CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #19

[mrjitty]

It's not the identity of the truck which proves his guilt. If it is his truck it adds to the evidence, the reverse is not true.

What puts him there is the cheque and the knowledge of it the next day. He didn't need to wear gloves to hide his fingerprints - he left his calling card - he thought he could erase the ledger later but couldn't.

Given that Joey was going to discover the theft and that the cheque was deleted and hidden from Joey, it doesn't take a genius IMO to work out that the murders were premeditated and he may or may not have decided to use his own or any vehicle in his plan.

Evidence pointing to premeditation, in my opinion -

1. Being in the vicinity of the house on the 31st, 2nd and 3rd. Phone also dark on the 4th before 9.36 am, traveling northbound on the i15.
2. The 76 missing cheques taken from underneath the cheques in Joey's box, running on from serial numbers Merritt printed.
3. Custom account activity starting on the 1st and practice cheques.
4. Cheque drawn on the 2nd to set up a template for new normal course of business while Joey is not missing, but knowing Joey will discover it.
5. Opening a bank account on the 3rd, because he knew the days of receiving cheques he could cash were over.
6. Phone dark after his last call with Joey at 5.48 pm.

All MOO

I 100% agree with this.

It's the centre of the case. If the defence cannot explain the deleted backdated PM cheque on the 5th, everything falls apart for them, because it proves Chase already knew Joey was dead.

As you say, the problem was he couldn't delete the activity log in QB.

He needed all the cheques to be created before the 5th, to fit with the story he told Dugal. Backdated to the 5th wasn't good enough.

It's that greed that sinks him.

And ironically if he hadn't backdated the cheques - the case against him would be far weaker.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Imo, none of us really know why all of the jurors wanted to see CMs truck.

It very well could be for the same reason the S. Peterson jury wanted to see his fishing boat.

As they were standing there looking at CMs truck it is very reasonable, and totally logical they were sizing the truck up to see if it was the death transport vehicle which transported the 4 dead victims to the desert.

Those images were in these jurors mind just like it was with the SP jury when they looked at the boat that transported Laci, and Connor's dead bodies to the bay. Imo.

Imo, we sometime assume juries want to see certain pieces of evidence for ONE particular reason only. Then it comes out after the verdict they had other reasons for doing so.

As far as the dueling experts jurors usually do not base their verdict by relying on experts. If there are opposite opinions, which always happens, then the jury doesn't really have anything reliable one way or the other so it becomes garbage in..garbage out. Imo.

Whatever Rudin says is not going to save CM. Imo.

Imo, What they will determine their verdict on are CMs statements throughout. His whereabouts. CMs illegal activity during the times in question, and the evidence showing he was inside of the home on the 4th. CM calling trying to shut Joey's QB account down pretending to be Joey McStay. JM had not been heard from since the 4th, and was never heard from again. The jury now knows WHY they all went silent on the 4th. CM having no verifiable alibi during all of the times in question. He cant even come up with any documentation like was presented concerning DKs whereabouts, and DK is not even the one on trial.

The alternative accounting made up out of thin air will be insulting to the jury's intelligence based on all the other evidence that has presented to them.

That unfounded assumption is totally illogical, and an unreasonable conclusion without merit based on the unethical illegal practices of Merritt. That's as ridiculous as a banker giving a bank robber a key to the bank, and code to the bank vault then telling the robber but don't rob our bank.

So I think the state has the important evidence on their side, and the verdict will be unanimous.

That is if the jury ever gets to weigh all of the evidence sometime this year.

JMO

 

[Tortoise]

It was quite odd listening to yesterday's testimony. McGee was at some points quite hostile towards Rudin I thought. I've heard of a hostile witness before but not really hostile counsel towards a witness who is testifying for them. I suppose it might have to do with not accepting parts of his work and treating him more as an independent witness for the court rather than a defence witness.

JMO

 

[oceanblueeyes]

@Tortoise

I found your post and it was a reply to me lol! I must have missed it



This is a very interesting idea!



Agreed - the dog stuff combined with the lack of calls is odd. e.g if you were about to drive all the way over to Fallbrook - wouldn't you call first? Seems obvious. And surely you would call Summer?



Agreed. He clearly was trying to engineer someone else to do it.



This is key IMO. It just makes no sense at all. So he tailored it for DuGal.

But then in the interrogation, he knew he had to stick to what the phone records said. So then he also became the dog feeding guy.



IMO the lack of inquiries with the neighbours is also odd - surely as a first step? When this all goes down it is only the 9th. Yet already Joey's mum? Even when he hasn't been over there.

