GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #58

[amiless]

Yes, from the "friend" that didnt seem like such a great friend imo.

I've known several people that have decided to change pronunciation or spelling of their names and I never thought of them as rebellious.

Moo

Yeah, that did not strike me as rebellious behavior either. I think that's one of the reasons why that part stood out to me.

 

[mtnlites]

I'm still not sure that the 2017 search wasn't a typo. There were at least 3 others in the document. For instance, on page 1892 (Discovery) it says:
I spoke with Nicole Atkinson, via telephone, regarding the events that occurred on the evening of 10/12/18 while Shanann was still in Arizona. The conversation was audibly recorded.

Obviously, SW wasn't alive in October and they meant August.

 

[PommyMommy]

The financial issues claim came from CW so I'm skeptical. It may have just been more of placing himself in the victim mode to LE and his AP.
His timeline as far as the mortgage being behind and the 401K loan don't make sense to me. As a former investment rep, Shanann could not have taken a loan out from his 401K without his knowledge. If there was a loan taken out, he participated in it.

Also, does anyone know how long the FA worked at his job? $10,000 takes time to build up in a 401K. And most companies in my experience limit the amount of a loan. For example 50% of the account value.

He started at Anadarko approx Jan 2015 per the bankruptcy documents filed June 2015. MOO

 

[MassGuy]

I found it particularly interesting how concerned CW was with what people would think of him, and how many times he asked that question during his interrogation. What people might think seemed more important to him than the fact that his family was gone. It’s like, duh! You just murdered your family! What do you think people are going to think of you? They’re going to hate you and think you’re a monster! The same for Cindy. That’s all she cared about. In her mind if she said nasty things about Shanann, it would make her look good, and CW look better. As we try to figure out CW’s actions and motives, I think many of his decisions were made based on what people would think of him. If he left the mother of his two children who was 15 weeks pregnant with his third child, he would look bad. If she left him, he would look good. If she took all the children with her, he would look even better. People would feel sorry for him. Once he got caught if Shanann killed the children, she would look bad and he would look good.

Yup. This is illustrated with his text conversation with Shanann’s friend Cassie on the day he killed them.

Chris: “I really don’t want you to think I’m a bad person Cassie.”

Cassie: “Right now I don’t care about you or your relationship, or what type of person you are or not, or what I think of you and I’m not trying to be rude when I say that.”

Page 2125

 

[Tortoise]

I will have to find where it is in the documents, but Shanann's father told LE that he was unaware they had financial issues, and neither Shanann or Chris ever asked to borrow money from him.

I happen to be right on that page now. It's discovery page 679, and/or pg 602 of 1960.

 

[Dum-Dum Sucker]

I read in the documents something about Shannan being rebellious in pronouncing her name a different way. It's so much to go back through, but I know it's there.

Thanks.

Here's what I found on Discovery Page 461:

"JEREMY said that SHANANN was always kind of strange to him, with all of her health problems. He said that she pronounced her name SHA-NAAN but her mom pronounced it SHANNON. JEREMY said that he felt SHANANN was kind of rebellious."

eta: JINX, @MassGuy !

 

[PommyMommy]

It is a weird coincidence. And there are too many Nicks and Nicoles (and variations of spellings) to keep straight.

Amanda's too! Besides Thayer and McMahon, the attorney representing the Watts in the HOA was named Amanda. MOO

 

[Jennifer17]

Yup. This is illustrated with his text conversation with Shanann’s friend Cassie on the day he killed them.

Chris: “I really don’t want you to think I’m a bad person Cassie.”

Cassie: “Right now I don’t care about you or your relationship, or what type of person you are or not, or what I think of you and I’m not trying to be rude when I say that.”

Page 2125

Good on Cassie.

 

[Tortoise]

I read in the documents something about Shannan being rebellious in pronouncing her name a different way. It's so much to go back through, but I know it's there.

I think it was a male neighbor or the man of a couple they knew who said that and he didn't appear to enjoy Shan'ann's company, judging by his comments. Possibly name beginning with a J.

