GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #65

[MCDRAW]

Does anybody think that SW parents are making $ on the 20/20 interview?

If they are, who cares? They had to pay for 3 funerals that they weren't expecting.

 

[MsBetsy]

Her actions caused her to lose her reputation and job. You can't blame the loss of those things on anyone but her. She was responsible for her actions. JMO

Well, if it's true that at least 60% of people have affairs, then a lot of people would be unemployed by that standard!

 

[Trudie]

There is a definition of a controlling personality and it isn't comparable to saying someone is shy or loud. A bossy or forceful person is not comparable to a controlling person either.
Controlling people can't control themselves so they control others, they don't respect boundaries or personal space. Mama Watts instigating the nutgate incident, and her speaking to CW's friend about the incident is a big sign of a controlling person.

Unfortunately, we like to take short cuts and use terms that are actually severe disorders without realizing it, for example, an organized, neat and tidy person has OCD. If one is aware of the disorder, it's seen as trivializing it or applying it to someone who hasn't got the condition.

At the end of the day, it doesn't matter about who Shanann was, it's about CW. FAs have killed wives who were shy and introverted or simply asked for a separation, this doesn't account for the children, why them? CW should be analyzed to get to the bottom of this, not Shanann.

I don’t have the credentials to diagnose someone as narc, soc or psycho. As a neat freak, I have friends that label me OCD. A few of them are so UN-neat I could label them as a farm animal.

 

[Layla123]

I don't think anyone cares that she had an affair. It's her behavior during the investigation. The interview that she gave trying to look like a victim when she knew all along he was married. Searching for book deals. Its all about her. It goes deeper than an affair.

We disagree. There’s no proof she knew how married he was. He was available to her 24 hours a day for five weeks. Committed men aren’t. Near the end things started to change. Who knows what would have happened if the murders didn’t? I think she was a victim, as I think anyone would be if their boyfriend turned out to be a lying murderer who killed 4 people and turned their world upside down. At the same time she was searching for book deals, she was doing everything she could to escape and avoid the media. We don’t know what she was thinking when she searched that book. It could have been as innocent as a curiosity about what happened to Amber Frey. We don’t know that she plans to write write a book. I’ve heard a lot of people say some pretty nasty things about her, including how much they are enjoying her suffering.

 

[sraybella]

Does anybody think that SW parents are making $ on the 20/20 interview?

IMO, I hope they are...they deserve it. Of course, they’re so classy, they will donate it to Lupus Foundation or some other charity group. It’s the only “win” for them in this inexplicable tragedy.

 

[2Hope4]

If they are, who cares? They had to pay for 3 funerals that they weren't expecting.

CO state paid for all funeral expenses. Each victim received funds. It was in the document releases.

 

[ZsaZsa]

You'll never believe it, but actually experts and professionals have already been studying "these tragedies" for decades now, and even have a pretty darn good idea of what the "commonalities" and causes are. There are thousands of books, studies, scholarly articles, and popular articles already published on exactly this subject. Many Websleuthers have posted links to some of the best of this information. You should really take a look.

Because guess what?

These are NOT "toxic relationships that erupt into murder." These are psychopaths, sociopaths, narcissists... ABUSERS. And to contradict a favorite myth of misogynists the world over, no, abuse victims do not "bring it on themselves." And no, FAs don't annihilate whole families because they were bullied and nagged by their meanie wives and "the mouse roared." If they were really so cowed, wouldn't they just pack a bag and disappear into the night? This whole fairytale scenario pushed by incels and MRAs simply does not hold up to logic or basic Psych 101.

Oh and yes, a man who kills two precious preschoolers who call him their hero and stuffs them into crude oil tank hatches and strangles a pregnant wife desperate to make him happy and save her family is her sleep is the very definition of THE DEVIL.

And I have serious questions about any hypothetical person who could empathize with him or would defend him.

Where is the vomiting emoji when you need it ?!

I find the Ignore button works as well as the vomiting one..... the sentiment is the same.

 

[MassGuy]

You'll never believe it, but actually experts and professionals have already been studying "these tragedies" for decades now, and even have a pretty darn good idea of what the "commonalities" and causes are. There are thousands of books, studies, scholarly articles, and popular articles already published on exactly this subject. Many Websleuthers have posted links to some of the best of this information. You should really take a look.

Because guess what?

These are NOT "toxic relationships that erupt into murder." These are psychopaths, sociopaths, narcissists... ABUSERS. And to contradict a favorite myth of misogynists the world over, no, abuse victims do not "bring it on themselves." And no, FAs don't annihilate whole families because they were bullied and nagged by their meanie wives and "the mouse roared." If they were really so cowed, wouldn't they just pack a bag and disappear into the night? This whole fairytale scenario pushed by incels and MRAs simply does not hold up to logic or basic Psych 101.

Oh and yes, a man who kills two precious preschoolers who call him their hero and stuffs them into crude oil tank hatches and strangles a pregnant wife desperate to make him happy and save her family is her sleep is the very definition of THE DEVIL.

And I have serious questions about any hypothetical person who could empathize with him or would defend him.

Where is the vomiting emoji when you need it ?!

Exactly. You could look inside the lives of countless families in the United States, and find many of the same potential stressors.

Financial troubles

Unhappy marriage

Affairs

If those things were a prelude to family annihilation, then we would have a crisis on our hands.

They only come into play when you are dealing with a sociopath who wants to start over. An evil monster who cares only about himself.

Shanann didn’t cause this, CW did.

No woman should have to be perfect so their partner doesn’t kill her and her kids.

It probably wouldn’t have mattered anyways...

 

[Trudie]

Didn’t the CO crime victim fund pay for the funerals (per doc dump) & CW is required to make restitution?

