Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #104

[rosesfromangels]

Not sure. Maybe? I have one. I don't know that they appeal to certain age groups as they do to certain subcultures.

Okay. Let’s go with that. Snowboarders, motocross, ?

 

[Deleted member 102539]

MOO I think it is easier to ask strangers if they've seen 2 girls than to give specifics unless they said they did see 2 girls.

I don't think, DG had to ask for "his daughter and friend", but for 2 girls (instead saying "couple").
But his wording was probably "couple" and it isn't to change anyway.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

ISP superintendent provides update on Delphi double murder investigation

In this interview the only thing that stands out as being of any import, to me at least, is what DC says around the 2 min. mark:

"Overtime we're going to have an idea that we were on to something early on, remember this isn't a 43 min. T.V. show."

I would surely like to know what it is/was that they "were on to" early on. Obviously they got derailed early in the investigation. Why did they abandon what they were "onto" early on? Why did they abandon the very first sketch that was made? Who was involved in that decision? Who gave an alibi that steered them away from a suspect?

They have lost precious time and I can only hope that new tips have come in since the April 22nd PC to corroborate what they sensed was important early on and can now follow through on that information and find who did this, because if they don't I suspect he will do it again. JMO

I imagine it’s pretty common for investigations to get derailed for one reason or another. What’s hard to imagine is staying derailed for two solid years.
I fear some very major mistakes were made early on, and exacerbated by some very poor decisions the last two years. I hope none of them have sunk the investigation.

 

[Cutiekitty]

Hi Watch9 and all,

I just double checked my notes. I am paraphrasing so please keep that in mind.

YouTube video of Grey Hughes using Skype to answer questions from a call in audience addressed to the Patty’s.

Did Derick know the couple under the bridge?
In the video this is a Skype question addressed to to BP:
At that time after the gentleman told him only a man and woman were under the bridge and no one else were there. Derrick decided to turn around and go the opposite way on the trail. LE were told about the couple BP does not know if the couple came forward.Derrick never saw the couple.

Again this is BP speaking,Derrick did walk down to the Freedom Bridge and walked back. He passed that older gentleman again and – so he went back to the car and he was, like I said, he was walking, and by this time it was about 4 o’clock.

This is BP speaking,I can say when I got there were a few kids that I knew that went to school with Libby and they were under bridge.
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[/MEDIA]

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Do you know where the answer about the couple occurred? Got through about 20 minutes and had to turn it off.

 

[mtnlites]

Okay. Let’s go with that. Snowboarders, motocross, ?

Motorcyclists, those who enjoy heavy metal or hard rock, goths, non goths who just enjoy some parts of the sub's clothing, race car drivers, members of the counterculture, those who are into certain aspects of military wear, etc.

In pop culture they're associated with crime (robberies, cartels, other criminals) and they definitely stand out. If you don't mind the attention and you don't care if people are looking at you and treating you like you're getting ready to hold up a bank then you're probably okay. It's not something you'd want to wear to blend in, though. People notice.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Here are 2 links stating the CPS building was demolished. That suggests to me it was a planned event to eliminate the building. I'm still looking but I can find nothing reported about a fire.
ETA: Lots of news reports of fires in and around the area of Delphi but still nothing about the CPS building catching on fire.

Spike in tips about 2 Delphi girls who were killed in 2017
Indiana State Police releases clarification points on Delphi murder suspect

Apropos "fire": I remember, a fire happened on the day of 13th in Delphi/near Delphi, but I don't know, where exactly and what building. Even saw a pic in some newspaper in 2017. Anyone, who hasn't forgotten the location?

 

[mtnlites]

Apropos "fire": I remember, a fire happened on the day of 13th in Delphi/near Delphi, but I don't know, where exactly and what building. Even saw a pic in some newspaper in 2017. Anyone, who hasn't forgotten the location?

Not sure where the fire was that you're referencing but the CPS building didn't get razed until 2018.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

A "spare tire."

A white thing, unknown to the whole world.

 

[Angelcat13]

Really confusing about vehicle...did they just learn there was one parked there...or have they known for 2+ years, and just not mentioned it until now? And if new info, how reliable would it be?

IMO they have known all along but they were misled to believe it wasn't connected. Now they just have to prove who was driving it AND that they are the killer.

Fingers crossed and counting the days.

