CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #53 *ARREST*

[ab01]

I agree. He’s about as incompetent a killer as there has ever been, but he wouldn’t have kept something that implicated him like that.

At some point he would have known that law enforcement was about to come knocking, and even if he had kept teeth, he would have had time to dispose of them.

Had KK kept a tooth and placed it there, she would have said so, as it would offer more credibility to her account.

Agreed. well thought out, short and to the point.

I don’t believe she ever thought to do anything whatsoever to implicate PF until after she was caught

Based on what others who knew both kk and PF I’m more inclined to believe PF was the more abusive, and manipulative of the two. Past gfs etc have all said as much.

Kk has had various people speak up to support her

While I don’t agree about much of what has been said about her genuine and caring nature.

Most of those who have spoken up for PF have referred to him only through his work.

I never had a problem with him, he was a good farrier etc


I do give some credence to the fact that PF was the one who was shown to be the type that has no use for females other than as a tool for his own use and disposal.


Jmo

 

[gitana1]

We must agree to disagree on whether or not KK participated in the murder. Unless PF's defence attorney has some kind of "nuclear" bombshell to unload, I just can't take that leap with the evidence available to us at this point. Did she conspire? I believe absolutely. She was not an unwilling/fearful participant in this heinous crime. It was not just because PF told her lies about KB. She was jealous, pathologically so, IMHO. Of course, there could be other reasons as well? Looking forward to Friday, hoping there are NO MORE delays and we get to know if we'll be waiting around for months, possibly years, for a lengthy trial. All just MOO!

Let's face it - if the defense had such evidence that SHE was the culprit or was present, they would present it immediately to try to get bail for this character.

People kept saying the same things in the CW case - "There evidence he is innocent! Just WAIT until the defense goes up to bat!" I stated the same thing I'm saying here - such evidence would have been immediately presented to get him bail.

Of course it didn't exist.

And yes, her conduct amounts to at least an accessory after the fact, which could have gotten her 2-6 years.

(3) Being an accessory to crime is a class 4 felony if the offender knows that the person being assisted has committed, or has been convicted of, or is charged by pending information, indictment, or complaint with a crime, and if that crime is designated by this code as a class 1 or class 2 felony.
2016 Colorado Revised Statutes :: Title 18 - :: Criminal Code :: Article 8 - :: Offenses - Governmental Operations :: Part 1 - :: Obstruction of Public Justice :: § 18-8-105. Accessory to crime

Class 4 felonies are punishable by two to six years’ imprisonment and a fine of $2,000 to $500,000. (Colo. Rev. Stat. § 18-1.3-401.)
https://sca.district70.org/ourpages...Misdemeanor Crimes by Class and Sentences.pdf

I also think there's some evidence that she was a conspirator too, as we know she agreed to help or actually murder KB previously. However, that evidence may not be enough to charge her as they have to have actual evidence that she helped plan THIS murder. Not just past ones. And they may not have anything that shows she did more than agree to the murder, or know about it, and helped clean up after.

If there had been enough evidence and she was not necessary to pinning PF for the actual murder, the possible penalty is 8-24 years:
Colorado Criminal "Conspiracy" Laws | 18-2-201 CRS
Class 2 Felony Crimes in Colorado - Definition & Penalties

 

[ab01]

What we still don't know is whether the monster wanted to spend the rest of his life with her.

Yah and that says more about him than her. I don’t think he has much worth for any woman imo.

I do believe kk wanted to try to protect PF at least initially

It would have been much more reasonable to implicate kk if she pointed her finger at anyone other than pf

Jmo

 

[gitana1]

What we still don't know is whether the monster wanted to spend the rest of his life with her.

I guarantee you he didn't!!! She was desperate and he knew it and capitalized on it.

 

[MyBelle]

I guarantee you he didn't!!! She was desperate and he knew it and capitalized on it.

Which is why I think it is possible KK planted the tooth at the ranch. If PF rejected her, she wants him to pay dearly.

JMO

 

[Ultra Violet]

Ugh. Just thinking about the sweet deal given to KK infuriates me so #&@%ing much, and I don’t know any of the parties involved.

But, this deal with the devil was a necessary evil and will help justice prevail in the end. And help the Berreth family and all those affected by this senseless crime heal and move forward.

So, for those reasons, I can feel more at peace about this situation.

Just think about how unfair and infuriating her deal must feel to PF. Ouch.

jmo

 

[Love Never Fails]

Has anyone considered that the defense may ask for a continuance BEFORE there is a plea? I have no idea. I’m just saying maybe there is evidence that hasn’t been tested, etc.

