Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #97

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Sketches are always ballpark

As in complete strangers can’t match them up with strangers on the internet like they are comparing Two photos.

A sketch is a sketch


Replied to add

Which is exactly what infuriates me about what has happened all over social media!

It’s utterly ridiculous and it hurts the investigation, wastes valuable resources, makes investigations take longer and is not fair to the victims families.

On top of that it destroys innocent people’s lives

Ugggghhhh end rant
 
My thoughts on theory that BG perhaps asked the girls for help with something doesn't seem likely, given his tone when he said 'Guys....Down the hill". You wouldn't necessarily use a commanding type tone for anyone willing to help. jmo

First post on WS by the way...love everyone's thoughts here :)
 
totally agree with you.
My guess is, since it's seems the perp is a younger person, that
the vehicle in question could be titled to a son and parent.
Son and parent must be covering for each other OR LE has
only spoken to parent. Maybe son was away at school and
parents lawyered up and won't allow son to speak w/ LE.
That's just my hunch.

A hunch or working backward from a specific father and son/car combo?
 
My thoughts on theory that BG perhaps asked the girls for help with something doesn't seem likely, given his tone when he said 'Guys....Down the hill". You wouldn't necessarily use a commanding type tone for anyone willing to help. jmo

First post on WS by the way...love everyone's thoughts here :)

Welcome oh my cats. :)
 
The water tower is nearby. I wonder if there is a camera mounted on it to ensure that it is not damaged?

NASA was already mentioned once by LE in one of the press conferences, along with Disney in assisting to perfect Libby’s video.

At the time a question flicked across my mind as NASA wouldn’t be the first I’d expect to offer digital services but I guess they must be.

However NASA is definitely directly connected with satellites which photograph the earth. Google’s “satellite view” is a good example of a satellite image, close enough to clearly observe cars parked in driveways or parking lots.

This is how I think LE is certain of the hours the car was parked.
 
IMHO JMO MOO you may have just answered the mystery of the two weeks which is that yes they have a partial profile so they know which family but the family has so many males that they know it was going to take a few weeks to sort out who.
But how many of those males would have used the car in question?
This seems to tell us they know who the perp is. They know he
used the (jointly owned) car on the 13th. They know he was home
from school or not in school at that time. He may be back in school now and away from home so that's why LE haven't talked to him.
BUT they can't reliably place him at the scene at time of murders
and can't reliably connect him to murders.
So PLEASE PUBLIC, We need your help.
 
In the first week there was a woman who posted about stopping on Hwy 25 to see if a man needed help. I don't remember if she was going to offer him a ride or just to call someone for him. She was really shook up and wondered if she should call the tip line. We were horrified, that she would stop for a stranger on the hwy! And we told her don't call, get in the car and go there now. She thought he actually touched the roof of her car although it had rained. I have wondered if she was legit, and if she was this witness!

Hmmm...I’d be interested in seeing that post if it can be found in this haystack.
 
NASA was already mentioned once by LE in one of the press conferences, along with Disney in assisting to perfect Libby’s video.

At the time a question flicked across my mind as NASA wouldn’t be the first I’d expect to offer digital services but I guess they must be.

However NASA is definitely directly connected with satellites which photograph the earth. Google’s “satellite view” is a good example of a satellite image, close enough to clearly observe cars parked in driveways or parking lots.

This is how I think LE is certain of the hours the car was parked.
Excellent thoughts....moo
 
Latest interview with Becky on a live chat type of podcast with GH. She was asked in the chat about this girl. Right then and there she (Becky) texted that girl and asked her if this was true, if she was going to go with the girls that day to the trail and the girl replied back to Becky that it was not true. Wish I had time to dig up that interview/podcast/chat with GH but it is easy to find just google GH Delphi and you will find it.

Thank you, that you know it’s not true is good enough for me. It’s interesting how false rumours get started.
 
