Found Deceased UK - Libby Squire, 21, last seen outside Welly club, Hull, 31 Jan 2019 #15 *ARREST*

[bos]

I know it’s not going to be 100% certainty but there is doubt.

Ok, PR may have paraphillias which have caused offending behaviour. Even if he is found guilty of the 12 charges associated with that, it is doubtful that the prosecution can use previous offences/convictions as part of their narrative that PR is a creep.

Usually previous offences are not made public until after a jury has reached a verdict but if they were, literature suggests that between 5&10% of flashers progress to a contact sexual offence i.e. 90-95% don’t.

So, if we strip out the previous “creep” aspect, what are we left with? A man who claims to have left a young woman unharmed in a park and a number of passers by in the area who have not come forward to police because they have something to hide. In that scenario I’d be unhappy to convict PR.

 

[Skigh]

I would convict him for taking a young ,vulnerable girl who is not dressed for the freezing temperatures and leaving her in a dark park at midnight.

 

[EricaAmbrose1]

The decision to charge | The Crown Prosecution Service
There's a more detailed reading .

 

[EricaAmbrose1]

Charging and case preparation

 

[bos]

I would convict him for taking a young ,vulnerable girl who is not dressed for the freezing temperatures and leaving her in a dark park at midnight.

You’d convict for murder??

 

[Skigh]

You’d convict for murder??

I would!!
But I appreciate the CPS would need more evidence.

I think amongst other things forensic evidence will be found in order to charge and convict him.

 

[Newthoughts]

I know it’s not going to be 100% certainty but there is doubt.

Ok, PR may have paraphillias which have caused offending behaviour. Even if he is found guilty of the 12 charges associated with that, it is doubtful that the prosecution can use previous offences/convictions as part of their narrative that PR is a creep.

Usually previous offences are not made public until after a jury has reached a verdict but if they were, literature suggests that between 5&10% of flashers progress to a contact sexual offence i.e. 90-95% don’t.

So, if we strip out the previous “creep” aspect, what are we left with? A man who claims to have left a young woman unharmed in a park and a number of passers by in the area who have not come forward to police because they have something to hide. In that scenario I’d be unhappy to convict PR.

It is possible that there are only 12 charges because the others will be brought alongside Libby's case. They can't mention previous convictions but a lot of charges together gives a better picture of the sort of dark person that supposedly left Libby in the freezing park to meet an even darker person.

Cos his court appearance will be for 12 charges. Could Libby's be with more?

 

[bos]

I have no recollection of any Uk murder trial hearing other charges which are unrelated to the victim. Murder attracts the highest sentence so I couldn’t envisage charges like the ones PR already has against him being heard within the same trial as in all likelihood the judge would rule that they were served concurrently

CPS doesn’t necessarily move everything to prosecution; they have PR committing a range of offences over a two year period. I think any further charges would have to demonstrate either different charges e.g. sexual assault and/or a timescale prior to 2017 i.e depth and breadth of offending

 

[Enquirer-2019]

I have no recollection of any Uk murder trial hearing other charges which are unrelated to the victim. Murder attracts the highest sentence so I couldn’t envisage charges like the ones PR already has against him being heard within the same trial as in all likelihood the judge would rule that they were served concurrently

CPS doesn’t necessarily move everything to prosecution; they have PR committing a range of offences over a two year period. I think any further charges would have to demonstrate either different charges e.g. sexual assault and/or a timescale prior to 2017 i.e depth and breadth of offending

I think your right in general, but what about bad character? I think that can be raised in relativity to convictions but not charges maybe, and so maybe that’s why the wait... on a technicality?

 

[bos]

I think your right in general, but what about bad character? I think that can be raised in relativity to convictions but not charges maybe, and so maybe that’s why the wait... on a technicality?

That would come after jury had reached a conviction in the aggravating and mitigating factors to be taken into consideration for sentencing

 

[Enquirer-2019]

That would come after jury had reached a conviction in the aggravating and mitigating factors to be taken into consideration for sentencing

I didn’t know it came after a conviction only. Thank you for the clarity

 

[Newthoughts]

Is it the norm for murders to get charged quickly? Given that in many cases the police have the victim before the suspect.

It took nearly 18 months for police to get to the stage a of charging a carer who stole from an elderly relative of mine. Definitely not a complex case. Just looking at old bank statements. But no danger to society.

I know police got Levi Belfield off the streets by charging him with something unrelated to the murder of Amelie Delagrange. Then got evidence for her murder. PR is now safely off the streets. So what is the norm for charging?.

 

[Skigh]

In most of the high profile cases I have followed on here it has been quite quick but they were not behind bars at the time.
they waited a couple of weeks before arresting Vincent Tabak but they had him under surveillance.