And if so, do any of you believe the DA would agree to a continuance? Have my of you that follow a lot of trials ever seen this happen?

 

[MyBelle]

Ugh. Just thinking about the sweet deal given to KK infuriates me so #&@%ing much, and I don’t know any of the parties involved.

But, this deal with the devil was a necessary evil and will help justice prevail in the end. And help the Berreth family and all those affected by this senseless crime heal and move forward.

So, for those reasons, I can feel more at peace about this situation.

Just think about how unfair and infuriating her deal must feel to PF. Ouch.

jmo

Remember, that sweet deal can disappear if the DA finds evidence KK lied about what she said to LE after the deal was signed. Where did she tell LE she placed the tooth? If she said any place other than where they found it, she lied to them.

JMO

 

[MassGuy]

Ugh. Just thinking about the sweet deal given to KK infuriates me so #&@%ing much, and I don’t know any of the parties involved.

But, this deal with the devil was a necessary evil and will help justice prevail in the end. And help the Berreth family and all those affected by this senseless crime heal and move forward.

So, for those reasons, I can feel more at peace about this situation.

Just think about how unfair and infuriating her deal must feel to PF. Ouch.

jmo

Yeah, I think most of us feel the same way.

The deal is tough to stomach, but it’s absolutely necessary.

She contributed a lot, and will contribute a lot. It’s unfortunate that she was holding all the cards, but that’s the reality.

Recently, the Murder of Jerry Williams has been in the news.

In 2000, he went missing while on a hunting trip. Some believed that he had drowned and had been eaten by alligators.

Ultimately, Brian Winchester, the man who murdered him, threw Jerry’s wife Denise under the bus, saying that she had asked him to murder Jerry in order to collect insurance money.

Winchester led law enforcement to Jerry’s body, and was granted immunity for his testimony.

He will serve no prison time for the murder, but was sentenced to 20 years for the kidnapping of his estranged wife, and accomplice (she testified against him in his kidnapping trial, so he decided to get even).

Thanks to the testimony of a cold blooded murderer, Denise Williams will spend the rest of her life behind bars.

This example shows two things:

Juries can believe criminals.

Sometimes a deal with the devil is worth it.

 

[Love Never Fails]

We must agree to disagree on whether or not KK participated in the murder. Unless PF's defence attorney has some kind of "nuclear" bombshell to unload, I just can't take that leap with the evidence available to us at this point. Did she conspire? I believe absolutely. She was not an unwilling/fearful participant in this heinous crime. It was not just because PF told her lies about KB. She was jealous, pathologically so, IMHO. Of course, there could be other reasons as well? Looking forward to Friday, hoping there are NO MORE delays and we get to know if we'll be waiting around for months, possibly years, for a lengthy trial. All just MOO!

And it’s okay to disagree.

I don’t not look for any bombshells.

As far as her being fearful, I don’t buy that at all. This is one strange woman. Jealous, selfish, pathetic...I could go on but you get it.

I think I remember she said PF threatened her or her daughter? Was she afraid? Did she go to LE and turn him in or ask for protection? I mean, she has a large family that she could have turned to.

Nah, I believe she wanted him to kill KB or make her disappear. And if he wasn’t going to get it done, then...

Anyway, I look forward to seeing if anything transpires Friday and if we get a trial date.

 

[GordianKnot]

Has anyone considered that the defense may ask for a continuance BEFORE there is a plea? I have no idea. I’m just saying maybe there is evidence that hasn’t been tested, etc.

And if so, do any of you believe the DA would agree to a continuance? Have my of you that follow a lot of trials ever seen this happen?

We've already seen it happen once in this case:
Patrick Frazee arraignment pushed to later date because of evidence testing

SFA:
The defense asked for a continuance because of evidence that is continuing to be tested. The new arraignment date is set for May 24 at 8:30 a.m.

PF's original arraignment hearing was scheduled for 04/05/19.
It was rescheduled to this Friday, 05/24/19 at the defense's request.

It's entirely possible that the defense could request another continuance.
We'll find out soon enough.

JMO.

 

[Love Never Fails]

We've already seen it happen once in this case:
Patrick Frazee arraignment pushed to later date because of evidence testing

SFA:
The defense asked for a continuance because of evidence that is continuing to be tested. The new arraignment date is set for May 24 at 8:30 a.m.

PF's original arraignment hearing was scheduled for 04/05/19.
It was rescheduled to this Friday, 05/24/19 at the defense's request.

