Found Deceased Australia - Karen Ristevski, 47, Melbourne, Vic, 29 June 2016 - #16 *Arrest*

[purpleandgreen]

The connection can change if the phone is idle other than quietly pinging away.

Active phones (convos, texts) in the area can bump the connection to another nearby tower, if the tower is getting full of connected phones. I believe it should reconnect wth the original (closest) tower though, once other activity dies down and there is plenty of 'room' on the closest tower.

An investigation will be able to tell if the phone is just quietly pinging away, or if there is actual activity on the phone.

IMO

Oh SA. It's wonderful that you're back. Oh how we needed you sometimes.

 

[sosocurious]

* The decision will be made tomorrow if Borce is off to trial.
* Matt Fisher - prosection will give his submission before the magistrate makes the decision
* Hallows argued in his closing submission there is insufficent evidence for Borce to be on a murder charge.
* Pre- meditation or planning was not put to the court.
* Hallows conceded that there is enough evidence for manslaughter.
* That is no concession from either BR or myself "It is purely a committal test" he said.

Category: | Herald Sun
Borce Ristevski committal hearing told family was in ‘dire’ financial situation before Karen’s death

 

[Didi1201]

the crazy thing is, Karen's death does not make the debt evaporate. It remains, increasing day by day. When Borce gets parole, around 2045, the debt will still be there..

..but bankruptcy wipes everything off
IMO this wasn't planned murder otherwise BR/VR would have buried the body never to be found

I don't get why they drive German cars and live in posh suburb when they have tons of debt, all they had to do was sell Avondale Heights property and buy house in St Albans for fraction of price and it is close to their shop.
Sometimes solution is so simple

 

[sosocurious]

..but bankruptcy wipes everything off
IMO this wasn't planned murder otherwise BR/VR would have buried the body never to be found

I don't get why they drive German cars and live in posh suburb when they have tons of debt, all they had to do was sell Avondale Heights property and buy house in St Albans for fraction of price and it is close to their shop.
Sometimes solution is so simple

750k maxed out line of credit on that home, wasn't there?
There was also that decade long cloud of debt.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Unless she decided to defraud him too by keeping the store cash takings to herself...

We seem to get closer to the matter re $850. If it was her last daily revenue, which she suddenly should spare for the new account, she probably refused to follow BR's advice, just for now that day and also for the future. Then a verbal fight may have escalated to a physical fight.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

’Yelling and screaming’ heard before Karen Ristevski disappeared"

A neighbour heard yelling and screaming.

‘Yelling and screaming’ heard before Karen disappeared

 

[CalliopeGG]

What a twist in the final day. I look forward to the submission by prosecution tomorrow. This might get renamed as the "End of financial year murder". Or mutiny perhaps.

The forensic accountant may be scratching his head on why BR was doing this Envirovision... But BR might not have consulted an accountant on the debt and tax impacts... Hey his mind was about committing a fraud, so how could he trust an average accountant to know his plans?

Leaving Karen out of Environvision was significant. As FromGermany had pointed out, she would not have access to the new company bank account. Unless she decided to defraud him too by keeping the store cash takings to herself... But looks like she was not that type of personality.

What an interesting thought! Could the $850 takings have sparked an argument along those lines?

 

[Deleted member 102539]

"From Rickard to Ristevski"
I can imagine, Borce tried (or would have liked to try) to get his son into the business, at least as a straw man. Squirreling the money (mainly the debts and the taxes) more easy, it would have been useful, to have a partner with the same last name.
Perhaps it wasn't outlandish, when we thought, there was planned an adoption or a name change?

 

[sosocurious]

’Yelling and screaming’ heard before Karen Ristevski disappeared"

A neighbour heard yelling and screaming.

‘Yelling and screaming’ heard before Karen disappeared

from your link

Mr Hallowes said there were too many holes in the prosecution’s case.

“On the evidence as a whole, it would not be reasonably open for a jury to infer that, if they found Mr Ristevski had killed his wife, that he intended to kill her or cause her really serious injury,” he said.

“There was no evidence of violence in the relationship or any threat of violence.

“There was no financial benefit to be gained by the accused from the death of his wife.

“There was no financial incentive whatsoever … no evidence suggesting any life insurance policies.

“The cause of death is unascertained. The evidence simply doesn’t assist in any way in terms of establishing how death was caused.”

In outlining his argument, Mr Hallowes made reference to the murder of Allison Baden-Clay, the Queensland woman who was killed at the hands of her husband Gerard Baden-Clay.

The High Court in 2016 found the accused murdered his wife in 2012.

 

[drsleuth]

Have we heard anything about the shovel during the committal hearing??

Inside the death of NZ-born Karen Ristevski - who was 'murdered in a personal attack'

Testing on a shovel seized from the Avondale Heights home found two soil types, Herald Sun reports.

One matched soil behind the family home in Melbourne, leading police to begin their initial search along the Maribyrnong River.

The other matched soil found in the Gisborne-Macedon area where her remains were found by a bushwalker at Mount Macedon on Monday.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

“There was no financial benefit to be gained by the accused from the death of his wife.

???

 

[TootsieFootsie]

I like that she did have some people who spoke up for her.

“I just think … She was that sort of person, that nice, kind, loving … If it was random it would be horrific.”