 

[thesensitivechild]

The property and parking are very close to the new highway and is probably why it had to be abandoned by the state. I believe it burnt down then it was demolished but that is just my recollection so MOO on that.

Another place that burned down? Sheesh

 

[PaulaDC]

Motorcyclists, those who enjoy heavy metal or hard rock, goths, non goths who just enjoy some parts of the sub's clothing, race car drivers, members of the counterculture, those who are into certain aspects of military wear, etc.

In pop culture they're associated with crime (robberies, cartels, other criminals) and they definitely stand out. If you don't mind the attention and you don't care if people are looking at you and treating you like you're getting ready to hold up a bank then you're probably okay. It's not something you'd want to wear to blend in, though. People notice.

They also hawk them to fishermen.

 

[Charlot123]

I think maybe I didn't make myself clear. I meant if someone already had a suspicion of someone (who was discouraging testing), they might need to rethink things. That could be another piece of their own personal puzzle they've been struggling to solve.

I don't think it's anything that should be posted or speculated on here. Just another push in the right direction for someone possibly in denial of what they might know to share with authorities. Not that everyone who happens to discourage testing be reported.

The recent solving of crimes via familial DNA is encouraging and I think should be considered. Someone has to help separate those to be looked at closer. (The way I understand it and my knowledge is limited)

I, like you won't do DNA testing either and have nothing to hide.

MOO JMO IMHOO

There are different case scenarios.

1) Let us say, my DNA is in Gedmatch, and I have a tree. Now, Gedmatch has the options to opt-in or out of one’s DNA being compared in police investigations.

If, say, in a discussion whether to opt-in or out, in a genealogy community, I say, I am against it because of this and this, it should not be viewed as suspicious. People have opinions.

2) I say nothing in such a discussion. But instead, I suddenly call my relative who lives nearby, is deeply into genealogy and has a tree. And ask her specifically not to check opt-in for her own DNA in Gedmatch.

This could look suspicious to her.

The same with Indiana - if someone living in/around Delphi area starts asking relatives to opt-out of Gedmatch, it would be unusual. If they opt-out for own DNA, it should be OK. MOO.

 

[mtnlites]

There are different case scenarios.

1) Let us say, my DNA is in Gedmatch, and I have a tree. Now, Gedmatch has the options to opt-in or out of one’s DNA being compared in police investigations.

If, say, in a discussion whether to opt-in or out, in a genealogy community, I say, I am against it because of this and this, it should not be viewed as suspicious. People have opinions.

2) I say nothing in such a discussion. But instead, I suddenly call my relative who lives nearby, is deeply into genealogy and has a tree. And ask her specifically not to check opt-in for her own DNA in Gedmatch.

This could look suspicious to her.

The same with Indiana - if someone living in/around Delphi area starts asking relatives to opt-out of Gedmatch, it would be unusual. If they opt-out for own DNA, it should be OK. MOO.

Yes! Context is everything in this. There are subtle differences. Opting out myself is one thing; it's my choice, after all, and if I don't feel comfortable then I don't feel comfortable. Trying to talk my people out of doing it is something else entirely.

 

[travelbug]

ISP superintendent provides update on Delphi double murder investigation

In this interview the only thing that stands out as being of any import, to me at least, is what DC says around the 2 min. mark:

"Overtime we're going to have an idea that we were on to something early on, remember this isn't a 43 min. T.V. show."

I would surely like to know what it is/was that they "were on to" early on. Obviously they got derailed early in the investigation. Why did they abandon what they were "onto" early on? Why did they abandon the very first sketch that was made? Who was involved in that decision? Who gave an alibi that steered them away from a suspect?

They have lost precious time and I can only hope that new tips have come in since the April 22nd PC to corroborate what they sensed was important early on and can now follow through on that information and find who did this, because if they don't I suspect he will do it again. JMO

My concern is whether someone who was trusted, or in an authority position, destroyed or compromised critical evidence. <modsnip - rumor> jmo

 

[Yvettea]

My concern is whether someone who was trusted, or in an authority position, destroyed or compromised critical evidence. It was said that one of the searchers touched a body, therefore contaminating some part of it. What if that was not by accident, but intentionally. jmo

If a searcher got close enough to touch a body they contaminated the scene. IMO

 

[travelbug]

Whenever a case breaks, I always go back to the earliest discussions to see how "right" people were with their speculations. Oftentimes the longer a case goes on without being solved, the crazier the theories get. In the beginning, though, when we're still at kind of a blank slate-before we get a ton of details that may or may not be relevant-there may not be as many dots but they're often easier to connect. At the very beginning of Mollie Tibbets case, for instance, many of us were saying that she was probably followed or stalked and that she'd most likely been assaulted and killed. Many suspected it was by someone she didn't know. There was also talk of a certain vehicle in those early discussions on various platforms. That talk was shut down pretty quickly, but it would up being true.

