, due to malnutrition and abuse that goes way back to their childhood years. As the children got older, none were allowed to have social media accounts even when they became adults. Even though the Turpins tried to "look" like a fairly normal family, they were never normal and the photos were staged and posted on Facebook on purpose.

 

[Yellow Rose]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ar-wants-adopt-13-House-Horrors-children.html

I'd love to show them true love': Abuse victim Amy Duggar wants to adopt all 13 House of Horrors children

 

[gitana1]

I went off about the weights in the last thread but I'll reiterate bc of the posts above me: size & weight are all relative, esp when it comes to frame size. I'm NOT saying the oldest girl wasn't starved. I'm saying we don't have all of the information. How tall is she? How large is her frame? What is her set point? Was she particularly dehydrated the day she was weighed? Had she voided prior? Was she wearing clothes? How's her fat vs muscle vs bone ratio? Sorry, just soooo many factors play into this. The one simple number "82 lbs" does not tell us the whole story. What if she's like 5'1"?

Similarly, I'm NOT saying the youngest kids weren't starved, but some children are very small/lithe, very petite, just don't start putting on weight until they get older. My younger sis was tiiiiiny, bone-thin until she was like 18 .. she was a very late bloomer. I was my full adult size (& my highest weight ever, incidentally) when I was 13. Random!

I'm 5'9" & if I weighed 82 I'd be dead (I'd probably be dead, or at least look dead, at anything under 110) but two ppl have chimed in saying they're my same height & have recorded weights in the 90s & low 100s, and I believe them. #jussayin .. haha.

We do have all the information needed. We don't need to know whether the oldest girl "voided" or not. What we know is that, according to medical staff
and LE, the 12 kids were severely malnutritioned such that they needed IVs and have cognitive delays due to chronic malnutrition.

There is zero reason for the medical officials to lie.

Your sister wasn't chained to a bed, made to wallow in her own waste and starved. So her weight and frame is irrelevant.

I know the names of number one to number seven and number thirteen,and I think I have an idea of number eights name. You do want to put a name with a face..

The wedding videos that had the children participating I can't find online now. IIRC there was one poster that said they had downloaded it but I don't remember who. It was interesting to watch them.

Ive downloaded the ones with the kids but I see someone else found a version!

 

[Stunned]

View attachment 129527

I did it! I think. I can't edit it, but I found a good blurred photo that still shows some features.

This picture...it must be 10 years old. They look like a fairly normal family, even though we think things were already "off" at the very least in this household.

I can't do it now, but I'll see if I can post some of the Disney side by side in what I believe to be chronological order. I don't think we'll "find" any missing kids or anything, but it is a striking visual to see the kids side by side over time.

Or if someone else understands where I'm coming from and thinks it is a good idea...please do.

Or if you all tell me this is a terrible idea that won't add to the understanding and only serve to derail the thread, I'll leave it alone.

Dad looks pretty well fed. Disgusting.

 

[smile22]

I read he article on fb originally and saw the dr oz episode. The younger ones are asking for the older ones. Oldest and youngest are separated in different facilities they said the older ones have the mind of A first grader so sad and will be in assisted living. I am hoping they won’t separate the younger ones and place them in the same home


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Zelda1010]

I think the picture you posted is much less than 10 years old, the abuse started happening at least 20 years ago in Texas (and perhaps earlier...maybe 25+ years), and that the abuse did not recently start to happen because of them moving to California. Those that are adults and over 18 (the ones 18+ - 29 years old) have cognitive issues, perhaps permanent, due to malnutrition and abuse that goes way back to their childhood years. As the children got older, none were allowed to have social media accounts even when they became adults. Even though the Turpins tried to "look" like a fairly normal family, they were never normal and the photos were staged and posted on Facebook on purpose.

Thank you! I'm open to suggestions & corrections! I'm guessing that is #12 in LTs arms and that she is 2ish in the photo. I believe she is 12ish now. That makes the oldest (29-10) 19. She does look young and thin here, but worse later.

My current personal working theory is the neglect really turned to torture as LT possibly struggled to carry a baby #13 to term. I think we know the eldest was removed from public school 20 years ago. We have some anecdotal evidence from the people who came forward to the media that they were weird then, at the very least.

 

[Lilibet]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ar-wants-adopt-13-House-Horrors-children.html

I'd love to show them true love': Abuse victim Amy Duggar wants to adopt all 13 House of Horrors children

I’m sure Amy means well and may be wanting to “re-write” her own abusive childhood by showing love to the Turpin survivors. But the Turpins are not puppies or kittens or abused older animals needing a loving home. They are complex human beings with a myriad of physical, emotional and developmental problems. Yes, they need love and stability, but much, much more. No one family is equipped to provide what they need IMO. But I do hope that they can live together at some point if that is what they want and if it is in their best interests.

 

[Hatfield]

WOW. I cannot suffer pathological liars. They have no capacity to be a "friend" to anyone, because they cannot be trusted. They do not know what friendship is. Somehow, they get by, but there are some seriously DANGEROUS pathological liars out there.......and they reproduce. JMO

I knew one person like this where they would lie about everything even if there was no reason to. It was incredible. Ive never met another person like them thank goodness. It was like they had a habit of lying and enjoyed it. Even non important nundane things they would lie just to lie.

