GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #61

[Thepoet]

The DA said at the press conference that there weren’t any fibers in their lungs, so no evidence of a pillow or other material as the smothering tool...

OMG! With his hands??? That's beyond monstrous! That would mean he looked at them as he did it! That is almost ritualistic. Why not use a pillow? Worse and worse.

I have to believe, based on how he killed the girls, and the posed doll, that the girls were killed first.

 

[Tortoise]

I admit to feeling a bit sad for RW during the confession. But how easily he accepted "she killed both her children" bothered me.

I guess denial is strong but it still bothered me. Such a pathetic and obvious lie.

I think I see him struggling with the why - and CW also struggled getting out a why - it's not because of the separation because Shanann apparently already agreed to that the week before when she emailed the realtor - and it's not because of the affair because CW never had the courage to tell her about the affair - so why exactly did she kill the kids CW? Um, like, it's because like she knew in her heart I was cheating on her, even though I, like, I denied it.

AS IF!! A mother kills her children on a mere suspicion. It doesn't pass the smell test. That's why CW said to his dad, I don't even know if they believe me. He sucked up their HOW IT HAPPENED but had no WHY IT HAPPENED ready. I think I could see RW going over it trying to make sense of it, repeating it.

 

[Love Never Fails]

I'd be with you if she hadn't felt her reputation and embarrassment were more important than the lives of missing and then dead babies and if she hadn't acted the way she did with investigators.

You give them EVERYTHING. You don't lie or evade. And she did.

Hearing her voice- I have heard the same excuse given in your post on various occasions, to excuse a lack of empathy in various people: "Well I was able to eat pizza and I didn't cry when my child died so there's nothing important about CW's demeanor." For example - nope. IMO that voice, like CW's demeanor, has nothing to do with delayed grief or shock. To me she sounded arrogantly controlled and decisive. She sounded extraordinarily annoyed and put out that she had to be there.

I could understand anger. Sadness. Betrayal. Numbness. Shock.

I really didn't detect any of that as some have. I detected a coldly selfish woman who knows how to manipulate, likes to control others and lacks empathy.

She didn't kill anyone. We all know that. So what? Just because she didn't is she not supposed to face judgment for who she is and what she did?

Not directed at you at all, but I'm kind of sick of people with low character, bad, mean, people, facing zero consequences and being protected in this country because "everyone makes mistakes", or "we have no right to judge".

Maybe it's okay that a person like her faces some societal shunning. We should have common values as a community and a culture. Like coming together to help one another and not being selfish at times of crisis. Doing what is necessary, even at our own expense, to help children. Assisting LE when asked, in major criminal cases. Having respect for others, including professionals who are doing a tough job, instead of narcissitically trying to control their job and brattily expressing impatience and annoyance with having to be involved in something that actually includes death and murder.

Geez.

I don't feel sorry for her. I did. Not now. IMO she deserves some negativity for her behavior and attitude.

And her life is far from over. If serial killer and predator Karla Homolka can go on to leave prison for a Caribbean island, get married and have three kids after murdering three other minors including her own little sister, I'm sure this arrogant and decisive woman will be just fine.

Thank you for this. Isn’t it time people own up to responsibility and pay the consequences for their actions? People say “she didn’t murder anyone”. Really? You don’t have to stab someone in the back to kill them. Just destroy their influence. Sleep with another woman’s husband. What do you think that does to his wife or to his family?

How many lives have been forever changed because of HER decision to sleep with a married man. I believe we all realize now she knew he was married before the affair ever began. She also knew Shanaan was pregnant. And someone surmises her life has been ruined because she is embarrassed? Oh please! I am sure we will hear of a book deal in the near future.

What concerns me is why did CW take that plea deal so fast and ask LE to leave NK alone? Isn’t possible she had knowledge of his plans to get rid of his family? Did he share with her how he would “fix it.” Was he trying to protect her?

 

[sun16]

Yes, there was the smell of cleaning supplies and newly vacuumed carpets.

I imagine at least Bella must have bled.

I'm not sure where the washer dryer are in the house.

I was thinking maybe they wet their pants/diaper.

 

[Thepoet]

No, death does not always cause voiding but fear will. Most hanging victims do void but that is down to gravity as much as death.

IIRC the sphincter and bladder muscles relax at death. (sorry, I hate this!)

 

[MassGuy]

Thank you for this. Isn’t it time people own up to responsibility and pay the consequences for their actions? People say “she didn’t murder anyone”. Really? You don’t have to stab someone in the back to kill them. Just destroy their influence. Sleep with another woman’s husband. What do you think that does to his wife or to his family?

