GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - #12

[dancinunderthemoon]

.....I just realized, the children were home by the 11th........She wasnt found until the 16th.............no one bothered to hang around while she was being searched for either, didnt go to vigil on 9th while they were in town!

Hellfire and brimstone, even Scott Peterson went to his wife's vigil ! The one HE murdered and dumped into the ocean

 

[fred&edna]

I remember the family were waiting on having a service until after Shirley was found.........I thought that odd at the time, of course form the getgo KD wished his mother was dead so that she wasnt suffering......

.....I just realized, the children were home by the 11th........She wasnt found until the 16th.............no one bothered to hang around while she was being searched for either, didnt go to vigil on 9th while they were in town!

Hellfire and brimstone, even Scott Peterson went to his wife's vigil ! The one HE murdered and dumped into the ocean

I wonder if there was forensic evidence in house or garage that SS might have shared with the family suggesting SD was injured? Thus, they waited to have his service? Even if there was evidence would SS have shared it with them... I mean they were all possible persons of interest at that time? I'm just thinking out loud.

I really find it interesting none of the family members stayed, but I suppose they didn't know how long it would take to find her, or if she would ever be located?? I feel certain I would have remained in these circumstances but... that's just me.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I wonder if there was forensic evidence in house or garage that SS might have shared with the family suggesting SD was injured? Thus, they waited to have his service? Even if there was evidence would SS have shared it with them... I mean they were all possible persons of interest at that time? I'm just thinking out loud.

I really find it interesting none of the family members stayed, but I suppose they didn't know how long it would take to find her, or if she would ever be located?? I feel certain I would have remained in these circumstances but... that's just me.

MY GOSH, I know I would have stayed. Can you imagine how shocking it would be for a normal person having just found out one parent dead, on top of that, BEHEADED and the mom was missing? I would have thought she would be dismembered or beheaded as well. I would have been worried sick and hung around

I guess they all went back to work on MOnday week..................HOW idk but I've never had a beheading and murder in my family before, maybe it's easy to cope with

 

[wildebeest]

Lets say SS checked all cell phone towers for odd numbers during the timeframe of the murders. If the killers were from there area it probably would raise a red flag . So lets assume they were from the area and a cell tower covers about 4 miles in each direction that would be a lot of people I assume not knowing the population of that area. Now he would have to search for late night or early morning calls and I would assume real quick calls . Texts he can see the complete messages so lets rule out they sent a text to the driver of the boat or car. Burner phones can easily be traced to the store they were purchased at and my guess is if they did have burner phones they had a local number so as to not stick out like a sore thumb. Basically i'm just saying this was well planned and executed. I remember SS saying they used a software program to sort through all the cell phone records but my problem with that is the program is only as good as the person who created it and could miss certain words or abbreviations very easily. People do kind of speak in code a lot lately

Yes, hockey, even the most meticulous, intelligent, perpetrators use cell phones when committing crimes. Guess they haven’t heard how easily they are traced. So, I will go out on a limb, and say, SS almost certainly has some interesting cell phone records.

IMHO

 

[wildebeest]

I'm just going to throw this out there, as I have never heard that this was happening during the time of these horrific murders but:

According to SS, the D's home looked as if it had been "staged." It was immaculate (except, as I remember, a lampshade was tilted in LR). Is it possible they had their home for sale on the QT (no overt realtors/signs, etc.)? SS is not releasing some details.

My son and his wife have sold three homes in three different states over the last few years, and they always have them "staged." They look immaculate at all times. They tend to live in one area so the house is never messy and can be shown within a short period of time.

If this is the case, there would be any number of potential buyers at the home prior to their deaths. I am sure this is known to SS and he would have gone over the list of potential buyers (if this was the case) with a fine toothed comb. Just trying to understand the immaculate state the home was found in when SD was possibly not as healthy as she once was. She was completely dressed before her death. It is possible someone used a burner phone to call and arrange a house viewing with them? That has happened in cases where real estate agents were drawn to a home for a sale and were murdered. Buziak comes to mind.

All this is supposition. I keep my home fairly neat, but not "staged."

I like your theory, kirkassoc! Selling your home, without using a realtor, does mean you make more money. People of Russell and Shirley’s generation are known to be more frugal, as they lived through the Great Depression.

My question is: Who would have known they were trying to sell their home, on their own? With the major disconnect with family, I doubt they would have been aware. Could they have posted something at their clubhouse, or in a local publication?

IMHO

 

[fred&edna]

Can a home owner discuss selling property on the QT with a realtor friend? For example, "Hey realtor/friend, I'm thinking of selling but not exactly ready to put it on the market. Do you know someone who has been looking and is maybe interested in dealing in cash (usually sweeter) OR trade for another property closer to our son/daughter who lives in NC/FL?" Is that unethical or just not something a realtor would want to do? Maybe this is just a dumb scenario?