My thoughts on theory that BG perhaps asked the girls for help with something doesn't seem likely, given his tone when he said 'Guys....Down the hill". You wouldn't necessarily use a commanding type tone for anyone willing to help. jmo

First post on WS by the way...love everyone's thoughts here :)
Welcome :)
 
totally agree with you.
My guess is, since it's seems the perp is a younger person, that
the vehicle in question could be titled to a son and parent.
Son and parent must be covering for each other OR LE has
only spoken to parent. Maybe son was away at school and
parents lawyered up and won't allow son to speak w/ LE.
That's just my hunch.
Could be, but that wouldn't be my first thought. Most 25-35 year olds have their own car and are finished with school but there are always exceptions. This guy may not have gone to college and may not have even been working at the time for all we know. Imo
 
totally agree with you.
My guess is, since it's seems the perp is a younger person, that
the vehicle in question could be titled to a son and parent.
Son and parent must be covering for each other OR LE has
only spoken to parent. Maybe son was away at school and
parents lawyered up and won't allow son to speak w/ LE.
That's just my hunch.

Could be, but a 20-30 year old, unless there is guardianship in place (probably not the case), is own person.
What does it mean, won't allow son to speak to LE? Is he demented, mentally ill? Then why not treated prior to all of this?

He can refuse to talk to LE, and refuse a polygraph, and refuse to leave the house, but in the situation like this, in a small community, in a semi-rural community, in IN, such approach means their days are numbered, in a way. Not physically, but they won't be able to leave the house just like this. MOO.

I live in a big city where potential criminals can slip through the cracks, if they cover things up well, and it is easier here, because no one cares what their neighbors do. (Good if they know the neighbors). But in a small, tightly-knit community, the situation is different. Can you imagine the anger, the wrath, of the people living there? No one will help these people any longer, because of the fear of association with crime. Financially, too. So, it is hopeless for the family.

In fact, the longer they wait, the more the anger, and maybe, the harsher the judgment would be.
 
It also makes me wonder if they now feel like the people that they had work on the images, in a effort to make it clearer may have actually unknowingly distorted some characteristics

No fault of their own, but I think what’s not there originally as far as pixels just can’t be overcome imo

Theses people, nasa, fbi etc are well trained and know what they can and can’t do. I think they were just fighting an uphill battle

The problem is no matter what the general public thinks. Pixels are pixels and I believe the original image was of low quality and shot from a great distance

Jmo
Does anyone know what type of phone Libby had?

I was wondering if her camera was in 'selfie' mode while she videoed him and then zoomed in, thus distorting the pixels. (I cannot do this on my phone - I do NOT have an i-phone, nor do I know if an i-phone can do this, I am just pondering.)
 
I think they are trying to catch someone related to that vehicle that has lied to them.
I think that's possible. Here's what's been bugging me since the presser. This is what Carter said: "Directly to the killer who may be in this room. We believe you are hiding in plain sight. For more than two years you never thought we would shift gears to a different investigative strategy but we have. We likely have interviewed you or someone close to you. We know that this is about power to you and you want to know what we know. And one day you will."

I kept thinking what is this "different investigative strategy"? Sure we have a different sketch but it's not a new strategy to find someone who can recognize and identify a sketch. We have a short portion from Libby's video but we've already seen a still from the video. Again IMO not a new strategy. We now hear BG say "guys" before "down the hill", but we already had "down the hill". IMO the only things different in LE's plan (strategy) is they are now looking for someone local verses someone not living, working in Delphi and that vehicle from the abandoned building's parking lot.

So to me, they've narrowed down their suspects and have focused on one in particular who is associated with that vehicle. I think they know who it is and where they parked and now their strategy is to get the person who lied about the vehicle to tell the truth. JMO.
 
IMHO JMO MOO you may have just answered the mystery of the two weeks which is that yes they have a partial profile so they know which family but the family has so many males that they know it was going to take a few weeks to sort out who.
It could take even longer than that. In the golden state killer's case, once they had a match it took three months to narrow it down. Even after that they have to figure out how to get the killers DNA. Jmo
 
Looking at this graphic (if I am reading this correctly), the girls were more or less at the end of the bridge when the footage of BG was taken. It seems like a very long bridge so I would assume that they would have known he was behind them for some time?