The funny thing is everyone knew it and it got to the point where everyone would just play along and ignore him. LOL

 

[rsd1200]

I read he article on fb originally and saw the dr oz episode. The younger ones are asking for the older ones. Oldest and youngest are separated in different facilities they said the older ones have the mind of A first grader so sad and will be in assisted living. I am hoping they won’t separate the younger ones and place them in the same home


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

At least two of them are capable of higher learning though. They may see the world through the "eyes" of a first grader but they set up and planned this escape. Several of them, with the 17 y.o. actually going through with her part. Also, we know that the adult son went to some type of college, or jr. college, classes, and made good grades, and the one sib was able to drive a car (of course I know folks who drove tractors at age 7 or 8, so maybe driving a car and learning traffic laws is not that far-fetched for someone with the mind of a first grader).

 

[December]

When you are talking about weights under 100 pounds for an adult, every pound counts. Someone 95 pounds is 13 pounds heavier. Someone 104 pounds is 22 pounds heavier. That is a big freaking deal. These people's weights are not even close.

Also, there is the fact the patient at 82 pounds had to go through refeeding which is dangerous. Here is a video...
A Starving Mom Suddenly Ate 40 Cookies. This Is W…: http://youtu.be/vyZWojeVhyA

 

[rsd1200]

I knew one person like this where they would lie about everything even if there was no reason to. It was incredible. Ive never met another person like them thank goodness. It was like they had a habit of lying and enjoyed it. Even non important nundane things they would lie just to lie.

The funny thing is everyone knew it and it got to the point where everyone would just play along and ignore him. LOL

I've known more than one, and at least two, I know for sure, came from abusive homes. I wondered if they learned to lie to survive and it became ingrained. One will lie viciously, so, while I'm cordial, I try to keep them at arms length. The others? All of us did the same. It was almost a game. One guy told us the doc gave him a serious report and he didn't have long to live. No one believed him. Then he died!!!! We all felt horrible!!!

 

[margarita25]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ar-wants-adopt-13-House-Horrors-children.html

I'd love to show them true love': Abuse victim Amy Duggar wants to adopt all 13 House of Horrors children

"House of Horrors Children"...exploiting title imo. Don't like it one bit. Shame on the Daily Mail.

 

[ElizabethAnne]

Thank you! I'm open to suggestions & corrections! I'm guessing that is #12 in LTs arms and that she is 2ish in the photo. I believe she is 12ish now. That makes the oldest (29-10) 19. She does look young and thin here, but worse later.

My current personal working theory is the neglect really turned to torture as LT possibly struggled to carry a baby #13 to term. I think we know the eldest was removed from public school 20 years ago. We have some anecdotal evidence from the people who came forward to the media that they were weird then, at the very least.

My current personal working theory is that they were tortured back to Texas, that zip ties/ropes were found in photos of the house in Texas which is not just "weird" but is significant photographic evidence that the children were bound as captives and prisoners and tortured back in Texas prior to moving to California, and that the photo you cite was taking after 2010 because the background is southern CA, not TX, and that the longstanding torture and abuse has absolutely nothing to do with LT having the last baby, postpartum issues, pregnancy issues, etc. In addition, some Texas neighbors report cages in the house (the kids were probably kept in cages), locks in closets (who has locks in closets), makeshift airholes/vents from closets leading to the attic, padlocks and chains on refrigerators, etc.

If the torture had simply started in California recently, then one of the children would have escaped far earlier in my opinion. As it is, the siblings do not really know what normal is....they were held captive and not even given access to TV and radio.

Also, with the questions about you raised about whether the 82 lb and 29 year old had just 'voided' or was just simply dehydrated and the implication that this could have caused the low weight, LE did not say that it was only the 29 year old that had malnutrition. It might be normal for a 5 foot 1 inch 10 year old to be 82 lbs, but by the time a female of 5 foot 1 inch reaches 14 years old, 82 lbs is considered underweight by the BMI charts for teens by age/height.

This 29 year old was not just given fluids and released the next day. They said all but the 2 year old were starving, and the adults have significant cognitive deficits such that after being released from the hospital, they are having to be under conservatorship by the county and go into an assisted living center.

"Depraved" is a word you don't often hear in press conferences, but I definitely feel like the conditions were so awful that we can only imagine how bad it actually was.

 

[blue22]

At least two of them are capable of higher learning though. They may see the world through the "eyes" of a first grader but they set up and planned this escape. Several of them, with the 17 y.o. actually going through with her part. Also, we know that the adult son went to some type of college, or jr. college, classes, and made good grades, and the one sib was able to drive a car (of course I know folks who drove tractors at age 7 or 8, so maybe driving a car and learning traffic laws is not that far-fetched for someone with the mind of a first grader).

