IA IA - Rose Burkert, 22, & Roger Atkison, 32, Williamsburg, 12 Sept 1980

New Posts

mysterymike said:
Let's examine this quote, for example.

In my opinion this destroys the "Roger killed while Rose was away" theory. This tells me they were both killed together with the "[FONT=&amp]struck in identical places on the back of the head[/FONT]" This more than likely wouldn't be the case if they were murdered separately.

At this point, I feel the killer/s may have used a gun to subdue the victims to the state they were found in, lying face down, and then attacked them. It could be that the victims didn't think they would be killed in such a way, or even killed at all.

Of course, just a theory.
Click to expand...

That's always been my theory and it would take a lot to change my mind.

From the killer's perspective, killing one and waiting for the other is too much of a risk. The body could be seen and a scream before the door's even fully closed. I think it was a very controlled situation and they both died within seconds of each other, possibly the blows to the head alternated between them.
 
mysterymike said:
[FONT=&amp][/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]You mentioned one gas station attendant saying he saw someone following them. Just one person, and not two? If the attendant noticed, I would think Roger and Rose would have noticed also. I guess what I’m saying is that it would be very easy to lose sight of someone you’re following if you’re following them for over two hours on different two lane highways through red stop lights and signs and other cars that could make you easily lose sight of them, and all it would take is one time and you wouldn’t be able to find them again.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp][/FONT]
Click to expand...

Or two people following them in two different cars, taking turns to follow more closely and swapping out from time to time to make it less likely they'd be spotted. That would explain the attendant spotting just the one following person or vehicle, not realising there was a second one.

Mobile vehicle surveillance using only one vehicle is not generally recommended because of the risk of losing the target or being identified.
 
mcbrainder said:
The bodies were found under the covers, so a quick attempt to run may have been futile.
Click to expand...

But the article linked early on in the thread said Rose was dressed, so why would she have got into bed? Is it possible that the couple were placed in or on the bed and the covers placed over them after they were dead?

As for the hotel being packed, I think maybe someone did see them but didn't know what they saw. I think about any time I'm in a hotel, I pass people all the time. I don't really observe them or know what I'm seeing. I suppose if a crime went down, my memory might be heightened. I know a lot of people were interviewed and there were no witnesses that saw anything strange.
Click to expand...

This is strange - the hotel was essentially full, and the assailant(s) was armed with an axe or similar weapon, yet neither victim screamed or tried to call for help, not to flee the room. Killing two people with an axe or similar isn't an instantaneous method by any means.

Also, even if the assailant(s) followed them to the hotel from Kahoka, he would have effectively had to get close enough in the hotel to see them book in and then follow them to their actual room, or be close enough to hear them being told their room number.

Further, strangers wandering around a hotel with an axe are liable to be noticed I would think.

Is there any indication as to when during their stay they were killed? I'm guessing in the early hours when there'd be fewer people about and maybe just the night porter in reception, but then any sound from the room would have been more noticeable and it's even more strange that Rose was still dressed.
 
MelmothTheLost said:
But the article linked early on in the thread said Rose was dressed, so why would she have got into bed? Is it possible that the couple were placed in or on the bed and the covers placed over them after they were dead?



This is strange - the hotel was essentially full, and the assailant(s) was armed with an axe or similar weapon, yet neither victim screamed or tried to call for help, not to flee the room. Killing two people with an axe or similar isn't an instantaneous method by any means.

Also, even if the assailant(s) followed them to the hotel from Kahoka, he would have effectively had to get close enough in the hotel to see them book in and then follow them to their actual room, or be close enough to hear them being told their room number.

Further, strangers wandering around a hotel with an axe are liable to be noticed I would think.

Is there any indication as to when during their stay they were killed? I'm guessing in the early hours when there'd be fewer people about and maybe just the night porter in reception, but then any sound from the room would have been more noticeable and it's even more strange that Rose was still dressed.
Click to expand...

