Identified! OR - Cave Junction, 'Annie Doe' WhtFem UP10929, 16-20, Redwood Hwy, Aug'71 - Annie Lehman

[Mrs. Badcrumble]

NO MATTER THE OUTCOME: This is a HUGE victory! Been following this case since I moved to the Northwest, and contemplated working her case like I have with the Fly Creek and Finley Creek Jane Doe’s; but there was enough activity on it to let it be.

I am extremely awed at the work Margaret and Colleen have done and will be for some time. Who would have thought in 1971 DNA would be an extremely important thing in forensic science?

Again, I am eager to hear what happens here...this has me excited and nervous!

Breathe out, Jason! According to Margaret Press, Annie already have DNA matches! I will remain optimistic

 

[JasonFutchLakeCityFL]

Breathe out, Jason! According to Margaret Press, Annie already have DNA matches! I will remain optimistic

NO WAY! Wow!!!!!

 

[folieadeuxnola]

[UPDATE on Annie Doe:]
we are working with numerous matches (some in the third cousin range) and notice that several are from New Zealand. We’re encouraging anyone from NZ who has tested to upload their results to GEDmatch.com (but first read the site policy!) We don’t know that Annie herself was from NZ, but it seems that at least one or more branches of her family ended up there.

NZ families often originated in the UK and also typically have relatives in Australia.

 

[Mrs. Badcrumble]

[UPDATE on Annie Doe:]
we are working with numerous matches (some in the third cousin range) and notice that several are from New Zealand. We’re encouraging anyone from NZ who has tested to upload their results to GEDmatch.com (but first read the site policy!) We don’t know that Annie herself was from NZ, but it seems that at least one or more branches of her family ended up there.

NZ families often originated in the UK and also typically have relatives in Australia.

CALLING ALL KIWIS ON WEBSLEUTHS!

DNA Doe Project

 

[leilarose68]

CALLING ALL KIWIS ON WEBSLEUTHS!

DNA Doe Project

And also Aussies and Brits!

 

[sunnynz]

CALLING ALL KIWIS ON WEBSLEUTHS!

DNA Doe Project

Wow! Here I am lol.... Thanks folieadeuxnola for bringing this to my attention. Not familiar at all with this case previously but doing some catching up right now.

I got excited about the MH mark on the ring because the largest jewellery chain store here in NZ is called Michael Hill but then I realised their first store didn't open until the late 70s.

We did have the Woolworths chain back in those days though so maybe her clothing could have been from NZ? Interesting discussion around the sizing of her jeans - a New Zealand size 13/14 would equate to a US size 8 I believe in today's sizing.

I looked up our NZ missing persons database (which is quite small, and we have zero UIDs!). No women reported as going missing in the US, only a couple of men.

All of this assumes she was from NZ which is obviously a long shot and it may well just be that she has relatives who ended up here.

I would note though that there is a long tradition of young New Zealanders taking what we call an 'OE', an 'overseas experience'. This is a tradition where after you finish high school or university you head off overseas for a few years to travel, backpacking usually, or do a student exhange programme or similar. It's a rite of passage (in Australia too) and extremely common. There's a chance she travelled overseas as a young person and her family thought she just lost contact and didn't report her missing. Kiwis are travellers, so the chance of her being a Kiwi travelling in the US would not be unusual at all. It's more strange here to find someone who hasn't travelled overseas.

 

[Mrs. Badcrumble]

Wow! Here I am lol....

(...)

I looked up our NZ missing persons database (which is quite small, and we have zero UIDs!). No women reported as going missing in the US, only a couple of men.

All of this assumes she was from NZ which is obviously a long shot and it may well just be that she has relatives who ended up here.

I would note though that there is a long tradition of young New Zealanders taking what we call an 'OE', an 'overseas experience'. This is a tradition where after you finish high school or university you head off overseas for a few years to travel, backpacking usually, or do a student exhange programme or similar. It's a rite of passage (in Australia too) and extremely common. There's a chance she travelled overseas as a young person and her family thought she just lost contact and didn't report her missing. Kiwis are travellers, so the chance of her being a Kiwi travelling in the US would not be unusual at all. It's more strange here to find someone who hasn't travelled overseas.