Again, looking at the graphic, which way did they go? Because the distance for the end of the bridge to the water appears quite far, which is why I'm curious as to where he took control over them. Did they leave the bridge and decide to walk back to the pick up point and were approached in the forest? Abby may not have been familiar with the area, but Libby and her family were.

According to reports, one of the girls father, Derrick, made it to the bridge, but turned away rather than crossing. The elderly gentleman that he spoke to mentioned that he had only seen a man and woman under the bridge. Where are these witnesses? When they were searching for the girls, they were calling their names and it is said that the voices carried very well. If the girls were close to the bridge and perhaps they screamed, then the people under the bridge should have heard something.

ETA: There was a female hiker on the bridge taking photos at the time the girls were murdered. Why did she not hear or see anything? Why did BG not target her or know she was in the area?

If you look at the map I made, you can see the creek is the closest possible escape route. They can't re-cross the bridge and all the other routes of escape (indicated by red lines) are terrible choices and require running much further and, even so, not necessarily promising help of any kind. On the other hand... a ride to pick them us is going to arrive soon across the creek... safety is across the creek, imo.

A lot of us assume BG grabbed them or otherwise took control of them at the end of the bridge and "down the hill" means the hill at the end of the bridge. We have no way of knowing that to be fact. Some of us say we see a gun in BG's right pocket. Maybe the girls saw the same thing that day and didn't wait for him to get to the end of the bridge at all.

They both knew that park... I've seen a photo of Abby fishing along the creek. I've read in MSM that they both loved to go to that park. Wouldn't they know the best ways to go to get to safety? They might know the creek was shallow at that point. I bet they did, imo. The creek is approximately 0.06 mile from the creek... probably a bit more as it's hard to measure using Google Earth due to changes in elevation.

Maybe they took off running (as soon as the video Libby made was done) and crossed the creek and made it some ways up the hill just beyond where their bodies were found... with BG, all the while, running behind them. He may have caught up with them finally and said those very same words... "Guys. Down the hill." If this is true and if they did go back down that hill... that would be right where they were found in the end. Clothing could have been thrown into the river after they were deceased.

Conversely, had they made it to the top of that hill, they would have come to the cemetery and Route 300N and maybe they were hoping people would be there. What's more... down that road to the left would bring them right to the spot where their ride would be (or would soon be waiting for them) at the main entrance of the park.

It's another theory and one I've been wondering about for a long time. I think Abby and Libby thought they knew that park as well as anyone else. If you really study the maps and maps history you will see that there is only one possible good choice of where to run. Across the creek and up the hill to the cemetery, imo... all the while hoping people might be walking along the trail(s) over in that area across the creek, as well.

My entire comment is my opinion.
 

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Personally I think it’s of interest as in they want to hear from the driver, or hear from someone that knows that the driver was there that day

Almost sounds to me like they already know the car was there and all about it, but they just can’t prove if the person they suspect was actually there.

Or they have no idea who may have been driving it.

Jmo
From @Falling Down an interesting observation:
In the L&E investigation in Iowa, LE waited until 3 tips had come in before announcing the description of the vehicle.
 
My thoughts on theory that BG perhaps asked the girls for help with something doesn't seem likely, given his tone when he said 'Guys....Down the hill". You wouldn't necessarily use a commanding type tone for anyone willing to help. jmo

First post on WS by the way...love everyone's thoughts here :)

Welcome!

And, I agree. I think it was a command, plain and simple, to get them to where he wanted them to go.
 
My thoughts on theory that BG perhaps asked the girls for help with something doesn't seem likely, given his tone when he said 'Guys....Down the hill". You wouldn't necessarily use a commanding type tone for anyone willing to help. jmo

First post on WS by the way...love everyone's thoughts here :)
Welcome! I agree!
 
My thoughts on theory that BG perhaps asked the girls for help with something doesn't seem likely, given his tone when he said 'Guys....Down the hill". You wouldn't necessarily use a commanding type tone for anyone willing to help. jmo

First post on WS by the way...love everyone's thoughts here :)

Welcome to Websleuths oh my cats. It is great to have you here. Thank you for joining the case thread for Abigail and Liberty. Great first post. It is great to have so many new members join our special online community.
 
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