So what did LE miss early on in this one? I have to think that they had an idea in the beginning and, for whatever reason, the theory didn't pan out. Someone lied about an alibi, intentionally caused chaos to mislead LE, or even unintentionally provided information that wasn't relevant and sent LE on a different trail. I'd love to see what their early theories were and why they didn't come to fruition.

That is one of the reasons I've always been troubled by the comment regarding the cellphone "pinging all over town". Was that an intentional statement to mislead LE and the search groups?

 

[travelbug]

There are other ways to silence potential witnesses. You can "buy" their compliance with drugs, alcohol, etc. If they are addicted their thinking is already compromised and if their supplier threatens to stop providing, or they know turning them in will stop their pipeline, most (particularly meth users) will do anything it takes to stay high. jmho

 

[mtnlites]

That is one of the reasons I've always been troubled by the comment regarding the cellphone "pinging all over town". Was that an intentionally statement to mislead LE and the search groups?

MP made that statement. He certainly didn't want to impede the investigation. Not intentionally anyway. The pinging was explained a couple of days ago, and we've talked a lot about it in the past, but has it been clarified where he got that information from? We know WHY the phone was probably pinging from different towers, there's a simple and innocent enough explanation for it, but who told him this in the first place? We've seen some of the things explained in interviews that the Patty's did with GH, and this was something that was referenced. I assumed he got the info from the phone company since BP talked about calling the phone company and trying to get them to help on the night of the 13th, and then MP went to the police station to get the ball rolling for more assistance with the phone.

From the GH video transcription:

IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #104

So I called the police and said, “Hey, this is what we’ve got and I’d like you to help track, you know, ping this phone and see if we can’t get it going”. And I actually went back – ‘cause I was back at the truck – I walked back down the trail, and so literally within probably 10 minutes by the time I left the truck and walked back to the trail – I was walking back towards town – I ran into two officers coming at me down the trail. So they had deployed immediately, you know, on my call. I think there was a city officer and a county officer and we saw each other and said, “Hey, did you see them”. “No, neither one of us did”. So they spun around and then I think that’s when I ended up going back to the police station so we could give them the phone information so they could start pinging.

IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #104

I said, “It’s gonna be dark soon. We need to, we really need to call the police. So when we checked the phone records, the time – the police call was about 5:20. So, and when he did that, I wasn’t able to get ahold of Anna earlier so I tried calling her. I couldn’t get ahold of her. So I told him, I said, “I’m leaving. If you’re calling the police, I’m leaving and I’m going to Anna’s house.

 

[travelbug]

MP made that statement. He certainly didn't want to impede the investigation. Not intentionally anyway. The pinging was explained a couple of days ago, and we've talked a lot about it in the past, but has it been clarified where he got that information from? We know WHY the phone was probably pinging from different towers, there's a simple and innocent enough explanation for it, but who told him this in the first place? We've seen some of the things explained in interviews that the Patty's did with GH, and this was something that was referenced. I assumed he got the info from the phone company since BP talked about calling the phone company and trying to get them to help on the night of the 13th, and then MP went to the police station to get the ball rolling for more assistance with the phone.

BBM That is my point, who was on desk duty that night or who was the contact at the phone company? Have they been properly vetted? One of the problems with being in a small community is familiarity can prevent protocol from being followed.

 

[travelbug]

I'm not trying to rehash all of the information we have discussed, however if someone close to the investigation, victims or perpetrator altered facts or evidence at the beginning of the search it is an avenue to explore.

 

[mtnlites]

BBM That is my point, who was on desk duty that night or who was the contact at the phone company? Have they been properly vetted? One of the problems with being in a small community is familiarity can prevent protocol from being followed.

IMO it was probably just miscommunication or confusion. If MP was told that the phone was pinging from multiple towers without any further explanation then he may have interpreted that as the phone moving all over town. I'm not sure how the AT&T rep could fall into the small town familiarity angle.