How many lives have been forever changed because of HER decision to sleep with a married man. I believe we all realize now she knew he was married before the affair ever began. She also knew Shanaan was pregnant. And someone surmises her life has been ruined because she is embarrassed? Oh please! I am sure we will hear of a book deal in the near future.

What concerns me is why did CW take that plea deal so fast and ask LE to leave NK alone? Isn’t possible she had knowledge of his plans to get rid of his family? Did he share with her how he would “fix it.” Was he trying to protect her?

Naw. He was just covering his own *advertiser censored*. If LE talked to her, his lies and motive would be exposed.

I don’t think she had any prior knowledge. She’s just disingenuous, among other things.

 

[Jennifer17]

IIRC the sphincter and bladder muscles relax at death. (sorry, I hate this!)

Not at the moment of death though. Bodily fluids will seep from every orifice after death. That is what the laying out process is for.

 

[MsBetsy]

If it had gone to trial we would not have seen much of it. Like her internet searches would likely not be relevant. The naked photos she sent would be relevant though. It all goes to his motive. He was engaged in a hot and heavy affair.

And that's not the prosecution's fault. It's hers. Like my dad always told me- never take a nude photo and don't allow others to take one unless you don't mind it being published. It will get out somehow some way. He told me that starting at age 14 or so.

In any event had there been trial the media would've been saturated with what came out at trial and would have been unlikely to request everything after the fact. And before trial concluded they didn't have a right to getting those docs.

So CW really screwed NK over with his plea, in a sense.

But since there was a plea, ALL evidence was available for release if requested. Because it was all info discovered during an investigation. They had to make sure NK wasn't involved and back up her statments and time line. It was crucial stuff.

And frankly, given her conduct during the interview and in deleting stuff they had to really dig to make sure she wasn't part of the crime itself, IMO. Hence, some of the editorial about her creepy laugh and specifics about her searching for Amber Frey's net worth, make mor sense. It seems that early on they worried she could end up being a suspect.

Regardless, they have to have very specific reasons for redactions and "witness feels embarrassed" doesn't qualify.

The only way to stop it would've been for her to get an attorney to file a motion to seal the record. But she didn't know what they had. And it all was released very quickly because this is a high profile case and the public interest was paramount.

And I agree with whoever said it wasn't selective. Poor Shannan's deepest thoughts and most private discussions were revealed for all to see. As well as nasty comments by various people.

It's not a betrayal. It's not against the law. If someone wants to avoid something like this don't carry on with a married person, because stuff can and will happen. Not necessarily murder but sometimes even murder, as we have seen. More often though the spouse can find out or the cheater can confess to the spouse and everything you sent to the affair can be exposed.

Also, LE would've gotten EVERYTHING regardless as to whether she allowed access voluntarily or not. So stomping one's feet and refusing to cooperate because a person feels their rights to privacy are more important than a child's safety, won't accomplish anything but making them more hated when it all comes out.

Finally, the thought that anyone would feel they don't want to help LE in their investigation into the murders or disappearance of two babies because of the fear of being "betrayed" by investigators, makes me feel kind of horrified and sick.

This isn't about you or me or our feelings or shame or reputation. It's about innocent childrens' lives.

There just has to be a line somewhere, where lives of innocents are more important than our personal feelings.

My two cents.

Sounds like my mom was a bit more conservative than your dad. She always told me never do anything you can't go home and tell your mother about. That lasted intil I was about 14.

 

[jayjay54]

My gut feeling is she was not nearly as in to CW as he might have thought.

The existence of another guy with a key to her apartment is interesting.

Yes, that is interesting - and her defensive reactions (fake outrage?) when LE wanted to know his surname - the temerity to insist that Jim be left out of "this" - well it is a murder investigation. Of course they need that information in order to confirm her whereabouts. If she will only provide his first name, he is not an alibi for the Sunday evening. Maybe Jim is a red herring and does not exist at all...

 

[k-mac]

I was amazed at how she said she wanted him to spend time with the kids, that he did and she did not interfere with the children.

WTF!!

Supposedly, she was only with him during the time that everyone was Gone, with the exception of when he came back with his family and she was busy with somebody else except for that one day. What the hell is she talking about. One day out of all that time. Pffft

this erked me too.
she says to LE I wanted him to have every possible second he could with his beautiful children.
ok so IF you bought into her oh I thought they were separated theory ...here was a 2 day opportunity for chris to spend a full weekend no shanann with 'his beautiful children......and what does she do???
allows him to get a baby sitter for one of those nights to take her out and wine and dine her.

god her lies are preposterous .

moo

 

[Delevanjo]

Your professor needed, to be honest, it's his job, it helped his career.

