Found Deceased IA - Mollie Tibbetts, 20, Poweshiek County, 19 Jul 2018 #18

[VeryVeritas]

snipped for focus:
. Mollie's driver's license was at the house (wouldn't she need it to drive back from her Mom's?)

That is a good question. Personally I always have mine... but maybe in that small town and the short distance, she didn't always have it? That would be something her mother might know... just how likely that was. I'm with you in thinking that a) she was at home when something happened or b) it happened very soon after walking out the door. And combine that with that it's very likely someone close to her or at least they know each other, who would be on that list?

 

[Q.E.D.]

Yes, but as someone else pointed out that would include every person who drove down the Interstate that day. Which would be at least 50,000 motorist, plus every other cell phone that was not only in town, but within 45 miles of the tower. Cell phones ping upto 45 miles way. They would need to contact 50,000 to 100,000 cell phone users and find out why they were in the area. Many may not be cooperative.

Theoretically they should be able to find a suspect that way, but it has never been successful in any case I have followed.

It’s not just THAT cell phones ping, it is that they have a consistent ping speed in relationship to their distance. Radio waves travel at roughly 186,000 miles per second as a known constant. The speed from a single tower to the phone and vice versa gives a the distance radius around the tower with reasonable accuracy. Imagine the broadcast area of a cell tower as a circle around it (this is inexact, but bear with me). The phone could be anywhere at the perimeter of the circle. Use two towers, now you have two circles overlapping, creating a football shape overlap between them. One of the two points where they begin to overlap at the perimeters of the circlular areas around each tower (the tips of the football shape) is where the phone is. With three towers now you have three circular areas with an overlap, which point to a single area of contact. This is the area of the phone during the ping.

If three towers can be used, there can be a reasonable level of precision to the location in question. This would not include the highway area with all its fast moving cars, as you have feared. As an added precaution: since we are looking for a stationary or slow moving ping progression at the point of MT’s abduction, we also know the abductors phone could also not be moving quickly either. So when running analysis on a series of tower/phone pings, fast moving vehicles can be sorted out.

Most of the issues that relate to pings as a search tool: obtaining the records quickly and running analysis, there only being two towers connected or less, the fact that the people are no longer at the point you are looking for, and if you are, the battery going dead.

https://www.google.com/search?q=cel...8&hl=en-us&client=safari#imgrc=VrWFnwcjMRjkEM:

 

[sun16]

"I snapchatted her earlier that morning and she hadn't opened in seven hours... definitely odd" - Friend of Mollie Tibbetts, Alexis Lynd

In this audio file, Mollie's best friend says Mollie would snap her a 'fact of the day' every morning. That morning she didn't receive one. This helps with time line.

This is interesting/helpful and would be good to know what time that friend sent MT the message. If the friend said MT hadn’t opened the message 7 hours later ... I guess MT could have been busy or whatever, but more likely, something had already happened to MT by midnight or 1am. I know some aren’t loving the black SUV sighting, but who knows.

 

[Deleted member 227095]

My understanding is that the hardware store was vandalized, not burglarized.

We have no info other than the damaged glass door and grafitti.

 

[ventuc]

I'm sure it's been mentioned. But if mom was asked if Mollie was in a house at 945, and Dalton opened a snap at 10, did Mollie send the snap at 945? I can't imagine much time would have passed between her sending it and him opening it.

Along those lines, then, yes, I also wonder how long it had been since BF had checked his phone/Snapchat, or whatever? Ie, had he been busy for hours and only got to check it at 10pm, or had he not seen anything on his phone/last checked his phone at 9 or 9:30pm, then opened the Snapchat at 10pm? Not sure I'm being clear, or possibly just restating what you're asking?

Also, who would ask mom if Mollie was in a house at 9:45, and why would they think she would know the answer? It sounded like the last interaction she had with Mollie was texting about dinner around 7:30pm?

 

[VeryVeritas]

Why not? Could have been why FBI showed up so quickly....

