Found Deceased WI - Kathleen Ryan, adult, teacher, car found burned with body inside, St. Francis, 2 Feb 2019

[OhThatVictoria]

Thanks for the map. It seems there are a number of possible routes from Kathleen's apt to the location where her car was found. Do you think it's possible for someone familiar with the area to pick out a route that avoids most surveillance cameras?

If Kathleen intended to commit suicide in a way that looked like an accidental car fire, or even a murder, would it make sense to use a different route all the way to avoid surveillance cameras? I can't think of a reason, but I've also not ever planned such a thing. To me, it would only make sense to choose the suicide location in a remote area without surveillance, not plan the entire drive to avoid surveillance.
MOO.

I’m wondering where the cams are en route while still in WI . . . . If at any time that day, her vehicle crossed the WI / IL state line, I know there are cameras at the toll booths on the IL side. Those cams are used too to ticket cars that go through open tolling without a sensor.

EDIT: Adding link for live traffic cams / SE WI region. Does anyone know if data for these sorts of cams gets stored? Wisconsin Cameras | View Live Wisconsin Cameras | 511WI

 

[OhThatVictoria]

It sure would help if we knew when and where Kathleen last used her credit card (and what she purchased)>

 

[Eleanor Rigby]

I’m wondering where the cams are en route while still in WI . . . . If at any time that day, her vehicle crossed the WI / IL state line, I know there are cameras at the toll booths on the IL side. Those cams are used too to ticket cars that go through open tolling without a sensor.

Like I said, I'm not familiar with the area, and while I've traveled through areas with highway tolls, I don't reside in an area with tollways so I'm not very familiar with them. Maybe this is a dumb question, but can't you cross from WI to IL on a "surface road" that does not have tolls or cameras at the state line? I can where I currently reside and in the other states where I've resided. Aren't tolls in IL to pay for the construction and / or maintenance of major highways and large bridges? Surely even IL doesn't charge a fee on every road just to enter the state!

When I played around with the map you posted up thread, I switched it to bicycling and to walking just to see other routes. It seemed to me it would be possible to cross into IL by car on a surface road.

If Kathleen was murdered or abducted in WI, and the murderers had a reason to want her car and body found in IL (maybe to complicate an investigation with two states and multiple counties), it would be very likely that they would avoid highways and cameras.

The only other way I can think of to transport Kathleen's car to IL unseen would be to load it into the back of a truck in WI and unload it in a secluded spot in IL near where it was found. Maybe I've watched too many movies! However, if I wanted to maximize my chances of getting away with murder I would not spare any trouble or expense. I bet there are plenty of guys locked up for life without parole who wish they had exerted a bit more effort in executing their crime. MOO.

 

[kay74]

So she started off on 94 and split to 41. Are there any rest stops on 94 before you get to the split? I'm thinking she took this route so many times, she didn't bother to lock her car door wherever this kidnaping happened, and, of course it's broad daylight. People at rest stops are from all over. I always lock my car when I'm at them.

 

[OhThatVictoria]

Like I said, I'm not familiar with the area, and while I've traveled through areas with highway tolls, I don't reside in an area with tollways so I'm not very familiar with them. Maybe this is a dumb question, but can't you cross from WI to IL on a "surface road" that does not have tolls or cameras at the state line? I can where I currently reside and in the other states where I've resided. Aren't tolls in IL to pay for the construction and / or maintenance of major highways and large bridges? Surely even IL doesn't charge a fee on every road just to enter the state!

When I played around with the map you posted up thread, I switched it to bicycling and to walking just to see other routes. It seemed to me it would be possible to cross into IL by car on a surface road.

If Kathleen was murdered or abducted in WI, and the murderers had a reason to want her car and body found in IL (maybe to complicate an investigation with two states and multiple counties), it would be very likely that they would avoid highways and cameras.

The only other way I can think of to transport Kathleen's car to IL unseen would be to load it into the back of a truck in WI and unload it in a secluded spot in IL near where it was found. Maybe I've watched too many movies! However, if I wanted to maximize my chances of getting away with murder I would not spare any trouble or expense. I bet there are plenty of guys locked up for life without parole who wish they had exerted a bit more effort in executing their crime. MOO.

