Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #96

[Skigh]

I have a hard time picturing the new sketch (young guy) on the body of the person on the bridge.

what if the young guy deliberately dressed as an older guy as part of his disguise.
Did he have access to those clothes perhaps from a welfare donation box
could be when he had visited the trail on other occasions he saw someone else who was there and tried to dress in a similar style.

 

[Yellow Rose]

Excellent. Proactive in a positive and practical way.

Made me wonder..... what is the level of awareness of the case in the general public would you say....Statewide and Locally? ( would you class yourself as 'local' being 50mi away? Not here in the UK but U.S maybe?)
Is it a huge case Nationally ? Statewide?

Obv the HLN stuff helps on a National basis and Im sure the nature of the case has garnered lots of coverage.

It's very hard to pinpoint the level of awareness but all major television channels carried the story at the onset and then sporadically since. At two years out, it's basically been just local and statewide with crime channels and bloggers carrying the brunt of the investigation.

 

[taylorss]

I have a hard time picturing the new sketch (young guy) on the body of the person on the bridge.

Same here! The BG figure seems to have a tired sag to him that doesn’t go with the tight jaw & chin of the new sketch JMO

BG does look different in each of the stills they released IMO he looks youngest in the one used @ post 674 ^.

 

[CrimeDawg123]

I have a hard time picturing the new sketch (young guy) on the body of the person on the bridge.

I do too. If I *stretch* I can see it, but it would not have been a natural recognition if not prompted by the just released sketch.

 

[Yellow Rose]

Also catching up on this thread, just a shoutout to all the posters using websleuths as it was intended - pondering and critically thinking, building ideas off others ideas, sharing opinions all within a forum designed for people who enjoy the challenge of finding a needle in a haystack - please don't discouraged by those posters who chastise and criticize what is presented. Keep in mind websleuths has a verification process for those particularly qualified to post with authority based on their field of training (lawyers, investigators, etc) and those posters are identified under their username. Everyone else, whether they remember to write MOO or IMO or JMO not (most of us) are still all just posting opinions and thoughts that have no more merit than anyone else. Some posters write with a more authoritative or eloquent flair that makes it seem like they are experts on all things crime but remember without a link its still just their opinion so please don't allow those posters to derail your train of thought as invaluable. Personally I like hearing everyones opinions, it keeps my thoughts fluid and moving in new directions and keeps the spark for the case alive! JMO

Thanks kindly for your eloquent reminder! I think there is even a BLOCK if needed.

 

[Harmony 2]

I have a hard time picturing the new sketch (young guy) on the body of the person on the bridge.

From my perspective, the new sketch does not look like the person in the video on the bridge. I think someone recognizes the person in the new sketch but is incredulous that the person they suspect could be a killer.

It reminds me of another case where two little girls (Skyla and Taylor) were killed. Initially a sketch of a native American was released as a person of interest and it turned out to be someone totally different.

 

[cody22]

From my perspective, the new sketch does not look like the person in the video on the bridge. I think someone recognizes the person in the new sketch but is incredulous that the person they suspect could be a killer.

It reminds me of another case where two little girls (Skyla and Taylor) were killed. Initially a sketch of a native American was released as a person of interest and it turned out to be someone totally different.

I think when or if BG is caught, this new sketch will only partially resemble him...moo

 

[teeandcee]

They actually go thru volumes of tips with several sets of eyes. They sort from the get-go into types of tips and then special investigative teams cover each of those types. I wish I could find the article I read from a published FBI investigator in Kansas. So personally, I see no reason why one of the piles couldn’t be of a technical nature.

Based on some gigantic punctuation-free walls of text I’ve seen on social media and my own rambling style I can’t imagine the poor folks doing this all day every day!

 

[FinePrint]

I have a hard time picturing the new sketch (young guy) on the body of the person on the bridge.

As hard as I try to see a younger person as depicted in the new sketch it is just so contrary to what I see when I watch the video of this guy.

I've told myself that I must be somewhat conditioned to think this way due to the old sketch but still, I see a guy in his mid 40's. Are my eyes fooling me???

 

[mekeritrig]

Hmm, it is like the photo of bridge guy. I try to expand it and it just gets blurry and I cannot make out any details.

Attached a higher quality picture of the screen

 

[DancingMuse]

what if the young guy deliberately dressed as an older guy as part of his disguise.
Did he have access to those clothes perhaps from a welfare donation box
could be when he had visited the trail on other occasions he saw someone else who was there and tried to dress in a similar style.

I so agree with you, Skigh.

From the beginning, I reserved 1% of my brain to this weird opinion:
1) Someone dressed up EXACTLY like RL.
2) Someone stalked the trail until they found two vulnerable victims, and murdered them.
3) The same Someone placed their bodies on RL's property.

To me, it is almost seemed like someone was trying to FRAME RL.