It could, or because of inter-relationships in a small town might make a proper investigation impossible. There are other reasons too...

 

[shanadk]

I hope it's not the case, but
the Canadian border is nine hours, straight drive north from Brooklyn..

 

[Deleted member 227095]

This is interesting/helpful and would be good to know what time that friend sent MT the message. If the friend said MT hadn’t opened the message 7 hours later ... I guess MT could have been busy or whatever, but more likely, something had already happened to MT by midnight or 1am. I know some aren’t loving the black SUV sighting, but who knows.

Is this person talking about the morning of the 18th?

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

I have no solid facts that I feel comfortable in believing. So many of the statements given to the press by LE, family, and friends seem to conflict with one another that I have no confidence in any of them. I can fully understand why LE is cautiously keeping their secrets, I can understand why family would proclaim their hopeful opinions, and I can even understand the theories of all my fellow WSers. Not that I agree with all ~ but I understand.
But for me, I am cautious as each genuinely concerned circle contradicts one another (and even themselves) with the hand-picked facts that seem to endorse their most current, favorite position. All we seem to have at this point is shifting sand ~ and I'm praying we will have a more solid base to build on when we hear LE's PC on Friday.
Love all the various positions but really wince when I read anything with a connotation of even modest judgements of Mollie's use of social media (or that of her generation). Please reread your input using the eyes of Mollie's family before you hit the "post" button. They're already in enough pain without hearing any critical comments (or how well our families avoid any dangers on SM).

Lol, ready for the tomatoes! XOXO​

 

[InvSmith]

That is an oddity that has not been successfully explained.

It was indicated today that he opened it at 10 P.M. The time sent was not known.

 

[cluciano63]

I would never walk in the evening without my dog...well, I would not walk in the evening at all if not for walking my dog lol...but I doubt many serious runners would take the dog for a run. Some do, I know, as I have seen some, i.e my brother but his dog is trained to run next to him at the same pace. . And Mollie had no reason to be afraid, if she ran around town every evening.

The thing about headphones that worries me is that you lose any bit of extra time to scream, or take off, when you do not hear danger approaching. If all of a sudden, it is upon you. Whereas maybe you would have heard a car slowing down, changing speeds, even come to a stop behind you, i.e...I can see this happening, very quickly and silently, more or less.

 

[Veracity]

Long time reader – first time poster! And I may have missed a few of her threads so I apologize if any of this has already been discussed. There has been no evidence released. But there is one point of evidence – the involvement of the FBI.

If I have this correct, because she is 20 yrs old, they would only “monitor” the kidnapping. I think with 40 agents, they are doing far more than monitoring… If you look at the cases the FBI does get involved in, the only ones that would relate to Mollie would be – crossing state lines, involving cyber stalking, involvement of local law enforcement, or a serial killer, correct? If it was just a friend or family member and it stayed within Iowa, the FBI would not have 40 officials involved (unless it was officially a murder case). If they had a suspect to search for, they would release their photo, correct? Example - If it was a former teacher, they’d release their face and we’d all be on alert to find that person. They would not release their face if they did not know who took her. They would not release their face if they thought Mollie may have gone with them on purpose.

Something occurred in or around the WC farm area – but they’ve clearly stated that’s not where she is. Perhaps… They know she is no longer in the area because she’s outside of state lines (the where). They know she is with someone that had some interaction with her in some way (the who). They know the day and timeframe when she went missing (the when). They just don’t know if she is there willingly or being held against her will (the why).

I know it’s weird… but if she was with someone that thought she wanted to stay and let’s say be a subordinate (possible misinterpretation of conversation online) and they were holding her across state lines, would the FBI “go get her”? Would the FBI release information on that person? Not until they knew 100% that she was being held against her will – which is probably a very difficult thing to prove. Is that why her family keeps pleading for her safe return and keeps talking about a misunderstanding?

Apologies if this has already been said. It’s very hard to keep up! Praying they can bring Mollie home very, very soon!

