OH - Pike County: 8 People From One Family Dead As Police Hunt For Killer(s) #36 *Arrests*

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CIA Team Member said:
When my brother/SIL lost their home because they accidently signed a balloon mortgage, then came due as a surprise 10 yrs later, I tried telling them this too "You signed it. Not just one of you but both of you." Two people failed in 1 out of the 3 most important parts of a mortgage (terms: interest rate, monthly payment, and life of loan.) Sign a contract, it's your due diligence responsibility.
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I would add to the list, variability of the interest rate, how frequently the rate can increase, and by how much can it increase at any one time.
 
IQuestion said:
MYLAND bbm... Is that your opinion or your defense of a business practice that has been outlawed in almost every county in the world? IMO "CONTRACT OF SALE" is one step above "indentured servitude." Can you give specifics on why a contract of sale is beneficial to the purchaser, other than hiding from the IRS or legal creditors, that you are purchasing an asset or selling an asset????
"Indenturees usually enter into an indenture for a specific payment or other benefit, or to meet a legal obligation, such as debt bondage. On completion of the contract, indentured servants were given their freedom, and occasionally plots of land. In many countries, systems of indentured labor have now been outlawed, and are banned by the Universal Declaration of Human Rights as a form of slavery."
I know my explanation may seem archaic, but it did begin in the Appalachian area when poor people were trying to get a foothold on a future, in colonial times. I don't want to come across as mean, or ill tempered, but deeper exploration into its origins need to be addressed. It is not the best business practice...IMO. Just because others do it, is not the point or a good defense of the practice. Again, IMO. In my opinion.
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Not defending the practice only saying it happens. People don’t even want those kind of sellers to buy more land around them because they know what they will do with it and it causes their property value go down. But does that make them killers? I don’t think that really proves anything. And that’s my issue with the article it is only a bashing article that doesn’t add value to the case. The pictures attached to the article are even misleading to people who do don’t know. JMO
 
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Myland said:
Not defending the practice only saying it happens. People don’t even want those kind of sellers to buy more land around them because they know what they will do with it and it causes their property value go down. But does that make them killers? I don’t think that really proves anything. And that’s my issue with the article it is only a bashing article that doesn’t add value to the case. The pictures attached to the article are even misleading to people who do don’t know. JMO
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What it tells me is that FW (and her now-deceased husband) is basically a mean person who loses no sleep over predatory (IMO) loan/rental practices. It doesn't prove she's a murderer but it does paint her as a person with few compunctions and a moral compass that is pointed solely at herself. It certainly makes it easier to imagine her capable of the planning and plotting that was involved. What kind of person preys on poor people? is the question that comes to mind.
 
Julia966 said:
What it tells me is that FW (and her now-deceased husband) is basically a mean person who loses no sleep over predatory (IMO) loan/rental practices. It doesn't prove she's a murderer but it does paint her as a person with few compunctions and a moral compass that is pointed solely at herself. It certainly makes it easier to imagine her capable of the planning and plotting that was involved. What kind of person preys on poor people? is the question that comes to mind.
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No offense but banks, credit card companies, any business that tacks on late fees to people who can't even afford the original payment. It's a cruel world when you're poor.
 
almond said:
No offense but banks, credit card companies, any business that tacks on late fees to people who can't even afford the original payment. It's a cruel world when you're poor.
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This feels different to me. Tricky contracts, balloon payments people are somehow unaware of, confiscation of people's homes. Against her own neighbors who she knows can do nothing about it. Even a bank has to take lengthy steps to foreclose, ones that it looks like FW didn't take. But, obviously, it's JMO. Perhaps she's nothing more than a great businesswoman.
 
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Myland said:
Not defending the practice only saying it happens. People don’t even want those kind of sellers to buy more land around them because they know what they will do with it and it causes their property value go down. But does that make them killers? I don’t think that really proves anything. And that’s my issue with the article it is only a bashing article that doesn’t add value to the case. The pictures attached to the article are even misleading to people who do don’t know. JMO
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Myland: your land, your business. You decide what you do with it and how you conduct your business on it, BUT you don't get to decide others' perceptions of it and that is where the article (and I suspect many more to come) provide MUCH value to the case. Character provides context in court, no question about it. But even more than that, its already been said that many people fear the W's (and that starts with FW, hence the title of matriarch) and that they are on some pedestal of wealth and power in the area. But coupled with the indictments by the GJ, these stories that bring their character to the forefront help to eliminate that hold they have over people, and is very likely to strengthen the case because once people no longer fear them they are more willing to speak up about little details they may know, what they may have seen, etc.
 
rsd1200 said:
I don't think that they ever went to public school. Have you noticed that no one has come out and said anything about knowing them, like "I knew the W boys! JW was a quiet kid. Kept to himself... His brother, G3, liked to fry ants under a magnifying glass.", for example. Where are those people that usually come out of the woodwork?
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If I had ever known them, I'd be doing a good job of pretending I never knew them. Wagners? ... never heard of them until the arrests. "I know nothing!"
 
IQuestion said:
Myland, "they were no different than other when it comes to land." Are you sure about that? Or are you comparing them to the worst or the best? By your reasoning....W's actions are no worse than others, because others kill, too?
Mind if I take a stab at being devil's advocate?? There are other ways to sell property OTHER THAN A LAND CONTRACT!!... And I think you know that. I have holdings, and I don't do that....you know why??
Because I want to help the buyers and give them title. "A contract of sale" only insures the buyer HAS NOTHING until the last payment is made....kind of like buying a car, you get the "pink slip"/ownership only after you have made the last payment.
Yeah, yeah, yeah....figures don't lie, but liars do figure! Also "LIVING CLOSE TO THE CROSS"???? (even closer than the people sitting at the prosecution table.) Yep, guess that is true, ONLY IF HE GPS'd their addresses to see how close they lived to the "nearest" church.
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I saw a lot of these land contracts back in 2008 and 2009. People were bringing these contracts in to claim the first time home buyer credit (7500.00 in 2008 and 8000.00 in 2009). They were usually something like a rent-to-own contract that stipulated that the buyer received the deed only after the last payment was made. They were high interest loans some as high as 13%. Some were not even notarized. Just a couple of signatures at the bottom. People were even buying homes in their under 18 children's names and filing a tax return in that child's name to get the 8000.00 credit. It took the IRS years to audit all those forms.

I knew from the beginning the IRS would audit all those returns because the government doesn't give away 8000.00 without checking to see if they were eligible. So I set down a rule from the first that the buyer had to be 18 years of age and the contract had to be notarized and be a legitimate contract to buy a house.

Out of about 100 or so that brought them in for the credit, only 5 still own the homes they bought in 2008.

JMO
 
rsd1200 said:
Idk, ya ever watch those buy here/pay here ads? They are your ticket to owning a car! FW probably convinced herself, and them, that she was providing them the opportunity to own their own land/home. Without her, and those like her, willing to make the sacrifice, and take the risk, on those who couldn't obtain a conventional mortgage, why, how else would they ever be able to even try to own a piece of the American Dream? Like her? /s
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Buy here with a down payment of 99.00 and pay here every week? Like Carmart? Walmart owns that. But no one ever said Sam Walton was in it for fun. :)

JMO
 
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