It's entirely possible that the defense could request another continuance.
We'll find out soon enough.

JMO.

Yeah, that’s what I remembered. If defense did request it, what reason would the DA have to accept it? Isn’t it risky to not go to trial if he has the evidence to prove his case?

Waiting for another date for an arraignment and plea is distressing.

 

[MemPat]

Yeah, I think most of us feel the same way.

The deal is tough to stomach, but it’s absolutely necessary.

She contributed a lot, and will contribute a lot. It’s unfortunate that she was holding all the cards, but that’s the reality.

Recently, the Murder of Jerry Williams has been in the news.

In 2000, he went missing while on a hunting trip. Some believed that he had drowned and had been eaten by alligators.

Ultimately, Brian Winchester, the man who murdered him, threw Jerry’s wife Denise under the bus, saying that she had asked him to murder Jerry in order to collect insurance money.

Winchester led law enforcement to Jerry’s body, and was granted immunity for his testimony.

He will serve no prison time for the murder, but was sentenced to 20 years for the kidnapping of his estranged wife, and accomplice (she testified against him in his kidnapping trial, so he decided to get even).

Thanks to the testimony of a cold blooded murderer, Denise Williams will spend the rest of her life behind bars.

This example shows two things:

Juries can believe criminals.

Sometimes a deal with the devil is worth it.

That deal was so satisfying.

As for this one, we can't forget the need to get PF behind bars quickly to assure Kelsey's mom would get custody of the baby.

That was worth it all for me even if KK doesn't serve a day.

 

[ilovechili]

I think we could all pretty much agree with you on all counts.

I’m just not persuaded that she didn’t do this herself. That may go against the grain here.

If PF committed the crime alone, it would be a fine day if he stood up and said so and took the sentence the judge hands down.

But in real life, they are both cowards. He will fight.

And she will go on with her life. She has lots of family in CO. She can reinvent herself. Not everyone knows about this crime or are they interested in her life. She is one fine specimen let me say. She either planned this crime or conspired to help PF commit the crime, no thought given to her children and their future. No thought given to her family’s reputation. Just jealousy and selfishness. And she has gotten away with whatever she did with a slap on the wrist, so to speak.

I am hoping that through the trial we will get to know KB better. KB has been lost here. Who was she? What were her dreams? We aren’t one hundred percent sure what happened to her. There is no body.

We pray for good evidence. But what we DO have is the word of a liar, a cheat, a conspirator and maybe the killer.

BBM, this may be one of my most loved sentences ever. I will think of her from hereon out as a fine specimen, lol, something that should be examined as any fine specimen should, to learn things. So should he imo.

KB will never realize her dreams, I so agree. Thanks to these two at minimum. However, they will not realize whatever their twisted fantasies were either, together or individually. I think there is a real "kink" or two in their future dreams at the moment. Forgive me if I take a bit of sick delight in that thought.

We may agree or disagree but he is where he belongs, she is running around free as a bird and belongs in custody as well and that bothers many. She will mess up eventually though. It is in her nature?

jmo of course.

 

[ilovechili]

Let's face it - if the defense had such evidence that SHE was the culprit or was present, they would present it immediately to try to get bail for this character.

People kept saying the same things in the CW case - "There evidence he is innocent! Just WAIT until the defense goes up to bat!" I stated the same thing I'm saying here - such evidence would have been immediately presented to get him bail.

Of course it didn't exist.

And yes, her conduct amounts to at least an accessory after the fact, which could have gotten her 2-6 years.

(3) Being an accessory to crime is a class 4 felony if the offender knows that the person being assisted has committed, or has been convicted of, or is charged by pending information, indictment, or complaint with a crime, and if that crime is designated by this code as a class 1 or class 2 felony.
2016 Colorado Revised Statutes :: Title 18 - :: Criminal Code :: Article 8 - :: Offenses - Governmental Operations :: Part 1 - :: Obstruction of Public Justice :: § 18-8-105. Accessory to crime

Class 4 felonies are punishable by two to six years’ imprisonment and a fine of $2,000 to $500,000. (Colo. Rev. Stat. § 18-1.3-401.)
https://sca.district70.org/ourpages/auto/2016/1/11/54933902/Colorado Felony and Misdemeanor Crimes by Class and Sentences.pdf

I also think there's some evidence that she was a conspirator too, as we know she agreed to help or actually murder KB previously. However, that evidence may not be enough to charge her as they have to have actual evidence that she helped plan THIS murder. Not just past ones. And they may not have anything that shows she did more than agree to the murder, or know about it, and helped clean up after.