 

[sleepinoz]

Ten News Melbourne on Twitter
Video at link
Lawyers for accused wife killer Borce Ristevski say the evidence against him doesn't stack up to put him on trial for murder. #TenNews

ETA: There's mention of the soil under the car

 

[Trooper]

'financial benefit, financial motive.. financial incentive....

there was plenty of this. . When you are 1.2 mill in debt, in an ordinary suburban house, life isn't pretty..... Money, who had it , who didn't, who earned it, who didn't, it would have been the only subject under that roof.

Correct me if I have this wrong, but a lot of that debt was Borce's due to the business he had, importing fabric, was it?.. something.. he had to let it go after losing a cool 1/2 million and rising on it, which carried into the family debt. This was before Karen inherited the money from her parents.

So Borce was a registered loser, before Karen began to lose money on BellaBleu..

I am still puzzled as to why they didn't declare bankruptcy.. but perhaps they thought they could trade their way out.. how, I don't know. It doesn't look possible to me.

Maybe Borce couldn't take it one more time being reminded of his failures....

 

[sosocurious]

Mr Hallowes argued Mr Ristevski’s case was different.

“In Baden-Clay, one of things they had was motive. The High Court was quite clear on the motive. He had the extramarital relationship. There was evidence that his wife and (his mistress) were going to meet shortly,” he said.

“There were lies told by Baden-Clay that were related to the motive.”

‘Yelling and screaming’ heard before Karen disappeared

So GBC lies were related to motive.
Borce's lies are only related to the fact that he did something to his wife that ended her life. Drove her up the Calder and dumped her between two logs.
His disposal of Karen was planned and pre meditated. Albeit somewhat poorly.
imo

 

[SouthAussie]

I am still puzzled as to why they didn't declare bankruptcy.. but perhaps they thought they could trade their way out.. how, I don't know. It doesn't look possible to me.

Losing the house
Potentially losing other valuables (jewellery? designer items?)
Only being able to own a car worth less than $7,800
Any money earned over $50,000 p/a (each) would be paid to the creditors
Potentially no private school for Sarah
No personal loans or credit for 5 years
Name permanently on the National Personal Insolvency Index
Permission required to travel overseas

Maybe all of this was too much for them/him to cope with?

Indexed amounts | Australian Financial Security Authority
What are the consequences of bankruptcy? | Australian Financial Security Authority

 

[sosocurious]

Losing the house
Potentially losing other valuables (jewellery? designer items?)
Only being able to own a car worth less than $7,800
Any money earned over $50,000 p/a (each) would be paid to the creditors
Potentially no private school for Sarah
No personal loans or credit for 5 years
Name permanently on the National Personal Insolvency Index
Permission required to travel overseas

Maybe all of this was too much for them/him to cope with?

Indexed amounts | Australian Financial Security Authority
What are the consequences of bankruptcy? | Australian Financial Security Authority

And others knowing.
imo

 

[Trooper]

Losing the house
Potentially losing other valuables (jewellery? designer items?)
Only being able to own a car worth less than $7,800
Any money earned over $50,000 p/a (each) would be paid to the creditors
Potentially no private school for Sarah
No personal loans or credit for 5 years
Name permanently on the National Personal Insolvency Index
Permission required to travel overseas

Maybe all of this was too much for them/him to cope with?

Indexed amounts | Australian Financial Security Authority
What are the consequences of bankruptcy? | Australian Financial Security Authority

it's the old story of choice, would you rather put your foot in a bucket of boiling oil or a bucket of angry scorpions?... it's pain all round.

But it seems that Borce couldn't cope with either of the choices he made.. to not declare bankruptcy, and to continue accumulating debt.

Somewhere, I got the idea that Borce was already a declared bankrupt. Due to the hard hit he took on his previous venture into trade. How he managed to register businesses is a mystery to me.

 

[Trooper]

And others knowing.
imo

I'd be very very surprised that anybody knew about the horrendous debt. Even Vlasko , perhaps, didn't know the full extent of it. I just cant see Borce blabbing casually about it. His entire identity relied on the presentation of Borce being a canny money manager, not a fiscal ning nong, with the financial smarts of a poodle.

 

[Oz Jen]

I’m very interested in this case and have followed it since the beginning. But it’s so frustrating to see how adamant people are that Sarah was involved in killing her mother.

Grounds seem to be:
- she went overseas (she’s 21, life actually does continue. I lost my dad at 20 and I still travelled and had fun, I also had days of despair-filled crippling grief)
- she seems to be protecting her dad (is it really that hard to accept that she just loves him so much that she’s willing to believe all his lies 100%??)
- she focuses on herself during cross examination, seems self centred (really? She lost her mum, oh and she’s a millennial lol)
- she asked for clarification for a simple question (when I wasn a witness in a trial, I was told if I had even a shred of doubt about a question I needed to seek clarification)
- she didn’t look at her dad when on the stand (again, you’re advised to do this when giving evidence).

I’m honestly flabbergasted that so many people are out to string her up. Isn’t this a victim friendly forum? She’s a victim too.

Borce is on trial, he highly likely killed his wife, for all the reasons we have suspected all along. Sarah is not on trial, so everyone should just move past that. Stop hating on her just because she doesn’t fit your predefined image of a grieving daughter.

The grounds you've outlined are not the grounds on which I base my opinion.

- I don't recall any comments stating that Sarah is guilty because she is a millennial.

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Having a go at members for their opinions is outside WS TOS.