 

[Mo Thuairim]

CW's termination letter from Anadarko, received in jail. Short and sweet.
Discovery page 855 (PDF p744)

 

[Dum-Dum Sucker]

It is a weird coincidence. And there are too many Nicks and Nicoles (and variations of spellings) to keep straight.

I know, right?

O/T
It's like, Hi, I'm Darryl, and this is my brother Darryl, and my other brother Darryl. (Bob Newhart Show)

 

[Seattle1]

I have been following this case since the beginning and I think Chris is the type to internalize his rage. Chris is a Beta male who probably feels inadequate due to both his mother and wife (both of whom are Alpha's). He may appear easy going and non-confrontational but deep down is seething with resentment towards the women in his life. Shanann and Cindi probably didn't get along because they're both Alpha's and Cindi treats Chris like a Momma's boy who can do no wrong. Similar to Scott Peterson, we have a golden boy who is worshipped by his parents.

I feel he'd intentionally cut himself off from his wife and kids. He didn't want to be attached to them in any way. He has NK who is probably younger and a bit naive. NK will follow Chris's lead and Chris can't believe he has a woman who will do what HE says but there's that pesky, pregnant wife of his who won't "go away" quietly because understandably, Shanann loves Chris unconditionally and is willing to work on their marriage. I also feel like Chris felt backed into a corner with baby Nico in the way.

So what does an emotionally immature Beta male do when he wants to rid himself of his family without paying out big $$$ for a divorce and child support? Just snuff them out plain and simple.

Chris is not smart or clever, nor is he a good actor. There is no way he was going to outsmart anyone by pretending to be the grieving husband. Chris is a dumbass who felt that he could go about life without a care in the world . Chris is a product of his parents (who btw seem pretty evil and narcissistic themselves). He honestly believed the police would just shrug and say "Yep, you're right Chris. Shanann probably just left without a trace. Oh well".

My guess is the kids were in bed, Chris is anxious for Shanann to get home from the airport. Shanann gets home, exhausted, feeling ill and pregnant. Takes off her shoes and gets ready for bed. She probably peeks in on the girls but tries not to wake them. Chris is probably pretending to be asleep.

Shanann gets into bed and gently tries to wake him up and whispers "Chris .. honey ...I'm home."

Chris probably lays there ignoring her while pretending to be asleep. Shanann tries to hug him and maybe he pushes her arms away. She says "**** off" and rolls over, maybe crying until she dozes off.

Then Chris probably rolls over, sits on top of her and strangles her first.


Then the girls. My reasoning is because he can't take a chance of Shanann discovering the girls are already dead and having her call the cops or cause a disturbance. He kills her first so that he has ample time to smother the children without Shanann interfering.


My other scenario is Chris pretends to be asleep in bed when Shanann gets home. She climbs into bed, and he rolls over and pretends to be loving by wrapping his arms around her. Maybe even says some loving words like "I missed you. How was your trip?" They chat like this for a few minutes until Shanann dozes off. Chris pretends to do the same.Then, with his arms still wrapped around her he strangles her. Shanann didn't have time to scream or fight back. Because of Chris's loving demeanor, Shanann, already tired from her trip, let her guard down and didn't want to to think about Chris's strange behavior the past week. She's dozing off when Chris decides to go through with his plan.

Poor SW was so confused by CW wishy washy behavior that she was walking on eggshells. Citing the late arrival, she also told her friends she would not wake CW when she got home. SW reportedly spent the night on the couch upon returning from NC, and 2nd night she went to her bed and CW went to basement to sleep. I'm therefore not convinced he was sleeping in the master bedroom on 8/13. MOO

 

[MassGuy]

Good on Cassie.

Haaaa I know. She was just trying to find her friend, a friend whose life may be in danger.

She had no time for his nonsense about what people would think of him.

Not only is he stupid and evil, but completely tone deaf as well.

 

[Best of What's Around]

I'm still not sure that the 2017 search wasn't a typo. There were at least 3 others in the document. For instance, on page 1892 (Discovery) it says:
I spoke with Nicole Atkinson, via telephone, regarding the events that occurred on the evening of 10/12/18 while Shanann was still in Arizona. The conversation was audibly recorded.