"Mind of a first grader," does not have to pertain to intellectual abilities. Cognitive abilities include perceptive abilities, emotional abilities, creative abilities, social abilities, decision making, motor skills, etc. I have worked with children who have incredible intellectual abilities, but the emotional and social capability of a small child. In cases of neglect and abuse, there will always the children who can do well intellectually, despite what they've experienced. Usually/Especially, when the children have solid early learning skills. (We know that the oldest child went to school until third grade.) It would not surprise me, that many of the adults (or the 17 year old, who is close in age) have functioning intellectual abilities. From statements, they seemed to have lived some of their young lives not in such isolation. I would imagine the younger children have the worse of the intellectual delays. IMO, all of them likely have profound emotional and social delays. A person can have a genius intellectual ability, and have the emotional and social function of a young child.

We have to remember that the categorization of having the mind of a first grader, does not inherently mean academic or survival abilities. Their cognitive abilities in all other areas were neglected and abused. The younger ones likely had no base of early learning skills or attachments.

IMO.

ETA: We also cannot ignore the fact, that starvation can deteriorate the abilities of previous well formed cognition.

 

[Zelda1010]

Dang it. Why does this have to be so difficult. I can't get this to attach as a picture. But here are the kids in the same dang shirts years later. And something is clearly wrong wrong wrong when compared with the pic I believe to be circa 2008.


https://goo.gl/images/3ykKSr

 

[Lilibet]

When you are talking about weights under 100 pounds for an adult, every pound counts. Someone 95 pounds is 13 pounds heavier. Someone 104 pounds is 22 pounds heavier. That is a big freaking deal. These people's weights are not even close.

Also, there is the fact the patient at 82 pounds had to go through refeeding which is dangerous. Here is a video...
A Starving Mom Suddenly Ate 40 Cookies. This Is W…: http://youtu.be/vyZWojeVhyA

What’s worrisome to me, based on all the speculation about “normal” weight on this thread, is that within the jury pool there are people who will think the same way. If there is a trial, those are the ones the defense will want on the jury...ones who will ignore the refeeding in the hospital, the chaining in feces, the isolation, the strangling, etc., and start nit-picking the weights for some reason, and speculate about the length of time this torture went on.

Personally, I hate to even discuss what defense tactics might be. Am I wrong in recalling that WS discussions inadvertently helped in Casey Anthony’s defense? Even if not, I don’t want to give the defense any ideas in this case...and we would be naive to think the defense doesn’t try to analyze and influence jury composition using available information (That’s what Dr Phil did before Oprah made him famous.) There is NO defense for what the Turpins did to their children, even if some weighed more than others and even if it was “only” for five years (which it wasn’t).
JMO

 

[Zelda1010]

My current personal working theory is that they were tortured back to Texas, that zip ties/ropes were found in photos of the house in Texas which is not just "weird" but is significant photographic evidence that the children were bound as captives and prisoners and tortured back in Texas prior to moving to California, and that the photo you cite was taking after 2010 because the background is southern CA, not TX, and that the longstanding torture and abuse has absolutely nothing to do with LT having the last baby, postpartum issues, pregnancy issues, etc. In addition, some Texas neighbors report cages in the house (the kids were probably kept in cages), locks in closets (who has locks in closets), makeshift airholes/vents from closets leading to the attic, padlocks and chains on refrigerators, etc.

If the torture had simply started in California recently, then one of the children would have escaped far earlier in my opinion. As it is, the siblings do not really know what normal is....they were held captive and not even given access to TV and radio.

Also, with the questions about you raised about whether the 82 lb and 29 year old had just 'voided' or was just simply dehydrated and the implication that this could have caused the low weight, LE did not say that it was only the 29 year old that had malnutrition. It might be normal for a 5 foot 1 inch 10 year old to be 82 lbs, but by the time a female of 5 foot 1 inch reaches 14 years old, 82 lbs is considered underweight by the BMI charts for teens by age/height.

This 29 year old was not just given fluids and released the next day. They said all but the 2 year old were starving, and the adults have significant cognitive deficits such that after being released from the hospital, they are having to be under conservatorship by the county and go into an assisted living center.

"Depraved" is a word you don't often hear in press conferences, but I definitely feel like the conditions were so awful that we can only imagine how bad it actually was.

I didn't post the voided question at all. I'm so sorry. I did forget about the zip ties and do agree neglect, and abuse too, happened since forever for these kids, minor & adult. I haven't seen anything about cages...do you have a link? I'm afraid I've been jumbled up with another poster here.

I need to re-read your post, because I just skimmed after the voided comment. I really am not trying to excuse anything, the pictures actually tell me a horrific tale of torture for these kids that cannot be excused.

 

[Rocco]

I read he article on fb originally and saw the dr oz episode. The younger ones are asking for the older ones. Oldest and youngest are separated in different facilities they said the older ones have the mind of A first grader so sad and will be in assisted living. I am hoping they won’t separate the younger ones and place them in the same home


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So Dr. Oz is saying the older ones have the mind of a first grader? How would he know? Just curious because I question if the facility they're at would release any information about them.

 

[Yellow Rose]

"House of Horrors Children"...exploiting title imo. Don't like it one bit. Shame on the Daily Mail.

The point was that Amy Duggar, an abuse victim herself, wanted to adopt all 13 of them? Discussion.