Eleanor Rigby ~ Yes, it’s possible to take surface roads to avoid tolls / cams. Hwy 31 / 131 looks like that sort of option heading South from WI, (and connecting to Hwy 31 is convenient from her neighborhood.) Agree, if Kathleen was abducted in WI, one would wish to wait until dark and avoid I94.

 

[OhThatVictoria]

So she started off on 94 and split to 41. Are there any rest stops on 94 before you get to the split? I'm thinking she took this route so many times, she didn't bother to lock her car door wherever this kidnaping happened, and, of course it's broad daylight. People at rest stops are from all over. I always lock my car when I'm at them.

Kay - we don’t know for a fact what route was taken that day. If Kathleen had taken her regular route, she would have taken I94 past Gurnee. But that’s not where the car ended up. It was found off Hwy 41 which runs parallel to I94. We are posturing how it ended up there. I don’t recall a rest stop per se but there are major exits in the Racine and Kenosha area (Hwy 20 / Hwy 50) close to the state line. Important to note that there was highway construction in that area last Feb which created a lot of traffic

 

[nyonge]

"There is nothing that has brought us to any conclusion that somebody did this to Kathleen," said Lake County Sheriff's Office spokesperson Sgt. Christopher Covelli. "We don't have any evidence somebody caused this to happen to Kathleen."
Sons ask for answers in Milwaukee mother's mysterious death
Wow. I had not seen this until it was posted above.

 

[kay74]

Kay - we don’t know for a fact what route was taken that day. If Kathleen had taken her regular route, she would have taken I94 past Gurnee. But that’s not where the car ended up. It was found off Hwy 41 which runs parallel to I94. We are posturing how it ended up there. I don’t recall a rest stop per se but there are major exits in the Racine and Kenosha area (Hwy 20 / Hwy 50) close to the state line. Important to note that there was highway construction in that area last Feb which created a lot of traffic[/

Can you get to 41 from 94? Is there some crossroad?

 

[kay74]

Kay - we don’t know for a fact what route was taken that day. If Kathleen had taken her regular route, she would have taken I94 past Gurnee. But that’s not where the car ended up. It was found off Hwy 41 which runs parallel to I94. We are posturing how it ended up there. I don’t recall a rest stop per se but there are major exits in the Racine and Kenosha area (Hwy 20 / Hwy 50) close to the state line. Important to note that there was highway construction in that area last Feb which created a lot of traffic

Can you get to 41 from 94? Is there some crossroad?

 

[cluciano63]

"There is nothing that has brought us to any conclusion that somebody did this to Kathleen," said Lake County Sheriff's Office spokesperson Sgt. Christopher Covelli. "We don't have any evidence somebody caused this to happen to Kathleen."
Sons ask for answers in Milwaukee mother's mysterious death
Wow. I had not seen this until it was posted above.

Sounds like no one else used her cards or accessed money, etc...if any purchases were made, she seems to have made them. Can’t think of motives for this being a murder, if not very personal.

 

[nyonge]

Sounds like no one else used her cards or accessed money, etc...if any purchases were made, she seems to have made them. Can’t think of motives for this being a murder, if not very personal.

What's so breath-taking about the officer's statement is that it seems as close as he can get to saying she harmed herself without saying it officially. There must be other evidence for him to go this far.

 

[OhThatVictoria]

Can you get to 41 from 94? Is there some crossroad?

Kay ~ Heading South from Milwaukee to Illinois, Hwy 41 and 94 merge together. They then split in Illinois. You should be able to see it on this map. Google Maps

 

[sewnosy]

Aren't tolls in IL to pay for the construction and / or maintenance of major highways and large bridges? Surely even IL doesn't charge a fee on every road just to enter the state!

Hunt Club Road travels over the state line. When I lived in Gurnee, I sometimes would take Hunt Club Road from the Outlet Mall (torn down now) off of 294 back down to my home in Gurnee, just for a change of scenery. At that time (early 1990's) it wasn't very populated. Not sure about now.

 

[OhThatVictoria]

What's so breath-taking about the officer's statement is that it seems as close as he can get to saying she harmed herself without saying it officially. There must be other evidence for him to go this far.

What we are not hearing is that it’s a priority. What we are not hearing is that the Milwaukee PD is working the case, based on her last sighting in Bay View. What neighbor(s) saw her? Has the media contacted her neighbors? (Thud)

 

[Eleanor Rigby]

What's so breath-taking about the officer's statement is that it seems as close as he can get to saying she harmed herself without saying it officially. There must be other evidence for him to go this far.