And, uhmmm... wasn't there a "questionable" accidental death of a realtor in the GW community soon after the Dermond murders??

 

[jggordo]

I still believe SS knows exactly who the suspects are. Knowing it and proving it are entirely different things. One of the reasons I believe this is the fact that other agencies are not still working to find suspects apparently. Forensic Accounting takes an EXTREMELY long time, and are only one facet of proving a homicide in Court. It would take a Jury who could have the patience and ability to follow connecting the dots that transpired over a long period of time. All in all a very circumstantial case.

JMO

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I still believe SS knows exactly who the suspects are. Knowing it and proving it are entirely different things. One of the reasons I believe this is the fact that other agencies are not still working to find suspects apparently. Forensic Accounting takes an EXTREMELY long time, and are only one facet of proving a homicide in Court. It would take a Jury who could have the patience and ability to follow connecting the dots that transpired over a long period of time. All in all a very circumstantial case.

JMO

I guess why he says he needs a witness, a phone call, but I hope that doesnt mean he's just twittling his thumbs on this case now but what else can he do? The house and cars have been turned over to family and sold, not sure about vehicles. No bodies now, they were cremated, understandably though, but if they needed them for some forensics, gone........Would need some probable cause and a judge to get search warrants on family finances.....what else?

 

[TJtennispro]

well it would give them the vicinity but they could also look up texts or other forms of messaging like facebook or snapchat etc.

They probably used walkie talkies and talked in code for instance “two sticks with a dash and a cake with a stick down”

 

[TJtennispro]

Different forensic accountant is currently reviewing the case. He is from Atlanta initials DD.

I still believe SS knows exactly who the suspects are. Knowing it and proving it are entirely different things. One of the reasons I believe this is the fact that other agencies are not still working to find suspects apparently. Forensic Accounting takes an EXTREMELY long time, and are only one facet of proving a homicide in Court. It would take a Jury who could have the patience and ability to follow connecting the dots that transpired over a long period of time. All in all a very circumstantial case.

JMO

 

[TJtennispro]

Yes a realtor “drowned” on her dock. I’ve always thought that was connected. Determined accidental but I’m not sure how you prove that.

Can a home owner discuss selling property on the QT with a realtor friend? For example, "Hey realtor/friend, I'm thinking of selling but not exactly ready to put it on the market. Do you know someone who has been looking and is maybe interested in dealing in cash (usually sweeter) OR trade for another property closer to our son/daughter who lives in NC/FL?" Is that unethical or just not something a realtor would want to do? Maybe this is just a dumb scenario?

And, uhmmm... wasn't there a "questionable" accidental death of a realtor in the GW community soon after the Dermond murders??

 

[TJtennispro]

Okay my reasoning for SD to be dropped off where she was has now changed. Wallace Dam is used to create electricity. The killers meant for her to get sucked into the turbines at the bottom and come out in 1-3 inch pieces.

That means she would’ve basically vanished like RD’s head. Of course in this scenario the kids would’ve had their inheritance held up forever in probate.

Maybe it wasn’t that the kids after all but someone that wanted the kids to not have the money. Maybe the killers thought they would inherit more than they did. Many on this thread thought the D’s were far wealthier than they were.

Maybe RD was meant for the same fate but was too heavy like some have said.

So who hates the D’s kids should maybe be the question we’re asking. Maybe someone close to the D’s kids that knew the alarm was out and the Derby plans.

MOO

 

[Deleted member 162919]

I like your theory, kirkassoc! Selling your home, without using a realtor, does mean you make more money. People of Russell and Shirley’s generation are known to be more frugal, as they lived through the Great Depression.

My question is: Who would have known they were trying to sell their home, on their own? With the major disconnect with family, I doubt they would have been aware. Could they have posted something at their clubhouse, or in a local publication?

IMHO

I did read somewhere a few years ago that the Dermonds had been cleaning out the junk in their house in anticipation of a move in the future. Maybe they donated some things that would suggest they had more money than they really did. Think about it. They donate some items to the salvation army or similar and the person taking in the items thinks " hey these people are donating some pretty high end things I bet they have much nicer stuff at home or have a lot of money. Well maybe that's not good cuz nothing of value was taken but hey it's a thought just not a good one

 

[Deleted member 162919]

I'm just not convinced this had anything to do with money but more likely revenge or rage or both.

 

[Deleted member 162919]

Another thought. Most of us on this site think about this case everyday yet and it bothers us the killers haven't been caught. Think of the family and their silence during all of this and they have no outrage and nothing to say about it publicly . WEIRD

 

[deugirtni]

Yes, so much silence, not much willingness to speak to media or others regarding the case, very cold and detached obit - even if written by the funeral home, they write them with more feeling than that. So if someone was out to get the kids back for something, doesn't seem like it was a good way. I am wondering if SS ever had a forensic accountant review everything when it first happened, because SS only said that he had every check ever written in the past 8 years, etc.. he didn't say anything ever, to my knowledge, or in any of the videos I've listened to, about a forensic accountant, and that is absolutely what he needed to have done... so if true, I am sure happy to hear that he has one reviewing right now, whether it's the first or second time.

