CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #6

[gliving]

The only "proof" that they broke up is PF's word. You could hypothesize that he said they broke up so that no one would think it was odd that KB wasn't around. If they had just broken up, PF also wouldn't be expected to be in frequent contact w/her.

Thank you.

 

[riolove77]

That info came from PF. None of her family, including the grandmother knew of this trip, I believe.

Yeah, I’d give “she broke up with me and left for Washington” the same amount of credence I gave to “we had an emotional conversation and she took the kids to a friends house.”

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

LE isn't just fishing with a backhoe.

A judge had to sign a search warrant with probable cause as outlined by LE from other documented and/or collected evidence.

LE is searching for more evidence to add to what they already know.

Florissant is range land. The ground is not soft and loamy. It is hard-packed and has sandy elements. The soil is made from the disintegration of mountains over geologic time. It is not riverbed soft. That's why the area is used to graze cattle, not grow crops.

Any excavation in this type of ground would take time, especially with each level measured, photographed and marked on a grid for evidence, just as an archaeological dig. LE may also be using a series of sized screens to sift for artifact. I know from personal experience that can be very time consuming.

PF competes in roping competitions with his quarter horses. He will have a sand-soil or clay, full-size riding arena on his property. He may have two of those. The ground under these arenas has been deeply plowed before the sand-clay was added.

 

[MassGuy]

I’m gone for the day and come back to LE digging on PF’s property. Not a good sign. I’m so sad it’s going this way. I felt it all along and still praying I am wrong. Seems LE has some facts we don’t have and they are moving fast.

Yeah. There is a reason for this, and I’d love to know what specifically justified this search.

They definitely know things that we don’t, and digging combined with a missing woman, is never a good sign.

 

[Mae’s Friend]

Agree with MassGuy. Warrants have scope supported by LE sworn affidavit(s). LE anticipated needing to dig with some equipment.

 

[Black eyed pea]

Just a question here if it is allowed, is anyone else wondering if the fiancé is avoiding the LE and the media because he has scratches/bruises, etc from an altercation that might have happened and needs time for those to heal?

 

[MassGuy]

Yeah, I’d give “she broke up with me and left for Washington” the same amount of credence I gave to “we had an emotional conversation and she took the kids to a friends house.”

Ironically, both women left without their vehicles.

We’ve seen this before. You’d think he had as well.

 

[Mom24]

The only "proof" that they broke up is PF's word. You could hypothesize that he said they broke up so that no one would think it was odd that KB wasn't around. If they had just broken up, PF also wouldn't be expected to be in frequent contact w/her.

Adding to that, it seems strange she would break up with him after telling her mother that they were going out together for Thanksgiving dinner. And if she were going on a trip, she'd at least pack some clothing.
Taking only her purse and keys makes more sense if she went with him somewhere in his car, like out to dinner as she had planned. What he had planned seems to include backhoes.

 

[Mom24]

Ironically, both women left without their vehicles.

We’ve seen this before. You’d think he had as well.

And without clothes, makeup, toiletries, suitcase or notifying anyone but PF.

 

[Cherokee]

So would they have needed to get a separate search warrant to dig, aside from the warrant they already had yesterday to search the property?

I am not an expert in Colorado law, but in most states, a search warrant is sufficient to include excavation of property. The only exception would be if the property included known or probable Native American sites that would be disturbed by the excavation. Then a separate court order would need to be obtained, as well as the on-the-scene oversight by state-licensed archaeology experts and representatives from any local tribes who might be affected.

 

[Deleted member 169742]

LE isn't just fishing with a backhoe.

A judge had to sign a search warrant with probable cause as outlined by LE from other documented and/or collected evidence.

LE is searching for more evidence to add to what they already know.

Florissant is range land. The ground is not soft and loamy. It is hard-packed and has sandy elements. The soil is made from the disintegration of mountains over geologic time. It is not riverbed soft. That's why the area is used to graze cattle, not grow crops.

Any excavation in this type of ground would take time, especially with each level measured, photographed and marked on a grid for evidence, just as an archaeological dig. LE may also be using a series of sized screens to sift for artifact. I know from personal experience that can be very time consuming.

Exactly

A 10 day old trench in hard packed soil ... would be very distinctive

A shovel would go in easy

Most the material would be "upside down"

And the sides would define themselves with early winter evidence.

The excavator would lift material, Provide light and dig adjacent to the trench

BUT, once these conditions were observed ... and there was no water or gas line below ... they would call the ME

If they observed lime ... they would also call for a priest

 

[Mom24]

I am not an expert in Colorado law, but in most states, a search warrant is sufficient to include excavation of property. The only exception would be if the property included known or probable Native American sites that would be disturbed by the excavation. Then a separate court order would need to be obtained, as well as the on-the-scene oversight by state-licensed archaeology experts and representatives from any local tribes who might be affected.

and unmarked graves. Other than that, most search warrants include the property as well as vehicles and outbuildings unless it's been restricted to the home or a specific area.