I am not sure the "30-40" are ALL FBI. There are COUNTY SHERIFF DEPT, IOWA State Police, IOWA Dept of Public Safety's Division of Criminal Investigations. We know all are involved because:

SHERIFF DEPT:
Sheriff's Deputy Anderson was on camera 19th seeming to be leading the community search.
Sheriff's own statement during PC
Sheriff's interview on July 25, the very day the FBI joined the case.

STATE POLICE:

A few folks with those uniforms have been filmed.
Sheriff's interview stated he went up in a State Police plane on July 24th.

IOWA DEPT of PUBLIC SAFETY, DIVISION of CRIMINAL INVESTIGATION

We have three of them on camera Winker at the PCs Mitch M (not even going to try his last name!), and Richard K (can't recall his last name!)

FBI

FBI Special Agent in charge of all IOWA Thysse was at PC.
Film shows several FBI clad men in news clips.

I would bet the PD in GRINNELL were included because of where Mollie worked.

I have not heard of any Rangers involved so far. And I am not sure who is responsible for surface water in IOWA - Iowa is full of creeks, lakes, ponds, and rivers.

So if we divide the largest number - 40 and divide it by the number of known agencies and depts- it comes to on average 10 persons per agency. Could be a more for one and less for another. If you use the lesser number - it breaks down to 7.5 per agency. (understand you can't half a person). Think about that-- that could mean where the FBI goes:

someone who analyses digital footprints, someone who works with telecommunication companies and companies like FitBit. That makes 3 of the four for the FBI - the Special agent for IOWA and specific folks pulled from two field offices -Thysse said he had folks working the case from DesMoines and Cedar Rapids field offices. Did he ever say how many specific FBI were assigned to the case?


(on a side note: anyone else think it odd when you pull up the FBI's site and type in Field Offices an USA map pops up and there are ZERO in IA on their own map!) We know they exist because we have the man in charge speak from Montezuma! Their site says there are 56 field offices but only 52 icons on the map. Two are missing for IA - anyone know which other ones are missing? I detest when I find stuff like that. I expect better from the FBI! Especially when there is a missing person case like this with a major Interstate so close.)

Field Offices — FBI

 

[KaaBoom]

It’s not just THAT cell phones ping, it is that they have a consistent ping speed in relationship to their distance. Radio waves travel at roughly 186,000 miles per second as a known constant. The speed from a single tower to the phone and vice versa gives a the distance radius around the tower with reasonable accuracy. Imagine the broadcast area of a cell tower as a circle around it (this is inexact, but bear with me). The phone could be anywhere at the perimeter of the circle. Use two towers, now you have two circles overlapping, creating a football shape overlap between them. One of the two points where they begin to overlap at the perimeters of the circlular areas around each tower (the tips of the football shape) is where the phone is. With three towers now you have three circular areas with an overlap, which point to a single area of contact. This is the area of the phone during the ping.

If three towers can be used, there can be a reasonable level of precision to the location in question. This would not include the highway area with all its fast moving cars, as you have feared. As an added precaution: since we are looking for a stationary or slow moving ping progression at the point of MT’s abduction, we also know the abductors phone could also not be moving quickly either. So when running analysis on a series of tower/phone pings, fast moving vehicles can be sorted out.

Most of the issues that relate to pings as a search tool: obtaining the records quickly and running analysis, there only being two towers connected or less, the fact that the people are no longer at the point you are looking for, and if you are, the battery going dead.

Yes, but they would have to analyze pings from 100,000 different cell phones and then start contacting those who could be pinpointed to that area, which would probably be a lot. Theoretically it should work, but again I can't find any case of it being successful.

 

[sun16]

Is this person talking about the morning of the 18th?

I got the impression the friend sent a message to MT between 11pm and 1am or so (the night MT disappeared).

 

[Deleted member 227095]

It could, or because of inter-relationships in a small town might make a proper investigation impossible. There are other reasons too...

