Found Deceased Spain - Julen Rosello, 2, fell into narrow and deep borehole, Totalán, 13 Jan 2019

[k8ling0087]

This is a great diagram you included that shows their plan. Notice they had to drill about 4 meters past the depth of where the boy is.

This is obviously because when they drill over sideways to where he is, they dont want any dirt or debris falling on him. So they go deeper and then angle upwards toward him.

https://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachments/1548257371_graph-tunnel-jpg.165480/

I’ve seen that, but I didn’t really understand why. Thanks for explaining! Makes more sense now

 

[Hatfield]

Ive been reading some more to catch up and just wanted to mention that they shored up the 2nd hole they drilled with a "casing pipe". The casing pipe is a larger diameter pipe that basically touches the outer edges of the dirt in the hole and it keeps any dirt or debri from falling back into the hole that they will be going down into themselves. They had to shore up that 2nd hole because otherwise as they go down the hole then all kinds of dirt and debris will fall on top of them. So they use the casing pipe to prevent that.

This tells me they needed a very large drill bit when they were drilling which is why it probably took them a long time to get down that far. That is a very large diameter hole from the picture I am seeing. Its large enough for a human to be lowered into the hole in either a harness and cable or a small capsule cage.

Rescuers hug parents of Spanish boy who fell down a well as search team hope to reach the child | Daily Mail Online

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Ive been reading some more to catch up and just wanted to mention that they shored up the 2nd hole they drilled with a "casing pipe". The casing pipe is a larger diameter pipe that basically touches the outer edges of the dirt in the hole and it keeps any dirt or debri from falling back into the hole that they will be going down into themselves. They had to shore up that 2nd hole because otherwise as they go down the hole then all kinds of dirt and debris will fall on top of them. So they use the casing pipe to prevent that.

This tells me they needed a very large drill bit when they were drilling which is why it probably took them a long time to get down that far. That is a very large diameter hole from the picture I am seeing. Its large enough for a human to be lowered into the hole in either a harness and cable or a small capsule cage.

Rescuers hug parents of Spanish boy who fell down a well as search team hope to reach the child | Daily Mail Online

I’ve been curious to know why the borehole Julen fell into was not immediately cladded to prevent a further landslide on top of him, and on top of the ‘plug’ of earth they believe is above him.

 

[LarkBunting]

This is a great diagram you included that shows their plan. Notice they had to drill about 4 meters past the depth of where the boy is.

This is obviously because when they drill over sideways to where he is, they dont want any dirt or debris falling on him. So they go deeper and then angle upwards toward him.

https://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachments/1548257371_graph-tunnel-jpg.165480/

Just the little child icon with his name next to it has me tearing up, at this point. {{{Julen}}}

 

[Angleterre]

I’m trying desperately to hold out hope but I fear that it’s impossible for Julen to still be alive . For those that question the reality of a God and say ‘If he exists then he wouldn’t let this happen “, I see their point. However, there MUST be special plans afoot for these parents after the loss of two children and now potentially a third. Sometimes good always comes from something bad. What that will be and how long that will take to show itself is the unknown. I just pray that no matter what, Julen s parents can get through this and their experiences will make them destined for something spectacular - I’m not saying it will negate their loss, that will never happen but I do hope that there has to be a reason behind this and a future purpose for these devastated parents. I just cannot imagine why life is being so cruel
to them. Pray for Julen and Oliver and the unborn baby they lost, and pray for the parents and extended family to have the strength of will and determination to continue their important place in this life . I’m sorry to sound so morbid and I hope my views about something spectacular in the parents future doesn’t upset anyone as it isn’t meant with malice, just hope . X

 

[Elainera]

This is a great diagram you included that shows their plan. Notice they had to drill about 4 meters past the depth of where the boy is.

This is obviously because when they drill over sideways to where he is, they dont want any dirt or debris falling on him. So they go deeper and then angle upwards toward him.

https://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachments/1548257371_graph-tunnel-jpg.165480/

They don't know though if he's there right below the plug or if he slid further down. The space below the plug was said to be about 15 meters long.

 

[Violet77]

They don't know though if he's there right below the plug or if he slid further down. The space below the plug was said to be about 15 meters long.

What is it that makes them believe he isn’t at the very bottom, does anyone know? Sorry, might have been lost in translation for me

 

[Hatfield]

I’ve been curious to know why the borehole Julen fell into was not immediately cladded to prevent a further landslide on top of him, and on top of the ‘plug’ of earth they believe is above him.

