CA - Multiple casualties after 'active shooter' opens fire, Thousand Oaks, 08 Nov 2018

[UKslueth2018]

True. My daughter is a nurse and says that's where many were taken.

TO is my hometown and I have friends with children still missing.

Heart and thoughts are with you and all your friends xx

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

It's clear that the shooter's mother was concerned. I wonder if she was informed about California's 'red flag' law.

5 states have ‘red flag laws’ allowing courts to take guns from people deemed a threat

In 2014, California became the first state to let family members ask a judge to remove firearms from a relative who appears to pose a threat. Its legislature took action after a mentally ill man, Elliot Rodger, killed six students and wounded 13 others near the University of California, Santa Barbara, before killing himself.

California’s law also empowers police to petition for the protective orders, which can require authorities to remove firearms for up to one year. Connecticut, Indiana, Oregon and Washington also have some version of a red flag law.

 

[human]

We had mentally ill people since the beginning of time. Heck, in the old days they didn't even have medication to control the symptoms.

I don't know. Maybe the medication is part of the problem.

But the real question is why so many crazy or angry people feel mass murder is a resolution for them.

Medication is given all over the world. Mental health is an issue everywhere. Japan, Europe, Britain. People take psychotropic drugs.

 

[human]

Bingo. My thoughts exactly.

We did have vets returning home with mental health issues in the past, and my guess is if they were violent, it was confined to being violent in their own homes. Of course, that is also horrible, but my point is that I think the problem is not new. What is "new" is using weapons against the public in mass shootings. (And by "new," I mean in the past generation or so.)

I also wonder about the medications and if the "cures" are worse than the illness for some people.

I've been saying for years that we need to face the fact we have an angry culture and to roll up our sleeves to fix that. I think we don't do that because....it's hard and it means making changes.

jmo

edited for clarity

The rest of the world uses psychotropic drugs as well.

 

[UKslueth2018]

True. My daughter is a nurse and says that's where many were taken.

TO is my hometown and I have friends with children still missing.

I can't even begin to imagine how awful that waiting for news would be. Makes me feel sick even thinking about it xx

 

[enelram]

I thought politics were off limits and I legitimately don't understand the prescription medication discussion. Is there any information about the shooter I missed?

Regarding the PTSD- There was a show on PBS this week showing
the problems of a vet w/ PTSD. I was totally shocked when it
showed the vet lining up all 30 of his medications that he was taking daily. And he got more in the mail that same day.
The vet also mentioned the various mood swings that he knew
the pills caused him to have.
I wonder if the drugs these returning vets get prescribed aren't
contributing to their problems in their home lives????

 

[Elley Mae]

“During his time in the military, Long, who was a corporal, was deployed in Afghanistan and received multiple awards including Marine Corps Good Conduct Medal, Sea Service Deployment Ribbon, an Afghanistan Campaign Medal, a Global War on Terrorism Service Medal and a National Defense Service Medal.“

Thousand Oaks shooting: What we know about the massacre at Borderline Bar and Grill

(Unbelievable, the Irony!
“Global War on Terrorism” and “National Defense” Service Medals... nobody had any “Defense” last night against this “Terrorist”.)

Yoga shooter last week was a vet too.

ETA:
(What the heck am I writing here? I feel like I’m in the twilight zone..“Defense” and “War on Terrorism medals”, “yoga shooter”...

It’s just like a poster’s signature here, sorry can’t remember who:

“the enemy is here. beware.”

Dat be me.

 

[margarita25]

I knew this shooter would be in his 20s MOO and I figured he used a Glock when initial reports were saying handgun (about 20 years ago I used to have a Glock 17 9mm with an extended clip that could shoot 17 rounds). I had wondered about an Oozie but those are so heavy and old school gangster.

Glocks are lighter weight, often choice/issued for Law Enforcement.

——-


ETA:
How The Glock Became America's Weapon Of Choice

 

[UKslueth2018]

Regarding the PTSD- There was a show on PBS this week showing
the problems of a vet w/ PTSD. I was totally shocked when it
showed the vet lining up all 30 of his medications that he was taking daily. And he got more in the mail that same day.
The vet also mentioned the various mood swings that he knew
the pills caused him to have.
I wonder if the drugs these returning vets get prescribed aren't
contributing to their problems in their home lives????

I think everyone genetically is made different so reactions in one will be different in others.. 30 medications is a significant amount... And I am no doctor but that seems excessive xx

 

[human]

“6 off-duty officers were in the bar last night
There were six off-duty officers from various agencies inside the Borderline Bar & Grill at the time of the shooting, Ventura County Sheriff Geoff Dean said.”

Snip

“Suspect Ian Long served in US Marine Corps from August 2008 to March 2013
From CNN's Ryan Browne
The suspected gunman Ian David Long was on active duty with the US Marine Corps from August 2008 to March 2013, according to Department of Defense records.”