 

[Cherokee]

Digging a trench isn't the same. You're not cataloging and gps'ing everything you find, photographing it, and marking it. When you dig a trench, you're digging to find that line, which is already marked and gps'd so you just dig to the level you need, then clear it out to the line. This is tedious work, it's done very carefully and depending what they find, it can take time. They'll typically do a surface survey as it's not unusual for scavengers to carry things away from the original site, and they'll do a complete survey of the ground area to gather evidence on the surface. Everything found is marked, photographed, gps'd and then catalogued. After that, they're bagged and taken into evidence. That's all before the digging can begin because once they dig, the area is is destroyed. They excavate only inches at a time, they sift everything, document everything that's found, mark it, photograph it, and then enter it into evidence. Grids are put over the area to mark it, they have to be careful not to dig down to the body so they don't damage it. It's more involved than digging for a pipe under the ground.
They'll also want to notify the family and make preparations before they notify the public.

Thank you for this post. Exactly what I said. This is not digging a utility line. Any excavation is destruction. Everything must be done to catalog the site as it is being deconstructed so it can be reconstructed through analysis, photographs, markers and grids, documented and written comments.

 

[Inthedetails]

Yes, I'm curious to know whether or not he was telling the truth about the breakup, as it appears the trip was not really planned. Imo

ITA.

This trip, if there was one, involved not one of her two vehicles, no luggage or make-up, telling no one about it, including her employer until the night before the work week begins again. That is beyond spontaneous....it's unbelievable. imo.

FWIW, I'm not totally buying the "baby exchange" story either. I think the "exchange" involved him having the baby because Kelsey was gone.

I don't know what to think of the break-up story. Sounds too much like "an emotional conversation" from a recent case.

jmo

 

[haven71]

JMO, PK made two big mistakes to begin with that put LE onto him.

1. He told they had broken up on Thanksgiving Day. Why was that a necessary comment? Breaking up on a holiday is a cruel and thoughtless way to end a relationship. IMO, especially if he knows she is dead due to something he did to her. This statement would raise eyebrows with the LE guys I am sure.

2. He told she was going on a trip but no one knew about it besides him. What a goofy statement! Again, eyebrows would be raised that he was giving an explanation for her absence right at the start.

We WS have seen so many cases where a significant other tell the above two scenarios that soon as I heard them, PF was the guilty party in my mind.

His lawyering up immediately just added to my suspicions.

Please take the baby away from him now. Don’t give him the chance to hurt this precious child!

#1. I’m thinking is he may have told them she broke up with him on Thanksgiving Day because a. He had “disappeared” her and b. It would explain why he wasn’t in frequent contact with her or trying to get ahold of her in the following days, or her trying to get ahold of him (save for the one text he supposedly got from her). He had to say that or else he’d have to play the part of concerned boyfriend/fiancée and report her missing right away. JMO

#2. Likely he said she went on the trip to send them off in a direction far away from him. “She went thataway!” Lots of people have taken off for emotional reasons, and a breakup story could make a sudden unplanned trip more of a believable story (ie, she needed time to herself, to clear her head, etc).

JMO.

 

[gingerbeard757]

I'm sorry if this is common knowledge, but is there any live news coverage online or anything for those of us who arent local to CO? How did everyone find out about the digging equipment? TIA!!

 

[Inthedetails]

Just a question here if it is allowed, is anyone else wondering if the fiancé is avoiding the LE and the media because he has scratches/bruises, etc from an altercation that might have happened and needs time for those to heal?

Very good question.

Welcome to WS!

 

[Love Never Fails]

Yeah. There is a reason for this, and I’d love to know what specifically justified this search.

They definitely know things that we don’t, and digging combined with a missing woman, is never a good sign.

As I am catching up, I am also reading that PF gave the story of KB taking a trip and of them breaking up? No way would KB leave her baby behind while taking a trip like that, especially after breaking up with her boyfriend/fiancé, or whatever he was! He is sounding more like CW every day. Is all this true?

Yes I want to know what information they have. Unless he cooperates or confesses, we won’t know right away. They would not let the public know what evidence they find, will they? I mean, they don’t owe the public anything. Right?

 

[Irmese]

EVERYBODY has a least one prior love interest.

Sometimes we are not even aware.

KB, attractive, vivacious and at the age of 27, moved alone to Colorado.

We should be certain there was 1 or 2 love interests wherever she moved from.

This can not be taken off the table.

Nor taken lightly

Just the existence of a past lover, could have been enough to upset PF.

It is not outside reason that one of these interests could have contacted her ... and inspired her to rethink her life.

We are likely to discover emotions led to this tragedy ... quite likely that PF let emotions spiral ... and most likely related to old or new love interests.

So you agree that PF is the most likely person to have made KB disappear? If someone from her past had contacted her and "inspired her to rethink her life," don't you think she would have told her mother something like, "I'm rethinking my decision to marry P. My one true love has contacted me and I must return to him posthaste. I'm going to tell P tonight." I can see why she might need to rethink a relationship with a 30-something yo man who lives with his mother and perhaps has less personal financial security than she does. And I can see where he might not want his meal ticket to get away. There is absolutely no evidence that someone from either of their pasts set this in motion.

 

[NanZDrew]

The only "proof" that they broke up is PF's word. You could hypothesize that he said they broke up so that no one would think it was odd that KB wasn't around. If they had just broken up, PF also wouldn't be expected to be in frequent contact w/her.

Something that has made him suspect is why he didn't report her missing. This would explain that. If he believed she was away for on a visit, he would not report her missing.