Woah, I yelled after a kiwi and a kiwi came!

The matches doesn't necessarily mean that Annie herself was from NZ, but a distant relative was, as you stated. Lots of good points here, sunnynz! Annie also had a large amount of North-West European heritage, which makes sense if she indeed hailed from NZ/Australia.

 

[Alleykins]

Very interesting. Her isotope results put her growing up in the US. Let's say she were from the UK, AU or NZ, wouldn't her isotopes be greatly different than here?
'Jane Annie Doe' could have been from Great Lakes region

 

[the_missing]

There could be isotopically-similar regions in New Zealand.

I think it's unlikely Annie is from NZ - otherwise, her family would have reported her missing (you'd hope). But it's not impossible that she might be from NZ.

 

[folieadeuxnola]

I would not go so far as to say she was from NZ/AU, however does she have relatives there obviously yes. I have (4) 4th cousins in NZ and (2) in AU and several distant one's from my DNA matches have no idea how we are related thou. But as MP stated in the post many from the UK region migrated to NZ, AU and to the US way back when.

That would make more sense to me then actually being a native from NZ/AU just that some of her ancestors migrated there many generations back.

Getting the word out is a key factory for those whom have taken the DNA test in NZ/AU and would accept the terms and conditions to load up to Gedmatch.

 

[Gardener1850]

[UPDATE on Annie Doe:]
we are working with numerous matches (some in the third cousin range) and notice that several are from New Zealand. We’re encouraging anyone from NZ who has tested to upload their results to GEDmatch.com (but first read the site policy!) We don’t know that Annie herself was from NZ, but it seems that at least one or more branches of her family ended up there.

NZ families often originated in the UK and also typically have relatives in Australia.

This is such fascinating and exciting progress!
@sunnynz do you have any recommendations for our members getting this request from DNA Doe Project into the press there? Can you share the DDP page and requests about Annie Doe with some news groups? Or any NZ social media groups you are connected to?
Sounds like UK and Australia media coverage would help too.
I feel optimistic about this case.
But I hope they can find some closer cousins to ID her faster/easier.

 

[JasonFutchLakeCityFL]

Wow! Here I am lol.... Thanks folieadeuxnola for bringing this to my attention. Not familiar at all with this case previously but doing some catching up right now.

I got excited about the MH mark on the ring because the largest jewellery chain store here in NZ is called Michael Hill but then I realised their first store didn't open until the late 70s.

We did have the Woolworths chain back in those days though so maybe her clothing could have been from NZ? Interesting discussion around the sizing of her jeans - a New Zealand size 13/14 would equate to a US size 8 I believe in today's sizing.

I looked up our NZ missing persons database (which is quite small, and we have zero UIDs!). No women reported as going missing in the US, only a couple of men.

All of this assumes she was from NZ which is obviously a long shot and it may well just be that she has relatives who ended up here.

I would note though that there is a long tradition of young New Zealanders taking what we call an 'OE', an 'overseas experience'. This is a tradition where after you finish high school or university you head off overseas for a few years to travel, backpacking usually, or do a student exhange programme or similar. It's a rite of passage (in Australia too) and extremely common. There's a chance she travelled overseas as a young person and her family thought she just lost contact and didn't report her missing. Kiwis are travellers, so the chance of her being a Kiwi travelling in the US would not be unusual at all. It's more strange here to find someone who hasn't travelled overseas.

I have hosted a “Kiwi” in the past, as I am a CouchSurfer host (and occasionally a guest). They are pretty cool. In fact I have three OE’s coming this month; one from Ecuador and two from Russia. You are correct, a lot of foreigners not from North America do these OE’s quite often, and I have learned from my Couchsurfing experiences that they love to travel to the SW and the Pacific Northwest because of its abundance of hiking and camping opportunities.

Ive never had an Australian OE but my experience with the NZ’r was amazing! He was from a tribe called the Maori and he told me incredible stories of growing up doing tribal rituals and how he still maintains his culture (he had some amazing tattoos!). He even taught me the traditional dance, which I would never do in public lol. I still have a connection with him so I may bring this case up to him and see if he can help out in any way.