To answer your first part, I would venture to guess that the killer/s ordered Rose and Roger on their stomachs either with a gun or the weapon he used to kill them, then covered them up after murdering them. As for Rose being dressed, she is most likely how the killer gained his entrance into the room, and that's why she was dressed.

Yes, you would have thought neighboring rooms would have heard 2 people scream as they were getting axed to death. However, it could be that once the killer/s had Roger and Rose where he wanted them, the fatal blows could have come so quick and so fierce in super quick succession that there wasn't any time to put up much of a fight.

How the killer/s found the room number is certainly somewhat of a mystery. You presented good theories on that. Another way is Rose could have encountered the killer after dark either when she moved the car or as she was coming back to the room from the bar. This could have been someone she knew and even somewhat trusted and even let into the room, effectively surprising Roger when she returned, which could explain why he was in shorts. If it was a stranger abduction, that would bring up other possibilities.

I don't think the killer just wandered around the hotel with the weapon. I'm sure he would have found out the room number first before the weapon came into play.

One of the article quotes I listed in an earlier post gave the time of death around midnight. To me, that sounds logical. Once the killer/s gained entry into the room, he may not have killed them right away.

And who knows for sure what time Rose came back from the bar.
 
morf13 said:
Here's a podcast episode about the case by the true crime podcast, Criminology. You'll hear from Roger Atkison's widow Marcella & Iowa County Sheriff Rob Rotter in this episode Ep51 - The Amana Hatchet Murders
Click to expand...
Just listened to this based on your tweet! Great ep, usually only listen to murder in my family. Gonna keep an eye on this thread now!
 
Being fully transparent, I was contracted to review & select potential cases for Paul's show, this case was at the top of my list ;)
There will be a couple more I have posted about on WS that Paul will also tackle
 
imstilla.grandma said:
Is A Serial Killer Responsible For 4 Brutal Hotel Murders?
Click to expand...

Thanks, @imstilla.grandma ! Hope you're feeling better. Great analysis of this case by Paul. Is it possible this was the work of a serial killer? I'm not sure I agree with the theory of a heroin addict squeezing the toothpaste to compensate for..... Could a heroin addict stalk victims and carry out these murders without being overpowered by a victim or caught escaping? Still so many questions about this case.

Here's a link to watch the episode online

Hotel Homicide
 
Last edited:
morf13 said:
Being fully transparent, I was contracted to review & select potential cases for Paul's show, this case was at the top of my list ;)
There will be a couple more I have posted about on WS that Paul will also tackle
Click to expand...

Yes, thanks for choosing this one. It's a case that is both somewhat obscure, but also highly unusual, very violent and brutal. I'm about 3/4 the way through the episode and it's very good. It helps so much to see the crime scene photos, the room, etc. to get an idea of what happened and the similarity to the other crimes. The toothpaste and choice of weapon always seemed so unusual to me, too.

Everyone should watch this if you get a chance.
 
Okay the series has just popped up on one of my streaming services. Where did they get with the exhumation/DNA testing? Any updates?
 
jslk said:
Okay the series has just popped up on one of my streaming services. Where did they get with the exhumation/DNA testing? Any updates?
Click to expand...
I've been waiting for this too! But not just this episode, I think just about all of them left some big potential breakthrough hanging. I still love the show, but we need updates!
 
S2 EP2 of Scene of the Crime is out now. In 'Crime Scene Investigation' we take a look at the hotel room crime scene, and the evidence that was found in Room 260. We address some theories of how the killer, or killers, accessed the room, and retrace the steps of the investigators as they notify Roger and Rose’s next of kin.
https://www.spreaker.com/.../scene-of-the-crime-season-2...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

DNASolves

Who is Escambia County John Doe (1989)?

Members online

... and 71 more.
Total: 2,733 (members: 72, guests: 2,661)

Online statistics

Members online
72
Guests online
2,661
Total visitors
2,733
Totals may include hidden visitors.

Forum statistics

Threads
592,186
Messages
17,964,826
Members
228,714
Latest member
hannahdunnam
Back
Top