And in the Dugal version, he indicates he is there again on the 12th which is when he tells Mikey and Susan someone is feeding the dogs.

i.e. he was establishing the disappearance, but making it seem unnecessary to involve the police.

He was manipulating Mikey and Susan right from the start.

He choose them as the ones who would be at the centre of the "disappearance"

All of it comes back to one reasonable conclusion. Only one! Imo

CM was the only one who knew they had disappeared on the 4th never to be returning! All of his actions, statements to family members/ business contacts, staging efforts, and stalling alerting others shows this to be true!

Only CM knew this, and the only way he would know this is HE knew HE was the one who had eradicated all four by murdering each one.

His own illegal actions before, on the very 4th and afterwards shows this to be true.

Imo, the DT has failed to successfully address the most important evidence against CM.

It's easy to understand why they have sidestepped the most damaging evidence against CM. Imo, they simply can't do so. So instead they put up smoke, and mirrors meant to distract.

In the end of the defense case CM still has no iron clad alibi. None. They have not successfully addressed why CM was the only one inside of the McStay home on the very day they were murdered.

They failed to even put DK in Fallbrook much less at the murder scene.

But the state has entered powerful of evidence showing WHO was there, and have shown what the defendant was illegally doing once he had removed all obstacles standing in his way to a dead man's money.

His own actions/manipulation words scream Guilt. Imo.

That is why I continue to SMH about some believing this case is complex. .This is NOT a complex case for the jury to figure out. It's all there plain as day who did these murders, and why CM did so.

Jmoo!

 

[Tortoise]

NO, it wouldn't likely be from trace DNA from an alleged handshake. Why would trace DNA from an alleged handshake days earlier still be there on the steering wheel , AFTER someone else drove that car an hour or more away from the home?

And Chase's DNA was more prevalent than Summers was. That says to me that he drove it recently.


As for the QBooks--YES, it is fact, and CM even admitted it. So there is no question that it was him. He tried to say that Joey told him to make that call. But there is zero evidence to support that, and a few things that make it unlikely.

I'd say it is highly probable that CM was in the house on the 4th because who else would write a check out in chase merritt's name then delete it, and create another one and cash it, the next day? Chase cashed that check. So who other than him created it?

Also, Chase lied to detectives about those checks, and told them Joey gave him the checks at lunch on the 4tth. But that was a lie.

He has no alibi for the night of 4th, other the the one he tried to fake, by getting CJ to lie for him. And the cell phone evidence showed that she tried to call him in a flurry of calls, that went unanswered.

The neighbours video footage shows a work truck very much like CM's, leaving the home that night. And in his own words ---Chase was absolutely the last person Joey saw that day.

Very nice. Add in his cell phone in the desert, evidence Joey's signature was forged on cheques from the 2nd, changing his calling and visiting patterns, and deceiving the family, and tie it up with a bow.

 

[MsFacetious]

It was quite odd listening to yesterday's testimony. McGee was at some points quite hostile towards Rudin I thought. I've heard of a hostile witness before but not really hostile counsel towards a witness who is testifying for them. I suppose it might have to do with not accepting parts of his work and treating him more as an independent witness for the court rather than a defence witness.

JMO

They are human too. Sometimes they are just hostile because they are hostile. Don't like the guy. Don't feel good. Got in a fight with the wife that day. Whatever. Lawyers are human.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

If the jury even weighs opposing image experts they will combine it with what has already been presented to them.

The state has placed CM inside of the McStay home on the 4th the date of the murders.

So is it a reasonable conclusion to believe... knowing CM was inside their home on the 4th, the day of the murders .. that the truck seen leaving their home on the same date as seen on the camera footage belonged to CM?

Imo, the reasonable conclusion is YES! Especially with the jury knowing all 4 bodies were removed from their home omitting the possibility CM came, and left on foot.

Imo

 

[Tortoise]

They are human too. Sometimes they are just hostile because they are hostile. Don't like the guy. Don't feel good. Got in a fight with the wife that day. Whatever. Lawyers are human.

I don't know if that's the case here, did you listen to it? At times he's laughing and then at others he's hostile/aggressive with his questions. It seemed to be tactical rather than just because he's human.

JMO

 

[MsFacetious]

I don't know if that's the case here, did you listen to it? At times he's laughing and then at others he's hostile/aggressive with his questions. It seemed to be tactical rather than just because he's human.

JMO

No, I didn't listen to it. You are probably right, just wanted to point that out because until recently I really hadn't given it a lot of thought.

