CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #5

[ZsaZsa]

Yeah, like many of the details surrounding this case, the fiancé thing appears to be murky.

At one point it was probably on, but I get the feeling that things changed at some point, perhaps coinciding with her disappearance.

In this article they claim that her aunt states they broke up on Thanksgiving day.
Kelsey Berreth: Police Search Fiance’s Ranch In Search For Missing Colorado Mom

 

[PrairieWind]

I have to say that the Idaho ping disturbs me for a different reason. If the person that took KB took her phone to Idaho, which seems to be likely, that person probably took her at least part of the way as well. Almost certainly that went through most of Wyoming. I don't know how many of you have been in central or across southern Wyoming, but if not, it's hard to describe. A hundred miles between towns, thousands of square miles of unpopulated, wild, open land. If this person, whoever disposed of KB there, whoever it was, she will likely never be found.

 

[AmatuerDetective]

I’d argue that we don’t need to know the w’s. I also don’t want to make it a game. I don’t know much but I know Kelsey respected her privacy.



That’s not true and I’ll send links but I think they’ve already been posted

Yes I saw the posts. I just think they are wrong. The FBI by law got involved in this case when her cell phone pinged in Idaho. Thats not speculation. That happens each and every time there is evidence of interstate crime. Again that is the LAW of our country not speculation. Secondly, the first thing the FBI would be investigating is the ping from the cell tower. How do I know that? Because without knowing wether the ping was false or real they wouldn't know if they have any jurisdiction. How do we know they found the ping to be legitimate? We dont know for 100% but because they joined the state of Colorado in the search of the property we know they have remained involved. The state of colorado does not need any help from the FBI to execute a search warrant. The state of colorado has state of the art forensic teams that investigate crime scenes like this much more often than the colorado bureau does. If you want to create links speculating something else may have happened, based on some other scenario be my guest. I choose to believe facts and law.

 

[Warwick7]

We have no way of knowing, but isn't it very common for LE to work with the DA on SW's, and for the DA to tell them "not enough yet, go get more evidence"? LE/DA may even have been rebuffed by a judge as long ago as Dec 3 on not enough probable cause? Pressers and vigils highlight the case to the broader public, and I keep wondering if that critical witness or CCTV footage finally arrived because of these actions.

Other posters pointed out this theory about a Christmas tree upthread (I was thinking this, too): KB & K should have arrived home from Safeway about 1PM. What if PF arrived, said let's skip going out to eat and go up to my ranch to find a tree? PF could have offered to have a quiet in-home evening, he'll set up the tree brought back in his truck, let's eat sandwiches. KB might have been happy about this change of plans. The 3 leave in his truck, KB still in casual clothes, cars at her house.

If a neighbor saw KB get in a red truck on Thanksgiving, or even a dinner guest of a neighbor like that relative who is always going outside to smoke, and has now made a statement of what they saw, that might be enough probable cause?

I could see this happening...

 

[Warwick7]

We have no way of knowing, but isn't it very common for LE to work with the DA on SW's, and for the DA to tell them "not enough yet, go get more evidence"? LE/DA may even have been rebuffed by a judge as long ago as Dec 3 on not enough probable cause? Pressers and vigils highlight the case to the broader public, and I keep wondering if that critical witness or CCTV footage finally arrived because of these actions.

Other posters pointed out this theory about a Christmas tree upthread (I was thinking this, too): KB & K should have arrived home from Safeway about 1PM. What if PF arrived, said let's skip going out to eat and go up to my ranch to find a tree? PF could have offered to have a quiet in-home evening, he'll set up the tree brought back in his truck, let's eat sandwiches. KB might have been happy about this change of plans. The 3 leave in his truck, KB still in casual clothes, cars at her house.

If a neighbor saw KB get in a red truck on Thanksgiving, or even a dinner guest of a neighbor like that relative who is always going outside to smoke, and has now made a statement of what they saw, that might be enough probable cause?

I could see this happening...

 

[klind55]

BBM. I am not sure how many farm workers you would have on a 35 acre property with a couple of horses and a few cattle.

I missed that his ranch was only 35 acres. Can that even be called a ranch then? Sounds more like a farm.

 

[Jethro4WS]

I thought they were in Laclede? I think their church is in Sandpoint...?
MOO

Yes. That would be correct.

 

[gitana1]

This so reminds me of the Anna Maciejewska case.........the similarities are startling. Poor Anna's parents and friends are just beside themselves after all this time.

Gosh I hope this case doesn't turn out like that - a year later and no info or arrest.

That suspect isn't cooperating with police either. I guess he's "smart." He also hasn't allowed their son to Skype with the maternal grandparents in a year. Is that because he's smart too?

Here is my theory. She has gone missing before, but maybe not for this long. She has weird #recovery and #sober tags on her Instagram.

