AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #24

[andreww]

The luck was that the car was caught on video.

Exactly, luck of the draw. That is the first thing LE does these days, gather all the video, and hope that the perp is on there. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

 

[tiffkinsadder]

Do you have a link to see the door? I haven’t ever seen it.

 

[otto]

The neighbors would have heard more than two shots then right?

The neighbors reported two shots roughly 30 minutes prior to the 911 call. Isn't that one of the clear facts of Jayme's disappearance?

 

[otto]

Exactly, luck of the draw. That is the first thing LE does these days, gather all the video, and hope that the perp is on there. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

Fortunately police are similarly lucky in this case where they have some vague idea about what type of car may have been used.

 

[tiffkinsadder]

The neighbors reported two shots roughly 30 minutes prior to the 911 call. Isn't that one of the clear facts of Jayme's disappearance?

I think so.

 

[andreww]

One thing that keeps hanging in my head that is bothering me. Although Jayme's cell phone was in the kitchen charging, I can't help but wonder if she had a burner phone or maybe friends old ipod or some way of accessing the internet that her parents didn't know about. A boyfriend could have given her a way to contact him so that her parents didn't find out. I took away my sons phone then found out his girlfriend while at school had given him an old phone so that he could get online and still talk to people. In my opinion this may be why the dogs were called in to look for additional cell phones or tablets etc... There could be an additional phone buried deep in a closet or anywhere. Again just my opinion.

I think they would be able to determine that quite quickly. Every device has a unique IP address, sites like facebook could easily provide data that would show from what IP addresses her account had been accessed. If there are regular occurrences of different IPs then it is safe to say she was using a second device.

 

[tiffkinsadder]

I appreciate everyone here,

 

[tiffkinsadder]

I’ve been wondering was Jayme taken out the front door or back door?

 

[otto]

Who said they did not bring a phone? What would lead you to think that they wore gloves? Its quite possible that, if Jayme was the target, he never took his hands off the gun. If he had a phone, there would be no way to identify him. Once they catch him and identify his phone, they will be able to show if he was in the area, but thats about it.

Cell towers will have a record of all phone numbers that routed through the towers at the time that Jayme was abducted. If the abductor's phone was turned on, and if the phone used a number that is registered to an owner, then it should be possible to narrow down the list of people in the area at the time of the abduction.

 

[andreww]

The neighbors would have heard more than two shots then right?

I've thought about this quite a bit as I personally believe the neighbours account to be accurate. So I think that either;

- The perp used a shotgun. First shot passed through the door and killed James, second shot mortally wounded Denise.

- First shot went through the door, second killed James, and any other shots simply could not be heard by the neighbour as the perp was indoors.

 

[andreww]

I’ve been wondering was Jayme taken out the front door or back door?

Unknown, but I'd assume the perp left the same way he came in.

 

[otto]

I've thought about this quite a bit as I personally believe the neighbours account to be accurate. So I think that either;

- The perp used a shotgun. First shot passed through the door and killed James, second shot mortally wounded Denise.

- First shot went through the door, second killed James, and any other shots simply could not be heard by the neighbour as the perp was indoors.

Do we know that both parents were shot?

 

[andreww]

Cell towers will have a record of all phone numbers that routed through the towers at the time that Jayme was abducted. If the abductor's phone was turned on, and if the phone used a number that is registered to an owner, then it should be possible to narrow down the list of people in the area at the time of the abduction.

I would guess that literally thousands of devices pinged that tower. Odds of tracking down the perp that way are about as good as going door to door.

A typical cellphone has enough power to reach a cell tower up to 45 miles away. Depending on the technology of the cellphone network, the maximum distance may be as low as 22 miles because the signal otherwise takes too long for the highly accurate timing of the cellphone protocol to work reliably.

So a tower will be able to receive pings for up to 45 miles away, thats a 90 mile circle.

 

[Rubiconbob]

Who said they did not bring a phone? What would lead you to think that they wore gloves? Its quite possible that, if Jayme was the target, he never took his hands off the gun. If he had a phone, there would be no way to identify him. Once they catch him and identify his phone, they will be able to show if he was in the area, but thats about it.