View attachment 165488 View attachment 165489 View attachment 165490

They really cannot put "casing pipe" in the hole the boy fell into because laying down the casing pipe is fairly violent as the pipe bounces along the sides of the hole and so it would have just caused more debris to fall down on top of the plug/clog.

What they likely did though is they probably put a protective metal grated screen just over the very top of the hole to prevent the workers from kicking any more debris into the hole.

I see the clog now and that is a sad sight to see. I really wish they could have somehow put a water line with a "baby bottle rubber nipple" type thing on the end to get some water down to the boys mouth. They would have needed to also lower a camera down on a wire but we know they have those small cameras called "bore hole cameras" that can be used for that. The big problem they were worried about is making the situation worse for the boy but after 5 days I really think they should have tried that to somehow get a small water line and camera down to the boy.

It would have been very risky but they may have been able to use a very small diameter long metal rod and poke a hole big enough through the clog for a water line and camera.

Its just been too long now and I dont see how he can make it now but I will keep praying. Maybe the workers thought they could reach the boy without the delays I am reading about. Once they started with their 2nd hole drilling plan it was probably a decision they needed to stick with due to time constraints.

Uggggg. I will keep praying for a miracle.

 

[Elainera]

What is it that makes them believe he isn’t at the very bottom, does anyone know? Sorry, might have been lost in translation for me

AFAIK nothing has been said about where exactly they believe him to be. I think they drilled down to the immediate area below the plug to be able to get a camera into the well shaft from there first, before opening the whole 4m long horizontal passage. If they see him being much further down I guess they will have to drill deeper.

 

[Hatfield]

AFAIK nothing has been said about where exactly they believe him to be. I think they drilled down to the immediate area below the plug to be able to get a camera into the well shaft from there first, before opening the whole 4m long horizontal passage. If they see him being much further down I guess they will have to drill deeper.

Its a good question why they chose to only go right below the clog. Here is my guess on why they did that.

I suspect they feel the boy is part of the clog debris on the way down so they probably took a guess that he is mixed in with the clog debris (i know its terribly sad to think that).

The good news though is if this article is right then the total length of the hole he fell into is only 250 feet and they drilled their 2nd rescue hole at a depth of 197 feet so its only 50 more feet to the very bottom if he fell all the way. I suspect once they go across horizontally to the boys hole, if he is not right there, then they can just lower a hook on a wire line to snag the boy and pull him up on a wire rope. (sorry so graphic but it is likely how it will be done if they can visually see him at very bottom).

ETA The bad thing will be if he is at the bottom in a pile of rocks and cannot be seen then yeah somehow they will have to get a man down to him to help remove rocks to get to him. Or some kind of tool maybe could be used carefully.
Ugggg again. I hope they can see him as soon as they get to the boys hole.

"Rescuers have drilled a 197ft vertical tunnel in the Costa del Sol countryside hoping to save the toddler."

"Julen Rosello fell into the 250ft waterhole"

Rescuers hug parents of Spanish boy who fell down a well as search team hope to reach the child | Daily Mail Online

 

[crhedBngr]

Praying for that miracle, along with the rest of you . . .

 

[Elainera]

Its a good question why they chose to only go right below the clog. Here is my guess on why they did that.

I suspect they feel the boy is part of the clog debris on the way down so they probably took a guess that he is mixed in with the clog debris (i know its terribly sad to think that).

The good news though is if this article is right then the total length of the hole he fell into is only 250 feet and they drilled their 2nd rescue hole at a depth of 197 feet so its only 50 more feet to the very bottom if he fell all the way. I suspect once they go across horizontally to the boys hole, if he is not right there, then they can just lower a hook on a wire line to snag the boy and pull him up on a wire rope. (sorry so graphic but it is likely how it will be done).

"Rescuers have drilled a 197ft vertical tunnel in the Costa del Sol countryside hoping to save the toddler."

"Julen Rosello fell into the 250ft"

Rescuers hug parents of Spanish boy who fell down a well as search team hope to reach the child | Daily Mail Online

I'm not sure if the reporting there is correct. It has always been stated that the well is more than 100m/300ft deep.

Do you know about georadar? It was said they determined that there's a 15m long empty stretch below the plug. Would they also be able to determine with georadar where in that empty space Julen is?