I teach college students; the intro course to our program has an oral/speaking requirement. Vocal fry and up-speak are two of many issues we point out as something to correct. Most of the others are non-verbals (gestures, stance, hair touching, swaying, etc), but we also point out "like" and "uhms." I don't know that all programs do this sort of training, but I agree with whoever wrote: not too bright but over confident.

I'll go look again to give reference but I seem to recall noting CW's vocal fry in the porch interview. He may have been tired, but NK's is so strong - he might have picked it up from her. For most, it's a habit (trend). All that said, I'm not about policing anyone's voice, but I do teach student so be strong public speakers, eliminating vocal fry helps to do that.

 

[MsBetsy]

Yes, and that one of the reasons why I think that he may have killed them earlier. SW was a fanatic about keeping the home clean and fresh and there is no way that she would have left the girl's bed linen dirty and smelly unless he did something to make them that way.

How would that
show he killed them earlier? I thought the same until we knew the girls had nothing in their stomachs and the cadaver dogs didn't alert strongly in one particular place.
Unless you mean he washed the sheets on Sunday. I'm getting confused as to what happened when. So if that's the case I guess I'm back to thinking he did kill them before she got home.

 

[k-mac]

My goodness, I just caught up on something like 112 pages of comments, and that was speed-reading and skipping over certain discussions. How do ya'll keep up?!

I read every second page on average
because usually people are quoting the most recent page so if you read every page your really reading double.
but its not fool proof! lol

and if a quoted post tickles you or you wanna know what that reply was too you put your cursor over the arrow next to their name and it will take you to original post

 

[Jessthinkin]

Yes, this! This sums up the absolutely bizarre attitude and seeming lack of taking anything seriously beyond how it affects her or was affected by her.

"His cheese was sliding off his cracker"?!

This is how she describes the grown man she was sleeping with, the married man who just killed his pregnant wife and children? As a 30 year old woman? Participating in questioning for a quadruple murder investigation?

Yes, that jumped out at me too, even from the written docs released last week. Besides the sidestepping any blame and placing it all on him, it’s a blasé and jokingly casual (I’m sure there’s a better adjective but it escapes me!) way to describe your lover’s VERY recent murder of his entire family... :/

 

[opalonyx]

Maybe Jim is a red herring and does not exist at all...

Perhaps Xanny the nanny knows Jim and can tell authorities his last name

I actually think he's real, but I think whatever their relationship is, makes her look bad. Which seems to be her general motivation for being less than forthcoming. I believe the friends with benefits theory personally. She maybe doesn't want the world to know she was playing two guys at once. MOO

 

[Thepoet]

Shannan was a bright star in this life. Bella, Celeste,and Nico were rising stars. The Rzucek family are a very loving, courageous class act. NUA was and is a true hero. These are the victims, all of them, and the heroes.

NK made bad decisions and many of her actions were self-serving. She, no doubt, has lied and hidden things. Maybe, some things are still hidden. I no longer like her or trust her. I wish her no ill will, but I wish she would quietly go away!

The Watts family are a horribly, dysfunctional mess. Liars and manipulators. They are responsible for much of what's happened, albeit indirectly. I fear there is more damage forthcoming from them. I wish they too would go away, far away, and then shut up!

And we all know about CW. He's going, going, gone.

I'm feeling very affected by the whole thing today.

 

[Gardenista]

Anybody know a good reason why the media hasn't released any more info?

 

[Mellowmelly]

I have just listened to NK police interrogation, something that stood out to me was when she talks about the times she went to CW family home. She said that she didn’t like being there as it was CW family space and that she respected that. She didn’t respect it enough IMO, otherwise she would have stepped out of the equation all together.
However even though in her interview she sounds almost arrogant, I do not believe she had any clue what CW was planning to do. I believe she probably did encourage him to try and fix his marriage but in a half hearted way, otherwise she would have ceased contact with him whilst he was in NC with his family but she still chose to communicate with him.

 

[CrimeAddict]

Are there only just a few short video clips? Thats' all I can find of CW and LE interviews. I have been thinking about those finances and although people say she made 65k, that would not be every year if you are an MLM person that is going to vary. Maybe she made that ONE year. Making 120k (both incomes( they should have been fine financially) so that is my guess as to why things were so bad.

 

[Leila267]

Telling someone to work on your marriage and then sending nude photos of your ugly self is definately just one proof of NKs lies ....so too knowing that SW “lives on her phone” yet never knowing anything that’s been plastered on social media about SW and her pregnancy ... I say no way !

A liar will lie so much they can’t remember the lies they tell.

In a court of law, If someone lies then eveything else that comes out of that persons mouth can be prseumed a lie.

How CWcould lower his standards to allow such filth into his life is incredulous. Not defending CW at all but he had never been in trouble with the law in 33 years until he met <modsnip - name calling> NK ...