But why? Who?

 

[taximama24]

From my perspective, the new sketch does not look like the person in the video on the bridge. I think someone recognizes the person in the new sketch but is incredulous that the person they suspect could be a killer.

I don't see it either, and I think there is a possibility that in the end it will all come down to semantics on what specifically they said. Either that or they have a reason for saying they are the same when they know they aren't.

 

[neesaki]

LE is going to do whatever best helps drive resolution, even if it means their reputation takes a hit, they really don't care how any of us feel the presser was handled as long as their purpose was achieved. I have no doubt they didn't mention the new sketch being two years old specifically because that perks everyones ears and the actual details of the new sketch itself becomes forgotten while everyone focuses their energy on why it wasn't released two years ago. They gave themselves a few days head start of getting that image out there before we all shifted gears to the "why." Flying threw the part about the vehicle was also not a mistake in my opinion, I don't think they for one second think anyone who was in the area of these murders or drove by the abandoned CPS building during those hours didn't already think long and hard about anything they saw that would be helpful in figuring out who did this and already talked to LE in the past two years. That request was more likely a veiled warning to the POI than a public request for details.

Whether we are talking about the "script" or the "passion" or the "lack of details" or the "new details" or "do they have their guy" or "they're still clueless" or whatever, the presser is achieving its purpose. The case is not forgotten, it has people talking, its reminding people its unsolved...its ensuring the POI stays nervous and doesn't get comfortable with the idea of having gotten away with murder. As far as LE is concerned, talk all you want about everything they did or didn't do right, as long as you're talking...Hollywood's rule of thumb, bad press is better than no press.

Great post, taxi mama, ITA.

 

[JSolt1210]

I've been doing a LOT of thinking over the past week. I've torn the PC apart and examined every word. I posted shortly after the Presser to make the comment that I felt that every word was chosen specifically and that LE was on script. I still believe that.

1. The Shack - I don't think this was just arbitrarily thrown into the mix, just because. It was part of the Presser for a specific reason. It brings religion, spirituality, faith, redemption, forgiveness and other christian themes to the forefront. Somehow, LE believes that either the POI is religious in himself, OR there is a religious reason for the murders. They played on those beliefs in the Presser to elicit a response somehow. I do not believe we can discount "The Shack" as meaning nothing. It was mentioned for a specific reason.

2. The Timing of The Presser - Easter Monday is significant I believe. Again it goes to religion and a belief system. Jesus DIED FOR OUR SINS is the theme of Easter and new life. Forgiveness and the promise of being born again. Jesus is risen. To me, this was Presser was timed to take advantage of those themes and thoughts. The girls have risen and are not how you left them. They are in a better place. Then pressure on the killer by way of the Easter theme of someone dying for his sins. I could be way off base here but just thinking out loud at this point.

3. The Timing of the Presser and Prior Notice - They wanted as many people there as possible. They know they are looking for a younger person so over Easter break University Students would be home. If the Killer is a University student then the likliehood of him being home for Easter is a possibility. If there are religious ties, then being home for Easter is even more likely.

4. "We've either interviewed you or someone close to you" - This is to illicit fear. OMG you know me! It's also a message to whoever he's either told or who is protecting him that LE is on to them.

5. Hiding in Plain Sight - How do you hide in plain sight? Well, the original sketch allowed the killer to hide in plain sight for 2 years. That's number 1. You hide in plain sight when you believe you are untouchable and no one would suspect. You hold a position in the community that holds you in fairly high esteem. Teachers, Clergy, LE, Policitians, Volunteers, Firemen, Doctors, Paramedics, Government Officials. You are someone that can talk the talk and walk the walk and people would NEVER suspect you. You are from Delphi or neighbouring areas. You belong there. You know people. You know the lay of the land. You are connected. You are beyond reproach. You can walk down the street and know people. You are one of them. This is probably the most frightening part about this whole thing. Everybody knows you.

Sorry for the long post but I've been thinking about this presser for days now and I just had to get this all out.

MOO as always.

I agree with all of this—especially with the link between Easter and The Shack, since both tie to religion. As Jesus died through no fault of His own but because of the willful choice of others, so too did these girls die not because of anything they did, but because someone chose to take their lives. And as the father in The Shack found hope and redemption after losing his little girl, so will the family of these two girls.

RE: hiding in plain sight: Someone on YouTube commented on the PC video saying that at the moment the police offer says "directly to the killer who may be someone in this room," around the 4:00 mark, both police officers appear to look intently in the same direction, as if they were staring down someone off camera. Did anyone else see that?

 

[Cryptic]

For a beginner this was some seriously pro-level skill or luck. So, does this person have training to be a stealthy killer? I've asked before because I know nothing about what could possibly provide you with skills that ensure control of two victims, a pre-selected site and escape route (it would seem) and the ability to disappear, for all intents and purposes.