Obviously, SW wasn't alive in October and they meant August.

Maybe, but I can't remember who pointed it out but they said it was at the top of the list so it would have had to have been first in sequence...unless the typo then led to a sequencing mistake. She also searched CW I believe in January of 2018 IIRC?

 

[Johnny1181]

He started at Anadarko approx Jan 2015 per the bankruptcy documents filed June 2015. MOO

PommyMommy... you are a treasure for real!

So while the markets been up, it takes a while to accumulate a large sum in a 401K. Not sure what Andarko matched, but they must have been contributing a lot on their own to his account. And there are limits to what one can borrow.

CW put the owness of the loan on Shanann. This simply was not possible for her to do on her own. In fact only he could have done it. And that loan would have had to have been repaid through a committed payroll deduction.
Not entirely sure where I'm going with this, except at the very least he is a liar who enjoys the victim mode. I'm not buying the financial crisis lines from him. I could even fathom that Shannan did not know about the loan taken at all.

 

[Jupiter05]

I'm not trying to sleuth family but I wonder what Chris sister's husband thinks of all of this and I wonder if he is close to her family. I wonder if Mother Watts likes him.

And not that it matters, but I can't get over how different NK looks in the photos I've seen of her. I know there are other people with that name but these are definitely her. She looks so different in many of them. Just an observation.

I'm finally caught up reading the docs and on most of the posts. I almost wish I didn't read most of the docs. Reading SW's words about being so worried and trying so hard to save her marriage, while also reading what was going on with CW and NK at the same time, was heartbreaking. I have no doubt that SW would have been fine had they divorced but she clearly at least wanted to try to save her marriage and she seemed genuinely sad it was probably ending.

The last pages in the documents where the text messages were laid out in a timeline really made me sad. Poor Shanann and those poor babies. If only her flight was cancelled, I wonder if the outcome would have been different.

 

[Jennifer17]

PommyMommy... you are a treasure for real!

So while the markets been up, it takes a while to accumulate a large sum in a 401K. Not sure what Andarko matched, but they must have been contributing a lot on their own to his account. And there are limits to what one can borrow.

CW put the owness of the loan on Shanann. This simply was not possible for her to do on her own. In fact only he could have done it. And that loan would have had to have been repaid through a committed payroll deduction.
Not entirely sure where I'm going with this, except at the very least he is a liar who enjoys the victim mode. I'm not buying the financial crisis lines from him. I could even fathom that Shannan did not know about the loan taken at all.

Are 401Ks portable from job to job?

 

[MassGuy]

The last pages in the documents where the text messages were laid out in a timeline really made me sad. Poor Shanann and those poor babies. If only her flight was cancelled, I wonder if the outcome would have been different.

I doubt it. Same story, different day.

 

[k-mac]

im 25 pages behind
apologies for being out of sinc.
ive just had a lightbulb thought reading posts from previous thread.

chris took the girls to the party in shananns white lexus.
the baby sitter tells LE he left party at 3.30.
chris tells LE he left party at 5 ish.

an hour and a half he doesn't want to be accounted for.
its 45 minutes each way to that oil field from his house.

I will put money on ...he drove out there in shananns car with the girls and confirmed to himself his plan.

he got home ,went to the fridge threw the kids some cold pizza and got the facetime done with nan and pop and got the show on the road.

moo

 

[Tortoise]

Poor SW was so confused by CW wishy washy behavior that she was walking on eggshells. Citing the late arrival, she also told her friends she would not wake CW when she got home. SW reportedly spent the night on the couch upon returning from NC, and 2nd night she went to her bed and CW went to basement to sleep. I'm therefore not convinced he was sleeping in the master bedroom on 8/13. MOO

Although, I read here earlier that there was no movement recorded on the main floor between the time Shan'ann came home and shortly before CW left. I think that probably means the basement door wasn't opened during that time so he was on the upstairs level the whole time.