 

[Moonracer]

Does anybody think that SW parents are making $ on the 20/20 interview?

I hope so. A Bella and Cece scholarship could be established, beautiful sculptures could be commissioned for an art museum , even a splash pad or beautified park in their honor could be funded. Things to help them keep on in this world.

 

[kiwilaura]

Does anybody think that SW parents are making $ on the 20/20 interview?

Sorry. I said that I saw that they were not being paid. But I can not find the source now. Have reported post to get it removed.

 

[MCDRAW]

<modsnip - quoted post removed>
I think if you are really wanting to find out why, you would do better to research his family and him. He is a killer. Shanann isn't. She wasn't perfect but she did nothing to deserve death. As far as a toxic relationship, who really knows how their relationship was. As far as I can tell everything Toxic came from the Watts side.

 

[psdumas]

In terms of Shanann not seeing it coming, there is a very in depth analysis in "Inside the mind of Scott Peterson," of Lacis personality and the reason she missed all the red flags. It reminds me very much of the marriage between Shanann and Chris. Laci and Shanann shared many characteristics, and the desire to live a certain lifestyle was the most significant. They had similar goals and dreams.
It's much more complex than that, and since I've already mentioned it a few times before I won't go into any more detail. But I do think it's similar to Shananns marriage to Chris and like Scott and Laci, allowed many things to go unnoticed and helped to enable the perfect storm that ended in disaster.

So true. The beautiful life. Having all the accoutrements in life. Who suffered the most? The innocent kids. Yes. It is more complex, unfortunately. This does not happen out of the blue. One day we're a "under armour / workout kinda wearing couple, and the next day, we're dead. What was brewing was toxic. I guess we all miss red flags here and there. Could we have seen it coming?

 

[ZsaZsa]

We disagree. There’s no proof she knew how married he was. He was available to her 24 hours a day for five weeks. Committed men aren’t. Near the end things started to change. Who knows what would have happened if the murders didn’t? I think she was a victim, as I think anyone would be if their boyfriend turned out to be a lying murderer who killed 4 people and turned their world upside down. At the same time she was searching for book deals, she was doing everything she could to escape and avoid the media. We don’t know what she was thinking when she searched that book. It could have been as innocent as a curiosity about what happened to Amber Frey. We don’t know that she plans to write write a book. I’ve heard a lot of people say some pretty nasty things about her, including how much they are enjoying her suffering.

She searched Amber Frey book deal and Amber Frey net worth. AKA what's in this for me?

 

[Annicade]

Are you aware that he was selling Thrive too? And he went on most of those trips with her.
Whatever you think of MLM, it is legal.

It makes her a smart business woman who like million of others, go to social media to sell a product. It is no different from a commercial enticing you to buy a product. Do you want someone to post to social media all their troubles, financial standings, problems.

There are numerous kinds of these jobs that men and women embark on as a career. She was highlighting what the product can/could do through her social media account. There are always though select ones who think people's social media pages are fairy tale, happy, no problem life...because some decide to display the good not bad.

 

[GoneGoldfishin']

You'll never believe it, but actually experts and professionals have already been studying "these tragedies" for decades now, and even have a pretty darn good idea of what the "commonalities" and causes are. There are thousands of books, studies, scholarly articles, and popular articles already published on exactly this subject. Many Websleuthers have posted links to some of the best of this information. You should really take a look.

Because guess what?

These are NOT "toxic relationships that erupt into murder." These are psychopaths, sociopaths, narcissists... ABUSERS. And to contradict a favorite myth of misogynists the world over, no, abuse victims do not "bring it on themselves." And no, FAs don't annihilate whole families because they were bullied and nagged by their meanie wives and "the mouse roared." If they were really so cowed, wouldn't they just pack a bag and disappear into the night? This whole fairytale scenario pushed by incels and MRAs simply does not hold up to logic or basic Psych 101.

Oh and yes, a man who kills two precious preschoolers who call him their hero and stuffs them into crude oil tank hatches and strangles a pregnant wife desperate to make him happy and save her family in her sleep is the very definition of THE DEVIL.

And I have serious questions about any hypothetical person who could empathize with him or would defend him.

Where is the vomiting emoji when you need it ?!

Thank you Lore Listener. This entire post bears repeating.

 

[Layla123]

IMO, that's like saying NK didn't know how pregnant Shanann was. Which is as ridiculous as saying NK didn't know "how married" CW was. The truth was there, she just didn't want to see it.

We have no proof of that, other than everyone saying they would know CW was married and SW was pregnant if it was them. We aren’t NK. We don’t know what she knew. I believed her when she said she learned of the pregnancy from the news after the murders happened. I think if there was any proof otherwise, the detectives would have busted her on it. They wanted to prove that she told CW to get rid of his family. If they had anything on her that she was lying, anything, they would have used it to get her to reveal more, but they didn’t. We have no evidence!

 

[MsBetsy]

<modsnip - quoted post removed>
The saddest thing to me is that as soon as Chris expressed his unhappiness in the marriage she was willing to look at her faults and immediately wanted to work on it. If only he had mentioned it a few years before! Marriage counselling may have helped her see him for who he was and she may have been able to get out.

 

[Layla123]

She searched Amber Frey book deal and Amber Frey net worth. AKA what's in this for me?

Or what ever happened to Amber Frey?

 

[kay74]

I think if you are really wanting to find out why, you would do better to research his family and him. He is a killer. Shanann isn't. She wasn't perfect but she did nothing to deserve death. As far as a toxic relationship, who really knows how their relationship was. As far as I can tell everything Toxic came from the Watts side.

Mama Watts. Her husband was even brainwashed by her and she played a big part in putting Chris against Shanann. Sad.