IA - Mollie Tibbetts, 20, Poweshiek County, 19 Jul 2018 *Arrest* #41

[MistyWaters]

I think it could be an inaccurate signal but am still trying to find out how far off the signal could be. I asked before but may have missed the answer. I also think he may have gone there to dispose of the evidence. To make sure it was not in the same location as he left the body.. wasn't it the very last signal they have? It would appear that he turned cell phone off or got rid of it at that time. Does anyone remember if the time of the ping in that area was ever mentioned? Was that the last form of " communication" they were referring to?

On the topic of cellphone pings -

You can find a lot of information on the internet if you like, but this is my understanding.

Cellphone pings are not to be confused with GPS, as GPS determines location. What is meant by a cellphone pings is that a certain cellphone connects to a specific cellphone tower. That automatically occurs because it’s within radius of the tower’s signal. The radius of cellphone towers are not all the same but in rural areas, google says 2 to 6 or 10 miles radius is common. The ping essentially is the same as a roving connection between the stationary tower and all the cellphones in the area. So even if the cellphone is inactive, through the ping to the tower, a call will be immediately routed to the recipient’s cellphone without having to search the world over.

I recall a case long ago where a suspect was captured because his cellphone was on and pinging as he travelled 100s of miles away from the crime scene. Much like silent cyber bread crumbs, LE was able to track him down.

If a cellphone is within radius of more than one cellphone tower, a cellphone will ping more than one tower but that’s more common in high density populations where cellphone traffic is heavy and towers are at volume capacity.

So as for this particular statement - “The cellphone pinged at the pig farm”. That just can’t be so because cellphone pings do not determine a precise location of any cellphone. Best I can conclude from that statement -
- There was a cell tower located on the pig farm, so yeah I suppose it could be stated the cellphone pinged it. But so would any cellphone within the broad radius of the pig farm and therefore that doesn’t prove Mollie’s cellphone was ever at the pig farm.
- or it could mean Mollie’s cellphone pinged at a certain cellphone tower and the pig farm was also within radius of that same cellphone tower. So her phone could’ve pinged from the pig farm and given other reasons including tips, LE determined the pig farm warranted further investigation. But in that example, “could’ve” isn’t the same as “did”.

JMO

 

[MsBetsy]

Weird people have weird ideas. Socially awkward ones too. Many exhibitionists think their victims are going to be turned on. That sounds completely inane, but these perpetrators have abnormal development.

Guess we will find out later the mental state of the suspect.

Are you suggesting Mr. Needles is an exhibitionist?! JK I was looking for the poster's specific interpretation of events. Not asking what type of killer he thinks he is, rather, what is it that makes him think Rivera may have been trying to pick Mollie up.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

If he only wanted a hook up then he would have known instantly it wasn't going to happen and he would have driven away.

His own statement said Mollie wanted no part of him.

So by his own statement a hookup was the furthest thing from her mind. It didn't matter what Mollie wanted. This was about his own devious perverted preplanned desires to take what he wanted by fear and control. Imo

 

[MsBetsy]

On the topic of cellphone pings -

You can find a lot of information on the internet if you like, but this is my understanding.

Cellphone pings are not to be confused with GPS, as GPS determines location. What is meant by a cellphone pings is that a certain cellphone connects to a specific cellphone tower. That automatically occurs because it’s within radius of the tower’s signal. The radius of cellphone towers are not all the same but in rural areas, google says 2 to 6 or 10 miles radius is common. The ping essentially is the same as a roving connection between the stationary tower and all the cellphones in the area. So even if the cellphone is inactive, through the ping to the tower, a call will be immediately routed to the recipient’s cellphone without having to search the world over.

I recall a case long ago where a suspect was captured because his cellphone was on and pinging as he travelled 100s of miles away from the crime scene. Much like silent cyber bread crumbs, LE was able to track him down.

If a cellphone is within radius of more than one cellphone tower, a cellphone will ping more than one tower but that’s more common in high density populations where cellphone traffic is heavy and towers are at volume capacity.