Is it a part of armed forces training?

For most crimes involving minors, I think the only skills one needs to control the victims are just psychological:

- A dominant personality with a command voice that mixes threats with promises of safety if the victims comply. Or, conversely, familiarity between the perpetrator and the victims to the extent that they are not prone to resist. Likewise, escaping unseen would be mostly be a matter of luck.

As for military training providing skills to quietly and physically gain control over people via their hands, then escape with out notice, the vast majority of military service members would receive absolutely no specialized training in this area. Though others would receive exposure to such training, actual continuing practice in such techniques to where full and quick proficiency is developed would probably be limited to Special Forces and especially the ultra elite tier one units (Delta and Seal Team 6).

Needless to say, there are very few of Special Forces people around. Special Forces soldiers / sailors are also actively screened to weed out potential criminals, the unstable, and the uncontrollably aggressive. Though 'bad apples' exist in any population of humans, they are extremely rare in these units. In short, if the perpertrator was not known to the victims, it is far more likely he gained control by olde fashioned dominate personality and escaped un-noticed via luck instead of through military training or say, life long backwoods trapper skills.

 

[ab01]

I think it really depends on the motive for the killings. Until we hear otherwise, I'll believe that he wanted to kill someone, and it didn't matter who. As long as it wasn't a sexual crime, I don't believe looks, age or gender would really matter. I don't think he had to spell it out that the community was probably in danger until the guy is caught; if someone were to tell me that a man who brutally murdered 2 young girls was living in my community, with no idea who he was, I'd like to think I could figure out that there was a threat there. MOO

Yeah I'm not sure what people expect? Should he get up there and say listen Delphi you need to stay inside keep your doors locked, don't let your children go outside and put your lives on hold till we find this guy?

Thats obviously not possible

I'm not sure how many unsolved murders there are in Indiana, But I'm sure there are a lot just like everywhere else.

The scary truth is we can come in contact with people like BG at various times throughout our normal everyday activities.

A coworker, a person at the supermarket, gas station etc etc

I think its logical to expect that people know there is still likely a murderer out there.

LE generally doesn't like to induce panic

And one should always be aware of their surroundings

 

[ab01]

lets say a witness comes forward and says,
"My dad (brother, uncle, husband) looks a lot like BG. He has been cutting his hair different since the killings, sometimes when he drinks he brings up the case, he used to work in a place that would take him by the bridge."?
(I tried to construct that in a way to conform to what they told us, "what is a good tip")
What would be the next course of action? Is that alone enough to get a warrant? If it is, what would they get the warrant for?
LE would have too look for something solid that matches something they already have, DNA, Car with matching description and plates, a finger print, murder weapon. As it is right now, LE has seemed to have led us to believe they do not have any of those. I think they must have something, otherwise when they get a tip, what would they be hoping for? That when they go question the guy he admits it? has the weapon just hanging out on his coffee table?

No that alone would not be enough to petition for a warrant

They would likely start by seeing if the person has a criminal history, outstanding warrants etc

They would likely look into the persons job and see if he could have possibly been there on that day

Then they would see if they could find any other significant connection to the victims or the location specifically

Then they would likely ask for a voluntary buccal swab

JMO

 

[JSolt1210]

Also, regarding the sketches...

I apologize if this has already been said here, or in any of the many other threads begun and ended since the PC (there's SO MUCH to read!).

Personally, I still think the first sketch matches more closely the individual captured by the girls' cellphone. I see scruff and a cap, like in the first sketch.

However, I wonder if the police are now directing us to the second sketch, the one with the clean-shaven, bare-headed male, because new information suggests that, since the time of the murders, the killer has attempted to conceal his appearance by no longer sporting facial hair or a cap.

He could still be an older gentleman who simply looks younger when he's clean-shaven. Or he could be a younger gentleman who looks older when he leaves scruff.

 

[neesaki]

As hard as I try to see a younger person as depicted in the new sketch it is just so contrary to what I see when I watch the video of this guy.

I've told myself that I must be somewhat conditioned to think this way due to the old sketch but still, I see a guy in his mid 40's. Are my eyes fooling me???

I think it’s the clothes, they’re not “young guy” clothes. I don’t know why but I don’t have a problem seeing that head on that thin body... the head appears thin to me as well, thinner than that of the sketch... I do wonder why that is.
The clothes fit poorly, are quite oversized, most likely in order to try and disguise himself, to try and appear like a totally different person. Maybe he was fairly successful at doing that, IMO.

 

[sloane7777]

what if the young guy deliberately dressed as an older guy as part of his disguise.
Did he have access to those clothes perhaps from a welfare donation box
could be when he had visited the trail on other occasions he saw someone else who was there and tried to dress in a similar style.

Or his dads clothes?