IA - Mollie Tibbetts, 20, Poweshiek County, 19 Jul 2018 *Arrest* #41

[Peppery]

Do you think data could still be retrieved from it after it was rained on several times? I know she was covered with corn leaves, but I bet it still got wet.

Depending on model, yes. If it was an Alta as has been suggested, they are water resistant and can be worn in the shower and pool.

 

[CuriousCricket]

So really the reason to charge M1 initially, instead of the others that we think will probably be added, would be to ensure that it is a serious enough charge that he does not get out, correct?

The reason this has me stumped is, in the Lucas Hernandez case it seemed to be reversed. They charged her with lesser crimes to arrest her but waited on charging for actually killing him.

Two very different investigations, apparently. Just glanced at the Hernandez case, but the stepmother was a known player from the beginning. As LE poked around in the family situation, they became aware of the child endangerment. As things progressed, more was discovered and appropriate charges were placed. LE probably also amped up the questioning.

In MT's case, CR was completely unknown. LE had to work the leads to even find him. However, by the time they found him they had a big body of information and within 15 hours a confession and location of a body.

 

[SharonNeedles]

Exactly. Something happened at 7:45. Was that the first sighting of Rivera circling the area of Boundary and Middle Str. and waiting for Mollie to arrive? Did he grab her and throw her in the back seat after she was seen on CCTV? Did he drive her to 1900 395 Ave and assault her, ending at 8:28? Is this where he put her in the trunk?

Since something significant happened at 8:28PM, why didn't he leave her there? I would expect a first timer to want to distance himself from the body immediately, but Rivera didn't do that. He drove some distance and carefully hid the body.

I also notice several maps speculating on his route. I'm perplexed with the complexity of the proposed routes. Why wouldn't he take the most direct route to the cornfield where she was found, and then the most direct route home?

Pink line is abduction to cornfield, blue is cornfield home in this map.

Are you sure that’s where CR’s home is? I believe it’s on 400th Ave north of I-80.

It wouldn’t make sense to me that he would take a direct route to the cornfield unless he had already planned he was going to kill her and knew where he was going to dump the body prior to assaulting her. I don’t think his initial motivation was simply murder, nor do I think he planned on having a body he’d need to dispose of.

 

[kpm]

Exactly. Something happened at 7:45. Was that the first sighting of Rivera circling the area of Boundary and Middle Str. and waiting for Mollie to arrive? Did he grab her and throw her in the back seat after she was seen on CCTV? Did he drive her to 1900 395 Ave and assault her, ending at 8:28? Is this where he put her in the trunk?

Since something significant happened at 8:28PM, why didn't he leave her there? I would expect a first timer to want to distance himself from the body immediately, but Rivera didn't do that. He drove some distance and carefully hid the body.

I also notice several maps speculating on his route. I'm perplexed with the complexity of the proposed routes. Why wouldn't he take the most direct route to the cornfield where she was found, and then the most direct route home?

Pink line is abduction to cornfield, blue is cornfield home in this map.

I agree with you on all points!

Even if he was blocked out you would imagine his first instinct would be to flee the scene, maybe drag her body out of sight but not to drive around with her.

 

[MsBetsy]

Regardless, it's quite a leap to go from no criminal record to a daylight abduction of a stranger on a public street resulting in multiple stabbing murder and hiding the body 15 miles from the abduction site.

It's more likely that he has a criminal history, that he has never been caught, and that is why he did not flee the area after the murder.

Oh, I definitely think there is a history. I hope they can find it. Even from the time he lived in Mexico as a teenager. He may have worked himself up to this crime.

 

[otto]

That's exactly what had me going back and forth. Was it just suddenly turned off at 8:28? And why immediately following the murder? But others kind of convinced me that since police indicate in the affidavit that the crime began and ended within that timeframe, they believe this is what took place. Not saying that as fact it is just how some have interpreted it. What was the exact wording in the affidavit?

We don't know when she was murdered, so we can't say that the Fitbit was "turned off immediately following the murder." We know that something happened at 1900 385 Ave at 8:28PM, and that's it. Given the precision of the time, we can assume that 8:28 relates to the Fitbit, but if the Fitbit and phone were separated, that would also explain the significance of 8:28PM.

 

[TL4S]

Exactly. Something happened at 7:45. Was that the first sighting of Rivera circling the area of Boundary and Middle Str. and waiting for Mollie to arrive? Did he grab her and throw her in the back seat after she was seen on CCTV? Did he drive her to 1900 395 Ave and assault her, ending at 8:28? Is this where he put her in the trunk?

Since something significant happened at 8:28PM, why didn't he leave her there? I would expect a first timer to want to distance himself from the body immediately, but Rivera didn't do that. He drove some distance and carefully hid the body.

I also notice several maps speculating on his route. I'm perplexed with the complexity of the proposed routes. Why wouldn't he take the most direct route to the cornfield where she was found, and then the most direct route home?

Pink line is abduction to cornfield, blue is cornfield home in this map.