So as for this particular statement - “The cellphone pinged at the pig farm”. That just can’t be so because cellphone pings do not determine a precise location of any cellphone. Best I can conclude from that statement -
- There was a cell tower located on the pig farm, so yeah I suppose it could be stated the cellphone pinged it. But so would any cellphone within the broad radius of the pig farm and therefore that doesn’t prove Mollie’s cellphone was ever at the pig farm.
- or it could mean Mollie’s cellphone pinged at a certain cellphone tower and the pig farm was also within radius of that same cellphone tower. So her phone could’ve pinged from the pig farm and given other reasons including tips, LE determined the pig farm warranted further investigation. But in that example, “could’ve” isn’t the same as “did”.

JMO

Thank you so much! That covers everything. I was interested to know, but not so interested to research it, if you know what I mean.

 

[MistyWaters]

We are obviously interested to know if he killed her because he wanted to, or because he needed to eliminate a witness. Legally though, it doesn’t matter in regard to a first degree murder charge, as the crime came in the commission of felony kidnapping.

I do wonder if LE had reason to believe death occurred prior to her body being placed in the truck, in which case that’s not kidnapping.

Depending on the number of “multiple injuries”, it may be a path of less resistance to prove premeditated intent rather than time of death or a plot to kidnap.

 

[otto]

Be cause he couldn't leave a witness. She fought him, she wasn't going to let him SA her. Someone would have to kill me to SA me too... I'd fight tooth and nail.

Sex doesn't require eliminating a witness.

Rape, on the other hand, is not about sex, it's about power. It may result in murder.

 

[otto]

You don't think there's any connection to WC's farm then?

Absolutely not. WC had nothing do to with this.

 

[otto]

I'm saying the original intent was finding a "hookup", something he's been known to do in the past and something that's not uncommon at all.

I'm missing something. Why would anyone think that a jogger is interested in a "hook-up", or that the best way to hook-up is to drive around residential streets in a small town?

 

[MsBetsy]

Because you are a normal person with above average intelligence. Not everyone has social judgement, or the smarts to understand how 'society' works. Seems to be alot of them.

I don't know about above average, but thanks for the compliment. Believe me, I know the type of person that will persue and push things to the limit, even when you are polite and say no firmly as Mollie would do, they just keep going!! But I firmly believe he know very well that it is not possible that an educated, beautiful young girl with a serious boyfriend is going to consider being with them in any way, shape or form. Of course there are exceptions, but I think he knew Mollie was not one of them. I believe he had every intention of overpowering her, assaulting her, and killing her. I don't believe he would use a knife or inflict wounds that reflect chopping, stabbing, or whatever he did if he didn't intend to kill her.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I do wonder if LE had reason to believe death occurred prior to her body being placed in the truck, in which case that’s not kidnapping.

Depending on the number of “multiple injuries”, it may be a path of less resistance to prove premeditated intent rather than time of death or a plot to kidnap.

I believe he would still be gulty of kidnapping or abduction the second she was unable to leave under her own free will.

In many states victims do not have to be moved from one place to the other.

Suspects have been charged/convicted with kinapping when the victim was held against their will unable to freely leave even if they were held captive in their own home.

 

[SharonNeedles]

Just wondering, how would you think it possible that his intent was trying to pick her up? In my mind there would be no way he would think it possible. He might yell suggestive things to her, but even he would know that's not how to pick up a girl, I would think. Especially if he tried it in the past.

It's hard to really understand what living in these small rural communities is like until you've lived it. Driving around the same few blocks trying to make time with the girls you find is not uncommon here at all. I've done it myself albeit many, many years ago. And I can promise you it's going on on right now, tonight, in my community. I'm totally inclined to think that's what CR was doing because we know he's done it in the past and he was obviously making no attempt to not be seen in a small community with people who know him and can recognize him. How he managed to get away with it for five weeks totally blows my mind.

I can't fathom how it escalated into more than a failed pickup attempt...

 

[MsBetsy]

You don't think there's any connection to WC's farm then?

You don't think it possible he could have stopped there to get rid of evidence? He had to go somewhere and apparently it wasn't any place where people would be if he had to change and get rid of bloody clothes.

 

[Sanz]

So many of us have tossed around the fact that CR (blocking), his memory - is CR being in denial and lying to cover for his crime against MT.

In the middle section of the affidavit while CR was being questioned he told detectives when he panicked...and got angry...he blocks his memory.