Can they not locate phones hitting nearby tower at that time ?? Then confirm which phones ping other towers later in the morning?? Essentially tracking perp
Moving away ?? I think they can it’s just red tape and lag in getting info from each tower ??

 

[photographer4]

Something kept nagging me about Jayme's dog, Molly being shaved. Others said it could be routine grooming and I get that. I guess what bothered me was why now? This families life has to be a 24/7 nightmare being pulled in a million directions, not to mention trying to reconcile the tragic deaths and missing niece. Yet they wanted he dog groomed in the midst of it? Possibly. I think it has more to do with evidence. Hair, saliva. urine, feces. Any of which could be on the perp/s, in their car, anywhere, without their knowledge.Not to mention Mollys' hair being tested. I started reading about animal DNA solving crimes and it is it's own science. The UK actually has it's own CODIS for it. I am truly hoping this is the case. Here is a link with a few examples for anyone interested. JMO
Pet CSI: How Dog And Cat DNA Nabs Bad Guys
How Animal DNA Puts Killers Behind Bars

If they thought the dog MIGHT have any DNA on it, the police would have had it examined before releasing it to the family. Its entirely possible that they did find blood from someone on the dog hair...Maybe they snipped a section of it, and we just don't know it because it wasn't visible to us at the time when family had the dog for their presser. I highly doubt they'd go back this long after the fact to get hair from the dog etc... but hey, who knows...

 

[photographer4]

Cell towers will have a record of all phone numbers that routed through the towers at the time that Jayme was abducted. If the abductor's phone was turned on, and if the phone used a number that is registered to an owner, then it should be possible to narrow down the list of people in the area at the time of the abduction.

Or...a list of active phones in the area around that time. Someone could have borrowed / stolen someone else's phone for this particular crime... or used a burner....

 

[andreww]

Do we know that both parents were shot?

Yes

 

[andreww]

Can they not locate phones hitting nearby tower at that time ?? Then confirm which phones ping other towers later in the morning?? Essentially tracking perp
Moving away ?? I think they can it’s just red tape and lag in getting info from each tower ??

Sure they could, but pretty much every phone in Barron is going to ping off the same tower. The data is just that, a list of numbers. There is no location and no tracking of movement.

 

[otto]

I would guess that literally thousands of devices pinged that tower. Odds of tracking down the perp that way are about as good as going door to door.

A typical cellphone has enough power to reach a cell tower up to 45 miles away. Depending on the technology of the cellphone network, the maximum distance may be as low as 22 miles because the signal otherwise takes too long for the highly accurate timing of the cellphone protocol to work reliably.

So a tower will be able to receive pings for up to 45 miles away, thats a 90 mile circle.

Cell phones are located using triangulation, and since the house was somewhat rural, many phones can be ruled out because they are not within the triangulation area. Other phones can be ruled out because they are assigned to a local residence. If the abductor is local, then this method of identifying a suspect will not work. If the abductor is not local, then it may be one method to identify a list of potential suspects.

My only point is that the suspect does not have to be identified to know where his cell phone was on the night of the abduction. Cell towers will identify phones that were in the area and a suspect can be identified based on a review of phones in the area at the time of the abduction. Reasons this may not work are that the suspect's phone was turned off prior to approaching the house, or the phone belongs in the area because the suspect is local.

 

[bellyup]

Something kept nagging me about Jayme's dog, Molly being shaved. Others said it could be routine grooming and I get that. I guess what bothered me was why now? This families life has to be a 24/7 nightmare being pulled in a million directions, not to mention trying to reconcile the tragic deaths and missing niece. Yet they wanted he dog groomed in the midst of it? Possibly. I think it has more to do with evidence. Hair, saliva. urine, feces. Any of which could be on the perp/s, in their car, anywhere, without their knowledge.Not to mention Mollys' hair being tested. I started reading about animal DNA solving crimes and it is it's own science. The UK actually has it's own CODIS for it. I am truly hoping this is the case. Here is a link with a few examples for anyone interested. JMO
Pet CSI: How Dog And Cat DNA Nabs Bad Guys
How Animal DNA Puts Killers Behind Bars

I think it's more likely the dog just had blood in his fur from the victims and so they shaved it down. They may have tested it but I'm not hopeful there's anything there. DNA results would have been returned likely by two weeks or sooner (with FBI involvement) after Jayme went missing.