If there had been enough evidence and she was not necessary to pinning PF for the actual murder, the possible penalty is 8-24 years:
Colorado Criminal "Conspiracy" Laws | 18-2-201 CRS
Class 2 Felony Crimes in Colorado - Definition & Penalties

Am I wrong that I see more than one charge possible for her just in her own admissions? No expert but there are repeated crimes of tampering, obstruction or whatever no?

I truly would like to know, is it all just one event? She admits to stalking at minimum and going to her house, taking coffee, a bat, etc. She covers up at minimum by cleaning. She disposes of evidence just at the condo cleaning. Then she attends an alleged burning of the body. To back up, after getting the body with him at Nash. Then she disposes of at minimum keys, KB's phone, gun to friend, etc. Different days, different events, by her own admission over months at minimum? I am sure more could be brought up here of what she admits to herself...

Or is this all considered one crime only by her by law?

I tried for brevity

 

[susiQ]

What we still don't know is whether the monster wanted to spend the rest of his life with her.

OH MyBelle! I'm certain he DID NOT!

 

[GordianKnot]

OH MyBelle! I'm certain he DID NOT!

Course not!
The only woman PF dreamt of spending the rest of his life with is Ma F.

Clearly, PF had absolutely no interest in pursuing a happily-never-after ending with KK.
KK was merely a side piece to him, who also served as a cleaning lady when the need arose.

PF wasn't married to KB.
There was nothing to keep him from being with KK if he so desired.
He was a free man, in that respect.

Now's another story, of course.
His days of being a free man are over.

Turns out, PF won't be enjoying his fairy tale ending, i.e., a life of domestic bliss with Ma F. at the ranch.

<modsnip>

JMO.

 

[MassGuy]

Has anyone considered that the defense may ask for a continuance BEFORE there is a plea? I have no idea. I’m just saying maybe there is evidence that hasn’t been tested, etc.

And if so, do any of you believe the DA would agree to a continuance? Have my of you that follow a lot of trials ever seen this happen?

If this was Massachusetts, there would be continuance after continuance, and delay after delay.

I’ve seen cases take several years to go to trial.

A case like this would probably take 3 years.

No matter what happens here, this is going to be speedy in comparison.

I fully expect a not guilty plea, as PF can always plead guilty at a later date (not that I expect that).

There’s no rush.

 

[Dave F.]

If PF is convicted, the terms of imprisonment are well established. He will be transported to the Denver Reception and Diagnostic Center – DRDC, 10900 Smith Road, Denver, CO 80239, as all prisoners are for initial orientation and evaluation prior to permanent placement. Inmates convicted of Murder in the First Degree are generally assigned to the Colorado State Penitentiary – CSP, East US Hwy 50 at Evans Blvd, Canon City CO 81215. With his life experience in horse training, no prior criminal record, and lengthy history of volunteering in the Colorado Prison Rodeo program; there is an excellent chance he will be offered a position in the Wild Horse Inmate Program – WHIP which is headquartered conveniently at the Canon City Penitentiary. He will be 55.4 miles from home, so scheduled visits by any members of his family should not be a hardship.
CCi - Wild Horse Inmate Program

 

[MassGuy]

If PF is convicted, the terms of imprisonment are well established. He will be transported to the Denver Reception and Diagnostic Center – DRDC, 10900 Smith Road, Denver, CO 80239, as all prisoners are for initial orientation and evaluation prior to permanent placement. Inmates convicted of Murder in the First Degree are generally assigned to the Colorado State Penitentiary – CSP, East US Hwy 50 at Evans Blvd, Canon City CO 81215. With his life experience in horse training, no prior criminal record, and lengthy history of volunteering in the Colorado Prison Rodeo program; there is an excellent chance he will be offered a position in the Wild Horse Inmate Program – WHIP which is headquartered conveniently at the Canon City Penitentiary. He will be 55.4 miles from home, so scheduled visits by any members of his family should not be a hardship.
CCi - Wild Horse Inmate Program

This animal should not be allowed near other animals, unless they are of the human variety.

I can’t believe that Colorado allows convicted killers serving life sentences at maximum security facilities, to be anywhere near horses.

The lack of a prior criminal record, is dwarfed by the monstrosity of his actions.

He could have been a Boy Scout or choir boy for all I care. First degree murder is first degree murder, and prior good behavior is wholly irrelevant.

The last thing he deserves is another horse to abuse.