 

[JosieJo]

I feel 2 weeks down the line from finding a body and 8 weeks down from arresting a suspect (that remains under investigation) is an unusual amount of time
I feel as soon as they have enough evidence they will charge whether he is safely behind bars or not because of the family and public perception

Normally forensics would be back by now and in 8 weeks of a murder enquiry CCTV would be also
We know they have done the PM

I find it unusual and worrying

They may be waiting some specialist tests from the PM is my only thought

 

[bos]

I feel 2 weeks down the line from finding a body and 8 weeks down from arresting a suspect (that remains under investigation) is an unusual amount of time
I feel as soon as they have enough evidence they will charge whether he is safely behind bars or not because of the family and public perception

Normally forensics would be back by now and in 8 weeks of a murder enquiry CCTV would be also
We know they have done the PM

I find it unusual and worrying

They may be waiting some specialist tests from the PM is my only thought

Taking the case of Joanna Yeates, the timeline went:
17th Dec : JY last seen
25th Dec : body found in Longwood Lane
28th Dec : police announce JY strangled & now murder enquiry
20th January : Tabak arrested & charged
31st Jan : body released to family after 2nd PM

Basically it took 3 weeks between the body being found and an arrest. Bear in mind that it only took 8 days rather than 7 weeks to find her body and that it hadn’t been immersed in water so that a cause of death could be more easily established and DNA evidence which linked Tabak to her found.

 

[Crazy Mama]

The body will decompose rapidly once out of water, refrigerated or not. To wait this long for a 2nd PM is worrying and it indicates to me (my opinion) that they have not got enough to charge anyone with yet, and they have to hold the body until they can make that charge. IMHO they don’t have enough evidence or they have some tricks ready to use that they don’t want to reveal as it could damage the prosecution. Maybe still waiting for toxicology results, let’s hope that they get something.
I’m on the fence tbh.

 

[Skigh]

Every time I check the news I hope to hear an arrest has been made.
I agree the longer the wait the more worrying it is.
As he has,I believe, admitted to have been in the car with Libby he will have an excuse for her DNA being found on his clothing so they will need more evidence to prove murder.
Do tests to see if some DNA samples were left after death need more specialised examination?
Are they trying to pinpoint a more precise time of death which links him to the time he was in the park?
Any other ideas of what is delaying his arrest?
I still remain positive that an arrest will be made soon.

 

[EricaAmbrose1]

From eighteen years as a police officer, I know indecent exposure isn't taken seriously
Written by a retired serving sergeant from Humberside Police force Topic has discussed previously many times. .He gives a history of the law regarding this offence.He does endorse also that flashing can lead to violence in some cases .

 

[margarita25]

Sorry if repost, bringing forward the most recent msm as I catch up:

Libby Squire memorial fund set up
53 minutes ago

“A fund aiming to reach £6,300 has been created, to give a prize of £300 each year to a student who has excelled in "community spirit and friendship".

The fund has reached £1,940, with 105 donors having come forward so far.”

Snip

“A testimony on the fundraising page says: "Libby Squire was a University of Hull student, she was a member of our community, she was one of us.

"Now we invite you to connect in Libby's name, and do something positive for the benefit of our current and future students."

Students are being invited to nominate peers whom they consider have significantly contributed towards the university's community.

The first "Libby's Prize" will be awarded in July 2020, the year Libby would have graduated.

University officials want to raise enough to offer a £300 prize annually for 21 years - an award to celebrate every year of Libby's life.”

—-

Libby Squire's memorial fund surpasses target in 24 hours
4/3/19

“The fundraising page reads: "Libby had taken our city and our university to her heart, and her loss has affected us all.

"Since learning of her disappearance in February, the university community have connected in hope, then fear, and ultimately sadness and grief.””

—-

Libby flowers preserved at church service
3/31/19

“Hull Community Church has collected more than 400 bunches of flowers from the bench area.
Minister Anne Dannerolle said they had been in contact with Ms Squire's parents, from High Wycombe, Buckinghamshire, who had asked that the flowers not be left to fade.”

“Ms Dannerolle said the potpourri was given to 160 people who attended the service, as well as Ms Squire's family and friends, and that anything left over would be handed out in the community.

"The response has been phenomenal. There has been this mass outpouring of love for Libby which has been wonderful to see," she said.

The church is now working with the family for a more permanent memorial to the student.””

“HULL COMMUNITY CHURCH
The church and the community have created a memorial around the bench for the student”

“Plans are in place for a more permanent memorial”

 

[TheCasual]

It fills me with so much pride that Hull is determined to never let Libby be forgotten.