I didn't come to the conclusion that LE thinks her death was a suicide, only that they don't have answers at this point in the investigation. Based on her son's statement, it doesn't appear the family has concluded it was suicide either. MOO. From the same article you quoted:

"But their investigation is far from over. The sheriff's office said they are still going through electronic evidence. The most recent clue released is that when Kathleen's body was found in the car, it was found in the passenger's seat."
"If they didn't find her driving, then someone had to have driven the car," said her son Zack Ryan.

 

[nyonge]

I didn't come to the conclusion that LE thinks her death was a suicide, only that they don't have answers at this point in the investigation. Based on her son's statement, it doesn't appear the family has concluded it was suicide either. MOO. From the same article you quoted:

"But their investigation is far from over. The sheriff's office said they are still going through electronic evidence. The most recent clue released is that when Kathleen's body was found in the car, it was found in the passenger's seat."
"If they didn't find her driving, then someone had to have driven the car," said her son Zack Ryan.

It is not hard to imagine a Catholic family's discomfort when confronted with the possible suicide of a loved one. As for the passenger seat, all she needed to do was to park the car and then slide over.

It is very difficult for us to imagine suicide by fire. In reading back through this thread however, I was surprised how many times people have actually committed the act, and inside their vehicles too.

The officer's words are loud and clear. "There is nothing that has brought us to any conclusion that somebody did this to Kathleen. We don't have any evidence somebody caused this to happen to Kathleen."

 

[kay74]

Kay ~ Heading South from Milwaukee to Illinois, Hwy 41 and 94 merge together. They then split in Illinois. You should be able to see it on this map. Google Maps

So how far after they split, did they find her? I'm too tired to go look.

 

[Eleanor Rigby]

I wish LE had stated if an accelerant container was found at the scene of the car fire. If it wasn't, that might make suicide less likely, unless one supposes she doused herself and the car in accelerant at some other location, disposed of the container, then drove to the location of the fire and ignited the car and herself. Hard for me to imagine. I can think of many far easier ways to stage a suicide as an accident, but truth is stranger than fiction, so maybe. However, at this point, with so few facts known, I'm keeping an open mind to other possibilities, regardless of the current published LE statements. The statements could have been taken out of context, or possibly LE chose that particular phrasing to make any suspects think they were in the clear, and thus let their guard down. LE has released ambiguous and misleading statements in other cases. MOO.

 

[Schmitz5100]

Like I said, I'm not familiar with the area, and while I've traveled through areas with highway tolls, I don't reside in an area with tollways so I'm not very familiar with them. Maybe this is a dumb question, but can't you cross from WI to IL on a "surface road" that does not have tolls or cameras at the state line? I can where I currently reside and in the other states where I've resided. Aren't tolls in IL to pay for the construction and / or maintenance of major highways and large bridges? Surely even IL doesn't charge a fee on every road just to enter the state!

When I played around with the map you posted up thread, I switched it to bicycling and to walking just to see other routes. It seemed to me it would be possible to cross into IL by car on a surface road.

If Kathleen was murdered or abducted in WI, and the murderers had a reason to want her car and body found in IL (maybe to complicate an investigation with two states and multiple counties), it would be very likely that they would avoid highways and cameras.

The only other way I can think of to transport Kathleen's car to IL unseen would be to load it into the back of a truck in WI and unload it in a secluded spot in IL near where it was found. Maybe I've watched too many movies! However, if I wanted to maximize my chances of getting away with murder I would not spare any trouble or expense. I bet there are plenty of guys locked up for life without parole who wish they had exerted a bit more effort in executing their crime. MOO.

I believe there is a road such as the one you’re suggesting but it goes into Waukegan. I don’t think the area she was found is near this area but I may be wrong in that.

 

[OhThatVictoria]

It is not hard to imagine a Catholic family's discomfort when confronted with the possible suicide of a loved one. As for the passenger seat, all she needed to do was to park the car and then slide over.

It is very difficult for us to imagine suicide by fire. In reading back through this thread however, I was surprised how many times people have actually committed the act, and inside their vehicles too.

The officer's words are loud and clear. "There is nothing that has brought us to any conclusion that somebody did this to Kathleen. We don't have any evidence somebody caused this to happen to Kathleen."

How can LE find evidence when it’s disintegrated by fire?