Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #102

[Jaclin]

In Carter's most recent interview (yesterday) he indicated that he was 100% positive BG watched the April 22nd presser from 'close by'. I hope he's right, but how can he be so sure? What do you think is most likely:

1. LE has BG under surveillance, and their intelligence suggests that BG watched or reacted to the presser in some way.
2. LE is going off profiling in their confidence that an offender like BG would have watched the presser, so they assume he did.
3. LE really have no idea if BG saw the presser, but are playing cat-and-mouse with him and trying to rattle him in case he did watch the presser.
4. LE received a tip from the public that indicates that BG saw the presser.
5. Other???

Unless BG is under surveillance and the police just don't have the evidence to charge him yet, I don't think anyone can know for sure that BG saw the conference. It follows that if he is a local he would know about the press conference. It then follows that he would want to know what the police know, just as DC stated during the conference. Of course, a lot of us want to know what the police know so we could possibly help better, but we're not learning much. It seems intuitive that BG would be very interested in what the police are saying that might relate to him. I would assume that much.

 

[Laughing]

I just had the uncomfortable thought that realistically, if my own mother saw a grainy three second video of me wearing (possibly) two pairs of pants, an undershirt shirt, a hoodie and a jacket I'm not sure she'd recognize me. Same situation holds true for acquaintances who might pass by me if a public park, especially if I kept my head down.

A softball park is under construction in honor/memory of these young ladies.

Would you recognize a person if you had only ever seen that person wearing this:

Cody22, start looking for photo registries of umpires, please.
IDK JMHO YMMV

 

[Cutiekitty]

I'm still wondering if the new sketch wasn't improperly placed (or blown off by the wrong lower ranking person) for all this time and that's why DC acted so upset during the conference. Maybe DC saw this sketch as a lead that the major players were denied the whole time setting the case back. They haven't given us any reason why the sketch was disregarded for the first 2 years and is all of a sudden relevant. I think they screwed up somehow with this sketch and they knew it.

Could’ve been that for sure. I like that a lot better.

I’m not as sure of BG being LE as I was then. I heard about the case when it first happened, but didn’t follow anything till after the PC. It was just my initial gut reaction based on the PC.

 

[HockeyMom330]

I'm still wondering if the new sketch wasn't improperly placed (or blown off by the wrong lower ranking person) for all this time and that's why DC acted so upset during the conference. Maybe DC saw this sketch as a lead that the major players were denied the whole time setting the case back. They haven't given us any reason why the sketch was disregarded for the first 2 years and is all of a sudden relevant. I think they screwed up somehow with this sketch and they knew it.

BBM
I don't think the public will know why the first sketch was disregarded until the case is closed and goes to trial. I've got the impression Carter is eager to share details with the public, but just can't explain LE's strategy as it will damage the integrity of the case. He keeps saying something to the effect of 'one day I will be able to tell you'.

My theory on why the sketch was disregarded is that LE investigated the tip and spoke with the person depicted in the sketch (or someone in his family) and was satified with the information/alibi that person provided. He probably seemed like an unlikey suspect as he was young, clean-cut, and possibly well respected in the community. (This does imply IMO that LE knows who BG is...and I know many people here will refute that with very logical reasons).

They then received tips about another possible suspect (OBG) who was seen on or around the trails or hitchhiking nearby that day. This guy fit their profile better of someone who looked rougher around the edges, was possibly transient, and might have priors. They then went on to investigate people like DN who seemed to match their profile and sketch. I assume partial DNA ruled out DN and LE lost interest in him. I personally think OBG is CE, and its creepy to imagine that yet another predator may have been on the trails that day, but alas the trails are a 'victim rich' environment. After CE's arrest they were able to rule him out with DNA. Maybe he even admitted to being on the trails that day but asserted that he had nothing to do with the murders. I think that's when they scrapped their second sketch and went back to square one--the beginning. How they are so certain all of a sudden that the new sketch is in fact the killer I'm not sure, but maybe having new eyes on the case (GBI) uncovered some new evidence.

 

[Rosegold68]

whoever did this isn't too bright. why did he not remove the phone? where was it found?

i think a big clue is hiding in the method of the murders.

 

[Jaclin]

Just bumping this link forward since I see the subject being discussed here....

Police: Delphi murder victims spoke of man behind them in audio played for family

"State police say more audio from Libby German's cell phone was played for the victims' families, including a mention of a man they noticed behind them."

I wish LE would release the audio of them talking about the man so we can discuss the context of their discussion. (No mention of creepy man in this link though.)

I know they can't release it to protect the integrity of the case, but it would certainly allow us to further dig into or veto some of the ongoing theories.