 

[sunnynz]

This is such fascinating and exciting progress!
@sunnynz do you have any recommendations for our members getting this request from DNA Doe Project into the press there? Can you share the DDP page and requests about Annie Doe with some news groups? Or any NZ social media groups you are connected to?
Sounds like UK and Australia media coverage would help too.
I feel optimistic about this case.
But I hope they can find some closer cousins to ID her faster/easier.

I have a friend who who is very active in the genealogy community here. Will get her to share in all the groups she belongs to. It’s not that hard to get media here to take on any overseas news story that has an interesting local angle so I will forward it on to a few news outlets and see what happens

 

[Gardener1850]

I have a friend who who is very active in the genealogy community here. Will get her to share in all the groups she belongs to. It’s not that hard to get media here to take on any overseas news story that has an interesting local angle so I will forward it on to a few news outlets and see what happens

Thank you Sunnynz! You rock!

 

[AmonAmarther]

I have a friend who who is very active in the genealogy community here. Will get her to share in all the groups she belongs to. It’s not that hard to get media here to take on any overseas news story that has an interesting local angle so I will forward it on to a few news outlets and see what happens

Sounds amazing! Thank you, @sunnynz

 

[Alleykins]

I have hosted a “Kiwi” in the past, as I am a CouchSurfer host (and occasionally a guest). They are pretty cool. In fact I have three OE’s coming this month; one from Ecuador and two from Russia. You are correct, a lot of foreigners not from North America do these OE’s quite often, and I have learned from my Couchsurfing experiences that they love to travel to the SW and the Pacific Northwest because of its abundance of hiking and camping opportunities.

Ive never had an Australian OE but my experience with the NZ’r was amazing! He was from a tribe called the Maori and he told me incredible stories of growing up doing tribal rituals and how he still maintains his culture (he had some amazing tattoos!). He even taught me the traditional dance, which I would never do in public lol. I still have a connection with him so I may bring this case up to him and see if he can help out in any way.

Haka! They are really cool to watch.

 

[carbuff]

Don't forget Canada for relatives.

It's my impression that people move around pretty freely within the Commonwealth countries. My friend's husband's family is originally from Northern Ireland but none of them live there any more. He grew up in the Liverpool area before migrating to the US. The family moved to, um, east of London I think. His sister is in Australia; his aunt lived in Australia for a long time, returned to a different part of England, and then retired to Canada before she died.

So it wouldn't surprise me at all if she turns out to have relatives in many places. Fingers crossed that we can find them!

 

[sunnynz]

Don't forget Canada for relatives.

It's my impression that people move around pretty freely within the Commonwealth countries. My friend's husband's family is originally from Northern Ireland but none of them live there any more. He grew up in the Liverpool area before migrating to the US. The family moved to, um, east of London I think. His sister is in Australia; his aunt lived in Australia for a long time, returned to a different part of England, and then retired to Canada before she died.

So it wouldn't surprise me at all if she turns out to have relatives in many places. Fingers crossed that we can find them!

Agree.

Have sent the DNA Doe Project info to the three big news outlets here in NZ, who knows if they'll do anything with it. I'll keep an eye out and post back here if I see anything.

 

[leilarose68]

This is such fascinating and exciting progress!
@sunnynz do you have any recommendations for our members getting this request from DNA Doe Project into the press there? Can you share the DDP page and requests about Annie Doe with some news groups? Or any NZ social media groups you are connected to?
Sounds like UK and Australia media coverage would help too.
I feel optimistic about this case.
But I hope they can find some closer cousins to ID her faster/easier.

I made contact with someone on reddit who works for Stuff.NZ which I guess is a popular media site in New Zealand and he's passing it on to his editors. He comments in some unsolved mystery-type subreddits so there's an interest there.

 

[sunnynz]

I made contact with someone on reddit who works for Stuff.NZ which I guess is a popular media site in New Zealand and he's passing it on to his editors. He comments in some unsolved mystery-type subreddits so there's an interest there.

Fantastic! Stuff is one of the ones I contacted too. Hopefully they run something.