In the last trial I did the prosecutor was a pompous as$. He got under everyone's skin like you would not believe. There were a couple of times when that definitely came out on the witness stand or in interactions between attorneys. A couple of witnesses were so bothered by him the other prosecutor just questioned them instead.

So maybe it was just a tactic or maybe he just doesn't like him. Or maybe his illness is psychological. Who knows. I just hope it's over soon!

 

[Meemaw12]

Don’t forget:

Chase Merritt said he was the last person to see Joey.

Doesn’t get any clearer than that.

Let the excuses begin!!!

IMO JMO MOO

 

[smr]

Yes there absolutely is. It's just some choose to conveniently look past it with a "Wait, look over here with DK...."

And some are afraid of DK being looked at.

 

[Tortoise]

No, I didn't listen to it. You are probably right, just wanted to point that out because until recently I really hadn't given it a lot of thought.

In the last trial I did the prosecutor was a pompous as$. He got under everyone's skin like you would not believe. There were a couple of times when that definitely came out on the witness stand or in interactions between attorneys. A couple of witnesses were so bothered by him the other prosecutor just questioned them instead.

So maybe it was just a tactic or maybe he just doesn't like him. Or maybe his illness is psychological. Who knows. I just hope it's over soon!

Then again it could just be me though. I like Dr Rudin and the impression I get is he's an impartial witness.

Actually I liked Stutchman too.

 

[Force Ten]

And some are afraid of DK being looked at.

This premise is laughable.

 

[smr]

This premise is laughable.

It's not a premise. It's a conclusion.

 

[Karinna]

And some are afraid of DK being looked at.

Like whom? Why would anyone be afraid of that when he was investigated by LE and co operated with the investigation?

 

[Longtimenoc]

What gets me is he nor CJ had any recollection what so ever of their memories and activities of the night of the disappearance when asked a little more than a week later. Meritt simply claimed to not remembering a thing, CJs story kept evolving.

This is impossible, of course a person would reflect on their activities on the night of such importance! Every minute of such a day would be detailed in a persons mind and then offered to those searching for the missing family.

Merritt was so convinced that he had gotten away with it and thus so confident during his interviw that he felt it wasn't necessary to offer an explanation. With the bodies safely hidden and after his masterful job of throwing everyone of track he felt completely safe. He had no need to even construct a story since he felt San Diego LE believed him and would probably never get questioned again.

I hope the prosecution drives this home in closing arguments.

 

[Force Ten]

If I am a juror, and I'm keeping it real, I'll be paying close attention to the concrete evidence in the case. The jurors already requested to see the actual truck. Rudin did the original data on the Mitchley video, but the Prosecution decided against using him because they didn't like his conclusion. As a juror I would be wondering what other assertions the PT has made that might be questionable. Judge Smith reinforced that when the PT kept objecting and he acknowledged it was obvious why. It would really make me angry to discover there was exculpatory evidence that was being concealed by the State in a death penalty case. jmo imo moo

BBM. Did they though? We don't know the real reasons he was discarded, but a lot assumptions have been made.

 

[Karinna]

BBM. Did they though? We don't know the real reasons he was discarded, but a lot assumptions have been made.

I thought it was because they wanted a Faro expert?
(quote)
Laser scanner for fast and exact indoor and outdoor measurements in three dimensions: Simply at your fingertips
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[Force Ten]

What gets me is he nor CJ had any recollection what so ever of their memories and activities of the night of the disappearance when asked a little more than a week later. Meritt simply claimed to not remembering a thing, CJs story kept evolving.

This is impossible, of course a person would reflect on their activities on the night of such importance! Every minute of such a day would be detailed in a persons mind and then offered to those searching for the missing family.

Merritt was so convinced that he had gotten away with it and thus so confident during his interviw that he felt it wasn't necessary to offer an explanation. With the bodies safely hidden and after his masterful job of throwing everyone of track he felt completely safe. He had no need to even construct a story since he felt San Diego LE believed him and would probably never get questioned again.

I hope the prosecution drives this home in closing arguments.

Yes, remembered about arguing the whole weekend about why or why not Chase didn't pick up the call, yet nothing about why CJ was trying to get a hold of CM the night of the 4th. Anyone recall where she said she was if not with Merritt?

 

[wary]

And some are afraid of DK being looked at.

In my opinion, you’re right. The defense IS afraid of DK being looked at—hence, their pathetic story of ‘we really really wanted to call him to the stand, but we just couldn’t FIND him!’ And his girlfriend, who they just sort-of forgot about. If I remember rightly, they didn’t even try to say that they couldn’t find her.