I would really like to know at what point in their hike they saw him....was it on the bridge, or before the bridge? It could help narrow down the timeline of when he could have possibly been seen by a potential witness.

I guess I am just getting anxious for more information....

I would also like to know why they were talking about him. What made him worth talking about? I wonder if there was some mannerism they picked up on that might be helpful in narrowing down who it was.

 

[bradfordsleuth]

I would also like to know why they were talking about him. What made him worth talking about? I wonder if there was some mannerism they picked up on that might be helpful in narrowing down who it was.

In the beginning, I had thought he had either asked them for money or had exposed himself to them on the trail.

 

[MDATCA]

Unless BG is under surveillance and the police just don't have the evidence to charge him yet, I don't think anyone can know for sure that BG saw the conference. It follows that if he is a local he would know about the press conference. It then follows that he would want to know what the police know, just as DC stated during the conference. Of course, a lot of us want to know what the police know so we could possibly help better, but we're not learning much. It seems intuitive that BG would be very interested in what the police are saying that might relate to him. I would assume that much.

As much as I would like to think they know who it is and are watching him I dont think that is the case. I did at first after the PC but not after 3 weeks.
Delphi is a small town and small PD and IMO they would be noticed watching someone. Either that or by local LE means within a 50 mile radius then perhaps they may not be notice in some of the bigger towns.

 

[TL4S]

I would also like to know why they were talking about him. What made him worth talking about? I wonder if there was some mannerism they picked up on that might be helpful in narrowing down who it was.

I wonder if it's as simple as a lone guy following them, then catching up. That could creep two teen girls out.

 

[neesaki]

I just had the uncomfortable thought that realistically, if my own mother saw a grainy three second video of me wearing (possibly) two pairs of pants, an undershirt shirt, a hoodie and a jacket I'm not sure she'd recognize me. Same situation holds true for acquaintances who might pass by me if a public park, especially if I kept my head down.

ITA, have been thinking about this and think the original BG sketch (first released) could possibly have been the same as the second sketch BG, but in disguise.

What I keep thinking about is, what did someone report that needed reporting?
A car come screeching out of that parking lot?... possibly driving erratically?
A man putting a duffel bag in the trunk? Or perhaps removing a jacket, hat, hoodie, scarf?
Or maybe just the new Sketch guy getting in the car they saw at that parking lot?

Idk, the car business continues to bug me, as well as what the person saw they thought needed to be reported.

I keep hoping and praying LE knows MUCH more than we think they know, and that an arrest is not far down the road. All Jmo

 

[Tiger Stripes]

I don't think anyone can know for sure that BG saw the conference...

(quote snipped by me)
While *we* (here on WS) may not "know for sure" whether or not the suspect saw the conference, if he is under surveillance (of course, neither we, nor any "Delphians" know), then it seems that his phone would definitely be tapped. Surely no one here thinks that LE would announce that they were tapping into the suspect's various wireless connections.. do we?!

n.b. Like others here, I believe that the suspect is so full of himself (i. e., narcissistic) that yes, I do think that he was watching the conference in real-time (as I also happen to believe that he's reading many comments here -- just MOO).

 

[Jaclin]

Perhaps there is some sort of language use here? Some parts of the US people say you'all some people say, Guys sometimes, dude. I wonder if Guys is indicative of ID?

Is there a language map of the USA

right here: https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/06/06/article-0-1A2B955F000005DC-299_634x450.jpg

 

[Backstroke10]

I just had the uncomfortable thought that realistically, if my own mother saw a grainy three second video of me wearing (possibly) two pairs of pants, an undershirt shirt, a hoodie and a jacket I'm not sure she'd recognize me. Same situation holds true for acquaintances who might pass by me if a public park, especially if I kept my head down.

I agree and although the new sketch is much more detailed, the wavy/curly hair is throwing me off. I get that the witness obviously saw the guy (so what do I know) but I’m assuming a small percentage of the male population has curly hair. I just hope that curly hair isn’t preventing someone from calling in that much needed tip. MOO

 

[Cutiekitty]

From what others have said here it certainly does appear a registered SC user must add other registered users who are able to view photos shared by SC - it wouldn’t have been viewable publicly.

But as with all apps, only a user name and p/w is required so anyone having access to that information is able to sign on whether or not they’re the person who set up the app. Because I wonder how careful teenagers are about secure and hard-to-guess passwords and how common is it for them to share access to apps?