True. But, still can't wrap my head around this many LE from outside the area on a single missing person. When I was little we had the Moxley murder where I lived (15 year student murdered blunt force trauma) and even with the ties to Kennedy family I don't think it got this level of FBI attention and resources. Nothing is making much sense to me at this point in great part probably because we are being fed alot of information that is either irrelevant or just plain incorrect.
Murder of Martha Moxley - Wikipedia

 

[Mom24]

Along those lines, then, yes, I also wonder how long it had been since BF had checked his phone/Snapchat, or whatever? Ie, had he been busy for hours and only got to check it at 10pm, or had he not seen anything on his phone/last checked his phone at 9 or 9:30pm, then opened the Snapchat at 10pm? Not sure I'm being clear, or possibly just restating what you're asking?

Also, who would ask mom if Mollie was in a house at 9:45, and why would they think she would know the answer? It sounded like the last interaction she had with Mollie was texting about dinner around 7:30pm?

A snapchat isn't like a message. You don't get an alert that you have a message, you have to open the app to see it. I sometimes get snapchats and don't see them for days because of that.

 

[zencompass]

But there's a sticky point there for me, we don't know that she was alone for a second night or if it was the first night. I can't find any article that mentions when Allie and Blake left. Did they leave on the 17th or did Allie leave for her job in Ames on the 18th and Blake went that night to be with her. Allie didn't have a home in Ames, this was her house, so I could see them spending one night away together, but two? So when they left kind of impacts what I think happened. If they left on the 17th could someone have seen what looked to be a vacant home and thought they could rob it? Or did someone know she was alone at the house because she talked about it at work the day before? I don't know, but it makes a difference for me in how plausible it is that she was taken from the house rather than while on a run.

Hi Mom24,

I saw it in the Heavy.com article in the media section that Allie and Blake left on the Monday, July 16.


Mollie Tibbetts Missing: 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know | Heavy.com

“Please help us bring Mollie home. Any and all information is useful! Please share and let’s see how far we can reach out,” Allie Houghton wrote on Facebook. They had been out of town since Monday, July 16.

 

[Veracity]

I would never walk in the evening without my dog...well, I would not walk in the evening at all if not for walking my dog lol...but I doubt many serious runners would take the dog for a run. Some do, I know, as I have seen some, i.e my brother but his dog is trained to run next to him at the same pace. . And Mollie had no reason to be afraid, if she ran around town every evening.

The thing about headphones that worries me is that you lose any bit of extra time to scream, or take off, when you do not hear danger approaching. If all of a sudden, it is upon you. Whereas maybe you would have heard a car slowing down, changing speeds, even come to a stop behind you, i.e...I can see this happening, very quickly and silently, more or less.

Gotta ask - is the dog in question the cutie in the photo? I see you carrying that cutie while YOU run!

 

[Deleted member 227095]

Tough.

Over the years I can think of everything. Paying traffickers sounds far out.

If you are interested in the entire traffiking world spend some time trolling off the web. We had a discussion about this many threads ago. But to answer your question, yes its possible to 'request' a certain type of person if the price is right. The specificity of some requests is quite incredible as are the prices demanded and paid. Its another world and sadly they operate in plain sight of most of us.

 

[jillycat]

I agree with everything you say. The last paragraph is where I get tripped up. I question ... did the neighbor truly see MT running by at 7:30pm. Could the neighbor be mistaken as to seeing her, or what time it really was. If her mom talked to MT at 7:45pm or whatever time, then everything after 7:45pm is up in the air for me, unless LE has sure evidence of MT being on her computer at a clear time (or cell, Fibit info for evening). If so, then everything after that time is up in the air. Depends. I feel she was taken by a stranger and is likely deceased. At what time that was, and where, I don’t know. Sounds like not taken from DJ house. So outside.

In the interview I saw with the male neighbor, who said he was watching TV and could see out his window and even mentioned she was talking on her phone (I think...maybe he said or meant she was looking at it, as in texting...don't recall now), he seemed to be certain. But then I read either here or via an article that there were three people who saw her within that time frame? I also doubt that she was taken from the house.