This would explain why her mom didn’t report her missing either.

PF and CB don’t want to put this info on blast. Again, JMO.

Well it doesn't seem that LE - who know a heck of a lot more than any of us - share that theory.

And it doesn't explain why PF isn't sitting down with LE and explaining his whereabouts. It doesn't explain why LE is searching his residence and vehicles. It doesn't explain why PF is refusing to allow grandma to see her granddaughter.

 

[MassGuy]

In this article they claim that her aunt states they broke up on Thanksgiving day.
Kelsey Berreth: Police Search Fiance’s Ranch In Search For Missing Colorado Mom

Yeah, I believe that this is true, and I’d believe it even without her statement.

But it certainly increases the likelihood that there was trouble there.

 

[Seattle1]

In this article they claim that her aunt states they broke up on Thanksgiving day.
Kelsey Berreth: Police Search Fiance’s Ranch In Search For Missing Colorado Mom

Hmmm... an unidentified Aunt posting on a truckers website/fb page?

 

[MassGuy]

Hmmm... an unidentified Aunt posting on a truckers website/fb page?

It makes sense, as if you are exploring the option that she left on her own volition, especially in light of the fact that there are no missing vehicles, truckers are your guys (or gals).

She didn’t stroll on foot to Idaho, so hitchhiking is definitely an angle that they would want to explore.

Atleast in the early days.

 

[PrairieWind]

Hmmm... an unidentified Aunt posting on a truckers website/fb page?

Apparently "aunt" knew more than Mom knew.

 

[klind55]

Is there a reason KB owned 2 vehicles? Was one a classic/collector's car? Trying to figure out why a single mom with a baby would need to have 2 vehicles.

 

[MassGuy]

Apparently "aunt" knew more than Mom knew.

Not necessarily though. If this is legitimate, she may have said something that her sister was unwilling to say.

In that same article it also says that she refused comment when contacted later by that media outlet.

Either LE doesn’t want this released for some reason, or Kelsey’s mother doesn’t.

Or it’s not really an aunt.

 

[gitana1]

Maybe, as I do get the impression we aren’t being told everything.

Regardless, LE clearly doesn’t believe she willingly dissapeared.

This is almost certainly not a leap of faith in their part.

Yeah. You know the secret rehab theory is becoming almost as popular a theory in high-profile missing, white, middle class female cases as Mexican drug cartels and white slaver sex trafficking rings - none of which I've seen proven true in such a case.

Bottom line is the CBI and FBI don't get involved in "drunk chick ran off to rehab again" scenarios.

 

[MassGuy]

Yeah. You know the secret rehab theory is becoming almost as popular a theory in high-profile missing, white, middle class female cases as Mexican drug cartels and white slaver sex trafficking rings - none of which I've seen proven true in such a case.

Bottom line is the CBI and FBI don't get involved in "drunk chick ran off to rehab again" scenarios.

Haa, they certainly don’t.

And I’ve yet to see a case where the subject of a high profile nationwide search, has magically turned up at a mental health facility.

I posted the HIPAA regulations regarding law enforcement inquiries yesterday, in an effort to put this to bed.

Mental hospitals are not black holes.

We haven’t quite gotten there yet.

 

[Beamer15]

Might be why he won't let the daughter out of his sight. Given the language being used by PF's attorney when referring to the daughter, I'm beginning to wonder if she's not his.

No, she is his and he isn’t letting her out of his sight. He carries her everywhere- lawyers office included. He is very possessive of her. I’m sure if he had something to do w Kelsey’s disappearance it will be over the baby.

 

[MassGuy]

No, she is his and he isn’t letting her out of his sight. He carries her everywhere- lawyers office included. He is very possessive of her. I’m sure if he had something to do w Kelsey’s disappearance it will be over the baby.

It would not be the first time that has happened.

 

[Seattle1]

Is there a reason KB owned 2 vehicles? Was one a classic/collector's car? Trying to figure out why a single mom with a baby would need to have 2 vehicles.

KB had a 70 mile one way commute to work. Not unusual to have a family vehicle, and another for commuting. I do.

 

[MsFacetious]

Mental health issues as a possibility shouldn’t be hurtful...they are very common, especially in young mothers...and something like this would offer some hope at least, jmo.

This is very true. PPD is a very real thing. Especially if the circumstances of Kelsey's life were as confusing as they appear to be to us. Kelsey leaving on her own is the only hope we have of a happy ending right now.

They could be hurtful if they are rumours spread as a way to imply that someone has gone missing 'voluntarily' when that is not the case. IMO.

I would want to believe she had gone missing voluntarily if she was my loved one. Anything to avoid believing she'd been abducted or murdered or both.

Unfortunately I do not believe that is the case... but I would love nothing more than a fairy tale ending here. I don't want them to find anything on that farm... but then, I also don't want to think she's somewhere on the drive to Idaho either.