 

[Elainera]

I’m trying desperately to hold out hope but I fear that it’s impossible for Julen to still be alive . For those that question the reality of a God and say ‘If he exists then he wouldn’t let this happen “, I see their point. However, there MUST be special plans afoot for these parents after the loss of two children and now potentially a third. Sometimes good always comes from something bad. What that will be and how long that will take to show itself is the unknown. I just pray that no matter what, Julen s parents can get through this and their experiences will make them destined for something spectacular - I’m not saying it will negate their loss, that will never happen but I do hope that there has to be a reason behind this and a future purpose for these devastated parents. I just cannot imagine why life is being so cruel
to them. Pray for Julen and Oliver and the unborn baby they lost, and pray for the parents and extended family to have the strength of will and determination to continue their important place in this life . I’m sorry to sound so morbid and I hope my views about something spectacular in the parents future doesn’t upset anyone as it isn’t meant with malice, just hope . X

I think the same way Angleterre and I don't think it sounds morbid at all.

But first there will be lots of pain, regret, and grieving for these parents. That is the hard part, and it's only beginning. I can't even imagine what they are going through now. Sending them strength and comfort. I hope this ordeal of waiting will soon be over.

 

[Hatfield]

This is awfully scary to think about if the boy is part of the clogged debri and they cannot just pull him to safety. What the workers will have to do is put some sort of "catch trap" screen clear across the hole so that as they pull rocks to free the clog , then if the whole gammit tries to fall to the bottom then the "catch trap" will prevent the boy from going all the way to the bottom.

What I cant figure out is how the workers are going to keep themselves safe and keep from getting hit with that same debri from the clog as they try to dig through the clog to see if the boy is in the clog material.

Ugggggg Again. This is depressing

All we can do is pray for a miracle and pray that the workers dont get injured either.

 

[Hatfield]

I'm not sure if the reporting there is correct. It has always been stated that the well is more than 100m/300ft deep.

Do you know about georadar? It was said they determined that there's a 15m long empty stretch below the plug. Would they also be able to determine with georadar where in that empty space Julen is?

That sounds good if they know there is a 15 meter stretch below the plug.

At 3.28 feet per meter, that is about 49.2 feet from clog to bottom. Still doable to try to recover the boy using a grabbing device and wire rope of some sort. Just hope they can spot him is the main thing. If all they see is rocks then it will be a rougher rescue.

 

[Flurries]

As well as praying for the family, I am praying hard and often for the rescuers. They are risking their lives, not unlike the cavers and divers for the boys Soccer team. Only this “rescue” is not certain, and the days wear own, the miners must be feeling the same trepidation we all are...yet they continue to dig.

 

[MOTORUNNER]

Yes... I really hope these rescuers stay safe and out of harms way. I am fairly certain sweet Julen is no longer with us, but I would be glad to be proven wrong.

 

[Elainera]

From an hour ago:

Breaking news available, finished the welding of last 20 meters tube and placed into the hole #Julen

we hope there are no more setbacks and the miners can go down.

Twitter

 

[Elainera]

A few minutes ago:

UPDATE #Totalan: The problem with the pipes not fitting into the well has been solved by reducing the diameter of the lowest 10 mtr of pipes. Hopefully the capsule will fit

The final preparations are now being made and the miners are likely to go down just after midnight. #Julen

Twitter



It is now 11.10 pm in Spain. So they will go down in about an hour.

 

[Hatfield]

A few minutes ago:

UPDATE #Totalan: The problem with the pipes not fitting into the well has been solved by reducing the diameter of the lowest 10 mtr of pipes. Hopefully the capsule will fit

The final preparations are now being made and the miners are likely to go down just after midnight. #Julen

Twitter

View attachment 165508

It is now 11.10 pm in Spain. So they will go down in about an hour.

Great news that they should be close to being able to attempt the boys extraction.

Here is a guess why they may have had a problem with the pipes fitting into the hole.

When digging a regular oil well the diameter is usually quite a bit smaller than the diameter of rescue hole they are digging. Since they need to lower rescuers down the hole they needed to keep the hole as straight down vertical as possible going down. What can happen is if you hit a particularly hard rock area then it can force the pipe to start drilling at a slight angle. For oil wells it is not usually a problem to have some slight deviations in the angle of the hole because the only thing you care about is getting down to the oil soaked rock formations (sometimes called an oil field).

But with this rescue operation they needed to stay straight as possible and it sounded like they started to get an angled deviation in the drilling near the bottom. So what they did was use a slightly smaller diameter pipe at the bottom which allowed them to fit the pipe straight down even though the hole was likely angled a little at the bottom.

Just hope they dont have trouble squeezing the rescue pod or people on a harness down the smaller diameter pipe.

The tolerances in drilling is usually very specific and drillers dont like to deviate from carefully planned out tolerances. Of course with this rescue they are sort of flying by the seat of the pants so things are allowed to deviate due to the urgency of time.