What do you think was significant about the pig farm? Do you think they suspected WC for awhile? Or an inaccurate digital signal?

 

[MsBetsy]

I agree with you on all points!

Even if he was blocked out you would imagine his first instinct would be to flee the scene, maybe drag her body out of sight but not to drive around with her.

Maybe he transported her body because he felt it was too close to her home and wanted a more secluded area.

 

[kpm]

I don't text while I am running. Either she had not started her run, or she had completed it, perhaps walking back to her mothers to eat.

I agree

I want to go back and see who started the text thread between them, she could have eased up to a walk to answer the text then started back up.

She has given her mom instructions to pick out dessert ingredients for the next day so they text may have been important enough to disrupt her jog?

Any way you look at it LE thinks she was alive at 7:30 because she was texting her mom, how heartbreaking for her mom to think she was within moments of her death after texting

 

[Leney]

The 8:28 could as well be a video timestamp.

 

[Charliegizmo49]

Do you think data could still be retrieved from it after it was rained on several times? I know she was covered with corn leaves, but I bet it still got wet.

If it’s been or might be found. There is a learning curve to utilizing this data.
Each time LE and the companies themselves applies tech to new and rising situations mistakes are made.

Including and challenging right to utilize it at all.

 

[kpm]

Maybe he transported her body because he felt it was too close to her home and wanted a more secluded area.

Let’s go by his words, he was blocked out because he was mad and that’s what happens to him, was he able to think clearly if he’s blocked out to rationalize that thought pattern or just flee?

I don’t think so, I think it was pre-planned, I think he mapped out his spot

 

[The Farm]

Just a few random thoughts. In the video of him arriving at Court and getting out of the truck he had a little pep in his step hopping out of the truck. Not a care in the world? I was happy to see there was a perp walk. In Court he appeared to be relaxed and showed no emotion. No remorse, no fear. Nothing. IMO

Yup...…..

 

[Bravo]

Do you think data could still be retrieved from it after it was rained on several times? I know she was covered with corn leaves, but I bet it still got wet.

If it waterproof. Folks shower, swim with them on.

 

[MsBetsy]

What do you think was significant about the pig farm? Do you think they suspected WC for awhile? Or an inaccurate digital signal?

I think it could be an inaccurate signal but am still trying to find out how far off the signal could be. I asked before but may have missed the answer. I also think he may have gone there to dispose of the evidence. To make sure it was not in the same location as he left the body.. wasn't it the very last signal they have? It would appear that he turned cell phone off or got rid of it at that time. Does anyone remember if the time of the ping in that area was ever mentioned? Was that the last form of " communication" they were referring to?

 

[MassGuy]

At this point all we know is that her clothes were in the same location as where her body was found.

LE made no mention of her phone, earbuds or Fitbit in the warrant, I’m not sure if they didn’t think it was necessary to mention or if they were not at the scene.

They have much more info than we are privy to, all we can do is speculate.

They aren’t compelled to mention those things regardless, so they either didn’t recover them, or they did and don’t find it necessary to reveal that. If these items were recovered, it would take time to analyze them (if this were possible due to their condition). Just one more thing to add to the list of unknown details.

 

[Leney]

If it’s been or might be found. There is a learning curve to utilizing this data.
Each time LE and the companies themselves applies tech to new and rising situations mistakes are made.

Including and challenging right to utilize it at all.

I believe the defense could easily challenge the reliability of the fitbit data.

ETA: Especially when someone has a pre-existing condition such as asthma.

 

[MsBetsy]

I agree

I want to go back and see who started the text thread between them, she could have eased up to a walk to answer the text then started back up.

She has given her mom instructions to pick out dessert ingredients for the next day so they text may have been important enough to disrupt her jog?

Any way you look at it LE thinks she was alive at 7:30 because she was texting her mom, how heartbreaking for her mom to think she was within moments of her death after texting

Oh God, I never thought of that. Fifteen minutes later.... I wonder if that's actually the time that witness saw her, too. Strolling along like she hadn't a care in the world...

 

[MassGuy]

If it’s been or might be found. There is a learning curve to utilizing this data.
Each time LE and the companies themselves applies tech to new and rising situations mistakes are made.

Including and challenging right to utilize it at all.

The FBI would know how to gather this data. They are experts at this type of thing, which is likely why they were brought in early on. Warrants would have already been executed for data that was unavailable to them without the physical device being in their possession. Having these items in hand, would simply involve technical experts downloading and analyzing the data.

 

[Followfacts]

Why would they have not charged him with kidnapping (yet)? It seems that is actually what they have him on record admitting to. Obviously they could have added the murder one charge as well or soon after. I'm sure there's a reason murder one is the charge they are holding him on that I'm just not getting. Could someone explain this to me?

Are there 3 crimes abduction, kidnaping and homicide? He’s been charged with Murder 1, will he also be charged with the other two? I have no idea how it works when crimes are bunched together.... most severe charge goes on the arrest warrant?