Since LE was told by CR that he blocks his memory when he is panicked. Can that be used as a loophole for his attorney to contest his questioning was not done legally. If the attorney wants to pursue a Mental Health disability?

I’ve been checking out (blocking) and found that “Mental Blocks” are psychiatric disorders. And should the attorney move that way he would be tested I would assume.

I know for me it’s difficult to think that this could in anyway be a Mental Health problem.

I am wondering what type of impact if any could this have in trial?

Mental Blocks are a Psychiatric Disorder They are a generalized with dissociative disorder.

Dissociative disorders - are mental illnesses that involve disruptions or breakdowns of memory, consciousness, awareness, identity, and/or perception. When one or more of these functions is disrupted, symptoms can result.

With dissociative amnesia, the memories still exist but are deeply buried within the person's mind and cannot be recalled.

However, the memories might resurface on their own or after being triggered by something in the person's surroundings.

https://www.webmd.com/mental-health/dissociative-amnesia

 

[SharonNeedles]

Absolutely not. WC had nothing do to with this.

I guess more specifically: you don't think purported cell phone pings around WC's farm are related? To get a direct route to and from the field you'd have to assume either that ping didn't happen or it was off by miles.

 

[SharonNeedles]

I'm missing something. Why would anyone think that a jogger is interested in a "hook-up", or that the best way to hook-up is to drive around residential streets in a small town?

For many the ONLY way to hook up is to drive around the small town and hope you find somebody. And in CR's case specifically, he didn't have a lot of other options.

 

[BUF]

Sex doesn't require eliminated a witness.

Rape, on the other hand, is not about sex, it's about power. It may result in murder.

^^^ This!

 

[MistyWaters]

If he only wanted a hook up then he would have known instantly it wasn't going to happen and he would have driven away.

His own statement said Mollie wanted no part of him.

So by his own statement a hookup was the furthest thing from her mind. It didn't matter what Mollie wanted. This was about his own devious perverted preplanned desires to take what he wanted by fear and control. Imo

Some aspects of this case sort of remind me of road rage, an incident whereby a raging lunatic becomes ignited by something another driver does, totally loses it and attacks, knifes or shoots the innocent victim.

I have also crossed paths with people who have severe temper control problems and although they haven’t murdered anyone that I know of, their lack of self control in certain circumstances is absolutely frightening. Reasoning is to no avail. I suppose that’s why I can imagine a scenario much like CR confessed to. If anyone here has never crossed paths with people with tempers such as that, consider yourself very lucky.

 

[SharonNeedles]

Weird people have weird ideas. Socially awkward ones too. Many exhibitionists think their victims are going to be turned on. That sounds completely inane, but these perpetrators have abnormal development.

Guess we will find out later the mental state of the suspect.

Spot on. I was just talking to a girl I work with about men who have sent her unsolicited and unwanted pics of their genitalia. I don't get it, is that ever a successful approach? Just because it doesn't make sense to me and doesn't seem like a very successful approach doesn't mean it's not happening.

 

[Whiteorchids]

For many the ONLY way to hook up is to drive around the small town and hope you find somebody. And in CR's case specifically, he didn't have a lot of other options.

What about church? School, local town dances? bowling? Is there a community center with local events going on?

 

[Al Hoffman]

Just a few random thoughts. In the video of him arriving at Court and getting out of the truck he had a little pep in his step hopping out of the truck. Not a care in the world? I was happy to see there was a perp walk. In Court he appeared to be relaxed and showed no emotion. No remorse, no fear. Nothing. IMO

I once had a remarkable Jack Russel/Chihuahua 5lb mix dog that I lived with. He was bitten in the ribs by much larger a wolf-hybrid, and developed an abcess. It really hurt him to walk (he would have been dragging his tail in the mud, except that it wasn't raining).

Anyway, when we were walking up to the vet's office, his head was hanging until he heard dogs barking in the vet's kennel. His head and tail immediately snapped up, and he did all but beat the dust off his coat to look his best. He walked into that office with his head held high, and all but a sneer on his face.

Even a dog knows to NEVER show weakness or fear in front of his adversaries. That little guy taught me a lot. I still miss him to this very day!