Yes. I very much wish this was a voluntary missing situation.

I sense some loneliness about her situation. A young beautiful woman, a flight instructor and a mother, is last seen on Thanksgiving day, and no one notices her absence. There is a text to work, but how come no coworker calls to check if she is OK?

That means, no close coworkers.

The so-called fiancé is thinking about himself.

Neither friends nor neighbors in view.

Mom lives far away, but is the first to notice that her child is missing.

So unbelievably sad.

Yes. We've seen cases where loners were not noticed missing. Kelsey just isn't what we typically see in those cases. It's a stark contrast which I think is why it's so strange for us to accept that it really took that long to be reported.

I'm quite a loner myself, fiercely private and independent. It wouldn't be odd if nobody in real life saw me for ten days. (If I didn't have kids.) However, I actually have out of state friends I communicate with daily that would report me missing faster than that.

Who really knows, lol?!

"Cheryl Berreth, who lives in Laclede, reported her daughter missing just after noon on Dec. 2, Woodland Park Police Chief Miles De Young said at the news conference."
Fundraiser is created for missing woman

I think this is a tomato/tomato situation. Sandpoint is more well known. Laclede is the actual address but is an unincorporated area outside of Sandpoint. It's just not a big deal, they are basically the same thing.

In this article they claim that her aunt states they broke up on Thanksgiving day.
Kelsey Berreth: Police Search Fiance’s Ranch In Search For Missing Colorado Mom

Yes I had seen this as well. It is very concerning. I'm a little unclear however on the source for that.

Was it PF? Did he report this when he reported about the child hand off and the supposed family visit? Or did somebody else know about the break up?

It seems an odd course of action to dump him, drop the baby with him, then leave to visit family. Then again... my family would have zero interest in me coming to visit without my child anyway. So maybe I'm not the one to ask.

Not necessarily though. If this is legitimate, she may have said something that her sister was unwilling to say.

In that same article it also says that she refused comment when contacted later by that media outlet.

Either LE doesn’t want this released for some reason, or Kelsey’s mother doesn’t.

This was posted very early on, immediately after Kelsey was officially reported missing. So I think it was maybe more of an issue of desperation and not thinking before typing. Not knowing what they were and were not supposed to say. Just trying to get the information out immediately.

It would be very understandable once they'd thought about it a bit, to just not want to address PF at all if it could be avoided. Just for the sake of the baby whether he is guilty or not.

If it is in fact true, it definitely does bring up the statistics of when a woman is in the most danger... when leaving a relationship. IF it's true I think she was likely going to leave WITH the baby to go see family and he wouldn't let that happen.

 

[gitana1]

Why dont we know more? Thats a serious question. Is there a reason we dont know more about these two?

Seems like the family has been told the less information out there the better. That runs contrary to every missing person case I've ever heard about.

Of course you dont want to give material facts about the investigation away but how does knowing why these two were living apart and creating a broken home for their daughter if they had intentions to marry? Could very well be for religious purposes but why is that so difficult to tell people when you are looking for their help to find someone. It just causes speculation and rumor which takes away people from coming up with ideas to find the missing person. This whole thing has been strange.

You know I don't know. I don't think it runs contrary to almost any missing person's case at this stage of the game. LE are usually tight-lipped in such cases and warn loved ones to be so as well. Even about things like that.

It comes down to LE doesn't need or wants us amateurs to try to do their job for them. They don't need any of us to come up with theories or assist them in any way in doing their jobs, except for spreading information so people can be on the alert for her or call in if they become aware of the case and remember something, and by giving them info if anyone has any that is pertinent, such as sightings or communications or observations involving the people in this case.

The CBI and the FBI are handling this case. They really don't want the public trying to get involved unless they already are involved in some way.

Although I know you're only talking about info that you think may not be material to the case (to me it's pretty relevant) so this is not directed at you, but I have noticed in general this sort of incredulity lately in multiple cases, that LE isn't giving us their information and handing their case over to us, and a feeling of entitlement to it as if they need us to do their work for them.

That attitude surprises me. LE can't risk the integrity of a case to satisfy a curious public. Nor should they. The CBI and the FBI are the pros here and know what they're doing. Even when cases aren't solved in a couple weeks and even when there are no arrests. Not hearing our theories isn't what's holding up justice in such cases, IMO.

 

[gitana1]

I have to say that the Idaho ping disturbs me for a different reason. If the person that took KB took her phone to Idaho, which seems to be likely, that person probably took her at least part of the way as well. Almost certainly that went through most of Wyoming. I don't know how many of you have been in central or across southern Wyoming, but if not, it's hard to describe. A hundred miles between towns, thousands of square miles of unpopulated, wild, open land. If this person, whoever disposed of KB there, whoever it was, she will likely never be found.

Like Susan Powell.