I also have no doubt LE has or is dwelling deeply into a possible internet connection which may’ve proved extremely complex. It was reported Libby was also a user of FB. I’m curious by what means did she ask her dad for a ride home? Phonecall, text, FB messaging? Or did she mention their plans to FB friends in advance of sending the SC photo? An imaginary scenario - “Abby and I are going to take photos at the bridge this afternoon”. A friend replies “oh send me some pics!”

My point - was there a reason Libby shared the pic via SC as soon (or almost as soon) as it was taken that day? Rather than intending to later post it on FB or Instagram?

In the days of home computers I think it must’ve been easier to track down stalkers to a specific physical address by setting up surveillance of all people entering and exiting the residence. However now with public wifi and mobile devices, particularly burner cellphones, it’s far more difficult to determine who’s actually at the other end of an internet connection.

YES!!! Everything you just posted was excellent! The last paragraph especially.

My kiddo shared their SC access info with a friend not even thinking anything about it. They didn’t understand why I was mad because “everybody does it”. To remedy this i changed their password and didn’t tell them the new one. They can’t access SC from anywhere but their phone and won’t even log out of snap chat now to let a friend access their account on their phone.

Don’t even get me started with fake accounts. I think LE can still figure out the user, but it wouldn’t be as easy as identifying someone with a real account. Would be really time consuming too.

With SC there would be a record of who you communicated with and who communicated with you in the cache (no content just a record like a phone bill), but all you have to do is clear it and poof it’s all gone. No message (unless it was saved by the user) because of how SC operates and no record of the conversation on the phone. That’s SC 2019 - not sure about SC 2017 (I didn’t have it then). My question is how long does SC retain transaction records. Hopefully a while. Also hope LE has something that can recover SC info that’s just snapped and sent (not saved in any way then deleted).

 

[mtnlites]

I agree giving serial killers nicknames seems to satisfy their desire for attention, infamy and they relish it. Calling him a COWARD however, isn't very flattering.

When LE calls him a "coward" then I think that's fine since it's speaking to him on a level that may encourage him to make a mistake that can "out" him. I won't be using the "CCC" moniker any time soon, though. IMO he shouldn't be identified by anything other than what he is-a man on a bridge who killed two little girls. He doesn't deserve to be associated with anything else at this time. Carroll County and their residents have suffered enough.

 

[Backstroke10]

(quote snipped by me)
While *we* (here on WS) may not "know for sure" whether or not the suspect saw the conference, if he is under surveillance (of course, neither we, nor any "Delphians" know), then it seems that his phone would definitely be tapped. Surely no one here thinks that LE would announce that they were tapping into the suspect's various wireless connections.. do we?!

n.b. Like others here, I believe that the suspect is so full of himself (i. e., narcissistic) that yes, I do think that he was watching the conference in real-time (as I also happen to believe that he's reading many comments here -- just MOO).

I think he was watching it as well. I don’t think LE knows where he’s located and where exactly he was watching it. After getting away with this for 2 years and the PC announcement days before, I think it’s a very safe assumption by LE that he was watching it. MOO

 

[Moonracer]

BG's face is in dispute, but have others noticed he has VERY thin upper legs? Stick thighs.

 

[Snoop Sister]

(quote snipped by me)
While *we* (here on WS) may not "know for sure" whether or not the suspect saw the conference, if he is under surveillance (of course, neither we, nor any "Delphians" know), then it seems that his phone would definitely be tapped. Surely no one here thinks that LE would announce that they were tapping into the suspect's various wireless connections.. do we?!

n.b. Like others here, I believe that the suspect is so full of himself (i. e., narcissistic) that yes, I do think that he was watching the conference in real-time (as I also happen to believe that he's reading many comments here -- just MOO).

I am positive he is snooping around here...willing to bet on it. To the murderer...give yourself up, do the right thing,

 

[neesaki]

BG's face is in dispute, but have others noticed he has VERY thin upper legs? Stick thighs.

I wonder about the height, still, agree he appears to have quite thin legs. Actually, body thin too, the oversized jacket is obviously very oversized.
Could he be a runner?

 

[mtnlites]

whoever did this isn't too bright. why did he not remove the phone? where was it found?

i think a big clue is hiding in the method of the murders.

He may not have known that Libby had a phone on her, she could have dropped it along the way and he didn't have time to look for it, or he could've been interrupted after he killed them and his biggest priority was to get out of there quickly.

 

[Backstroke10]

Could’ve been that for sure. I like that a lot better.

I’m not as sure of BG being LE as I was then. I heard about the case when it first happened, but didn’t follow anything till after the PC. It was just my initial gut reaction based on the PC.

Some form of LE was my initial gut feeling as well. I’m all over the place now; college student, truck driver, LE....MOO