One thing that I just don't understand, and hence the reason why I believe there is something major missing in those accounting records - is why the Ds *didn't* have a LOT more wealth, considering they had had NINETEEN franchises at one time. What happened with all that money? Franchises are pretty expensive propositions, and back then, it was still expensive, but more in line with what the standards of 'expensive' were back then. It wasn't THAT terribly long ago to make a *huge* difference - I mean, not like the 50s or something when bread was 5 cents (or whatever it was). And here they were living frugally, on top, nothing extravagant it seems, for these people. Something has got to be missing there, imho.

I also think they had to go back to that time, not just for 8 years back.. back to that time when he *had* those franchises and how they were disposed of. All I have read is that the sons took them over. Not sure how anyone would even operate NINETEEN of them, so I'm assuming that they sold some, and with those proceeds, paid for their home outright, their vehicles, etc. And the rest, the sons 'took over', but does that not include 'buying' them, in one way or another? And if so, then how did the daughter get her 'share' of her parents' estate, as it was said the estate was divided equally amongst the three, other than a small amount to their deceased son's child.

The thing about that realtor drowning - although it was not on the same lake, it was on the lake on the other side of the dam, IIRC.. but there seem to be connections there. How can that death so easily and quickly be called 'accidental'? That was sure some freak 'accident', if so. And pretty strange for someone who'd been living on the lake for years. I could see it if she'd had a heart attack or stroke or aneurysm or something, which *caused* the drowning, but if it were me, I would've been looking into that for a VERY long time until I had exhausted every possibility that it could have been something different than an accident. jmo.

 

[deugirtni]

I am newer to this thread.. but it seems to me that most are thinking that SD's fate was planned, with RD's beheading perhaps something done instead of having the same fate as SD.. perhaps because they couldn't manage the body, especially after having already done the first one, or whatever. What if it were the other way around? What if the plan was to behead them both, and take the heads, but after doing RD first, and seeing all the blood, and not wanting the death(s) to be noticed right away (to allow time to get back to their original location and work on their alibi(s)?) What if it was a second thought to do that to SD, and they used whatever was available.

 

[deugirtni]

People seem to believe that SD's body was not meant to ever be discovered, but I am of a different thinking on that. If her body didn't move much after being dumped there, then she was put into an area where fishermen were bound to discover her after the expected amount of time and released gases, etc. She didn't have enough weights to keep her down - I can't imagine that being accidental. Surely the killers looked into this stuff before doing that, and would have known it wasn't enough weight? I believe they wanted her discovered after the 2 week period or whatever.

 

[fred&edna]

Okay my reasoning for SD to be dropped off where she was has now changed. Wallace Dam is used to create electricity. The killers meant for her to get sucked into the turbines at the bottom and come out in 1-3 inch pieces.

That means she would’ve basically vanished like RD’s head. Of course in this scenario the kids would’ve had their inheritance held up forever in probate.

Maybe it wasn’t that the kids after all but someone that wanted the kids to not have the money. Maybe the killers thought they would inherit more than they did. Many on this thread thought the D’s were far wealthier than they were.

Maybe RD was meant for the same fate but was too heavy like some have said.

So who hates the D’s kids should maybe be the question we’re asking. Maybe someone close to the D’s kids that knew the alarm was out and the Derby plans.

MOO

BBM... That's been one of my theories.
And, maybe that's why the sons and daughter have always been so very quiet.

 

[TJtennispro]

Respectfully disagree. We don’t know where the body was dropped. I know where it was found. Speculation on the lake is directly in front of the damn but there is a line in the water you can’t cross several hundred feet away from the damn.

They in my opinion weighed the body down enough for it to hopefully float through the turbines along the bottom of the lake. If they used too much weight then it’s an anchor to little and it’s floats to the top.

I didn’t realize gasses made a body float to the top so maybe they didn’t either. We don’t know what we don’t know.

Either way she wasn’t dropped in a fishing spot she drifted over that way.

Body was tossed in an area that was 60 feet deep. I remember others speculating much deeper water.

People seem to believe that SD's body was not meant to ever be discovered, but I am of a different thinking on that. If her body didn't move much after being dumped there, then she was put into an area where fishermen were bound to discover her after the expected amount of time and released gases, etc. She didn't have enough weights to keep her down - I can't imagine that being accidental. Surely the killers looked into this stuff before doing that, and would have known it wasn't enough weight? I believe they wanted her discovered after the 2 week period or whatever.