6 off-duty officers were in the bar last night

——

Gunman Who Killed 12 in Thousand Oaks Shooting Is Identified as a Former Marine

“THOUSAND OAKS, Calif. — A Marine Corps veteran who had served in Afghanistan fatally shot at least 12 people Wednesday night when he stormed a crowded country and western dance hall in Thousand Oaks, Calif., the authorities said.

The Ventura County sheriff, Geoff Dean, said that the gunman, Ian David Long of nearby Newbury Park, Calif., apparently took his own life after being confronted by officers responding to the Wednesday night attack. The .45-caliber handgun he used was purchased legally, but had been outfitted with an extended magazine.“

——

“Also among the dead is 22-year-old Cody Coffman, his father, Jason Coffman, overcome with emotion, told reporters.

"I am speechless and heartbroken," he said. "I cannot believe that it's happened to my family."

"I just want him to know that he is going to be missed," Jason Coffman said of his oldest child in between tears. "Son, I love you so much."“

Thousand Oaks shooting live updates: 12 dead including officer, suspect identified

In MN where I lived, off duty police were required to wear their guns. Is this the case there?

 

[margarita25]

In MN where I lived, off duty police were required to wear their guns. Is this the case there?

This is a good question,
firearms are not allowed in places where they sell alcohol as I understand it (note to check ATF site), but if they were LE I don’t know.

 

[enelram]

In MN where I lived, off duty police were required to wear their guns. Is this the case there?

good question. But many bars today are gun free zones and have
metal detectors at the door. This one did have at least one security
guard on duty that night.

 

[human]

“During his time in the military, Long, who was a corporal, was deployed in Afghanistan and received multiple awards including Marine Corps Good Conduct Medal, Sea Service Deployment Ribbon, an Afghanistan Campaign Medal, a Global War on Terrorism Service Medal and a National Defense Service Medal.“

Thousand Oaks shooting: What we know about the massacre at Borderline Bar and Grill

(Unbelievable, the Irony!
“Global War on Terrorism” and “National Defense” Service Medals... nobody had any “Defense” last night against this “Terrorist”.)

Yoga shooter last week was a vet too.

ETA:
(What the heck am I writing here? I feel like I’m in the twilight zone..“Defense” and “War on Terrorism medals”, “yoga shooter”...

It’s just like a poster’s signature here, sorry can’t remember who:

“the enemy is here. beware.”

Research shows several in shootings were vets, IMO.

Probably every vet needs exit assesment and some kind of mental health help be it just a little or a lot.

 

[margarita25]

good question. But many bars today are gun free zones and have
metal detectors at the door. This one did have at least one security
guard on duty that night.

Iirc Glock’s don’t set off metal detectors...not sure if it’s an old wive’s tale or not..I used to remember old discussions about this back in the day. What about the firing pin, etc...note to look up.

 

[human]

I was reading a story that said this bar was very popular with police and military.

How many security people did they have there?

 

[margarita25]

I was reading a story that said this bar was very popular with police and military.

How many security people did they have there?

This particularly shooting for me is Shades of Pulse meets Vegas (well and Yoga considering he is a vet.)

 

[margarita25]

I feel like this is a good time to bring forward again one of my favorite things I’ve heard on WS which was the last comment made on slain officer Montrell Jackson's fb (e was killed shortly after in the Louisiana race riots”:

“Do not let hate infect your heart”.
-Montrell Jackson

—-

Watching the Ventura Sherriff speak last night was gut wrenching. His tears and him talking about Sargeant Helus.

He made a similar comment the Pittsburgh mayor made iirc, which was something along the lines of we can not rationize the irrational, that these guys ARE terrorists and that they ARE mentally ill.

 

[Inthedetails]

This particularly shooting of me is Shades of Pulse meets Vegas (well and Yoga considering he is a vet.)

What they all have in common is the desire to kill innocent people at random in one setting. So, it seems like the solution is fixing that desire.

jmo

 

[MaryG12]

The thing is, he was a good guy with a gun before he wasn't.

Before we debate it too much though, I am reminded that the gun debate won't find any resolution here on WS. No matter what you believe or I believe, there are deeper problems that drive people to do horrible things and that is the point I was making in my post. This forum is our reminder that the good guys can't always stop the bad ones before something bad happens. We have to solve the underlying reasons for people being in fear, in distress, or in rage. I am sad for all those hurt in this event, including the perp.

I am inclined to think these shooters not only lack a conscience (which is different from mental illness) but also the "relative morality" that seems to pervade our society.

What may have seemed right to Long, the shooter, can be considered wrong by the rest of the nation, perhaps to many other nations.

 

[margarita25]

When I said 12 days ago in Pittsburgh that these shootings were going to rise no waaaay could I have imagined next would come 3 more (yoga, detox center and night club) within 12 days.

Here’s my big worry guys (in addition to the current problem at hand):

We know that these mass shooters usually either a)kill themselves b)are neutralized c)taken into custody.

Long story short—right now there is a clear distinction between serial shooters and mass shooters-one of these days the shooter is going to get away and then guess what, then we are going to have a “serial mass shooter”. And that’s going to be messssssed up (not that this already isn’t, ykwim.)

Everything is jmo, moo.