OH - 9 killed + Gunman, 16 injured, Mass Shooting, Oregon District, Dayton, 4 Aug 2019

[crhedBngr]

Wow, WS is going wonky right now. My post was doubled; I see @FunkyMonkey 's was tripled!

 

[FunkyMonkey]

At least one person reported him to the police, but said nothing happened. I posted the link somewhere on this thread.

I was answering the person who asked why assault charges weren’t pressed for the strangulation and loaded weapon incidents. It’s quite a simple answer regarding those two. MOO

 

[MsBetsy]

Meds can help with some illness, bipolar for example. Not much help with psychopaths, that's a toss up from what I know...(I'm not an expert in any way)

Well, if he was having fantasies or urges to harm people, it can certainly help to control those symptoms. Especially since he apparently was disturbed by them or scared himself.
I'm not sure he was ever diagnised with any mental health disorder, though. We haven't heard anything about his medical records. Imo

 

[FunkyMonkey]

Wow, WS is going wonky right now. My post was doubled; I see @FunkyMonkey 's was tripled!

Glad I’m not going crazy!!! ... Yet!

 

[MsBetsy]

Wow, WS is going wonky right now. My post was doubled; I see @FunkyMonkey 's was tripled!

Yeah, I'm having problems, too.
If it doesn't go through the first time you have to wait about 30 seconds before you try again, or you'll end up with multiple posts.

 

[Doghairrules]

It says there was communication between CB and his friend after CB left the bar. I wonder if he told them he was in Ned peppers and maybe that is why MB and friend had left Blind Bobs and were waiting in line to get in. So CB knew exactly where they were when he started shooting. I feel like it is is much too much of a coincidence for him to shoot both people he knew versus it being random. All just speculation on my part.

So so strange.

This is exactly what I was thinking.

 

[Doghairrules]

Megan Betts was the kindest person friends and former classmates knew
Megan Betts was the kindest person friends and former classmates knew - CNN

Just heartbreaking.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

I'm guessing they were advised not to apologize. That's the only thing I thought might be in here that isn't.

With all due respect, why should the parents apologize for his actions? He was a legal adult and responsible for his own actions.

 

[Colorado303]

Naïve as heck statement IMO. Try those shoes. I have with all the resources possible. Even the courts work against you. I had a love one in the psyche ward but they (the county ,released him) in spite of witnesses, testimony, the main psychiatrist in charge of the case testifying against his release, they discharged him. That same psychiatrist, by coincidence, was the head of the County Mental Health dept. EASILY???

Until you know a kid like this, it’s almost impossible to imagine a reality where there is no help. Of course there must be help available—the parents didn’t try hard enough. And if parents had been on the ball in the first place the kid wouldn’t even need help. Believing anything else is just too scary.

I’m not saying there aren’t plenty of rotten parents out there and some raise rotten kids. But many if those children grow up to be fine people. Conversely, occassionally children with excellent parents have no moral compass whatsoever. No doubt proper nurturing is critical, but sometimes nature trumps all.

 

[Colorado303]

I agree but what do we do with these people? Nothing until they have already hurt or killed someone. I can’t imagine having a child like this. You can’t return the defective child. You are literally stuck until they do something horrible.

Exactly! And that needs to change or IMO the senseless violence is just going to get worse.

 

[Colorado303]

As a teacher, our hands are tied also. Violent kids are reported and it’s ignored. They are sent right back to class

As a teacher, what do you think needs to be done to identify these kids, “fix” them if possible, and keep them out of your classrooms if not? You shouldn’t have to worry about your safety and the safety of your other students.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Until you know a kid like this, it’s almost impossible to imagine a reality where there is no help. Of course there must be help available—the parents didn’t try hard enough. And if parents had been on the ball in the first place the kid wouldn’t even need help. Believing anything else is just too scary.

I’m not saying there aren’t plenty of rotten parents out there and some raise rotten kids. But many if those children grow up to be fine people. Conversely, occassionally children with excellent parents have no moral compass whatsoever. No doubt proper nurturing is critical, but sometimes nature trumps all.

Liking this wasn't enough for me. THANK YOU and well put.

IMO people want to reassure themselves that this would never happen to them so they find anything they can point fingers at to prove to themselves it would never happen to them.

It's human nature. We all do it in one way or another. I've done it myself.

When in reality there is so much in life we can't control, even how our kids turn out. Maybe especially how our kids turn out.

 

[Safeguard]

Conversely, occassionally children with excellent parents have no moral compass whatsoever. No doubt proper nurturing is critical, but sometimes nature trumps all.

rs/bbm
Nature always trumps all. imo. You can't "nurture" sight in a child born blind.

 

[Owutatangledweb]

Good point. And reminds me why I hated law school. If I hit someone in the head just to annoy them, but they have an eggshell skull and die I’m responsible for murder even though my intent wasn’t to kill anyone.
The fact that I intended to hit and the hit caused a death makes it murder.

The principle here is that you take your victim as you find him/her and you suffer the consequences.

Here, if I intend to and successfully shoot a bunch of people and the result of my actions happen to influence an election, it’s only my intention that matters — not the end result.

The principle here is the thickness of the skulls of politicians and the rest of us suffer the consequences.

G-d bless all you lawyers out there and everyone else w/the patience to understand the difference.

Sorry, my replies are in bold in your quote.

 

[Murphy1950]

Until you know a kid like this, it’s almost impossible to imagine a reality where there is no help. Of course there must be help available—the parents didn’t try hard enough. And if parents had been on the ball in the first place the kid wouldn’t even need help. Believing anything else is just too scary.

I’m not saying there aren’t plenty of rotten parents out there and some raise rotten kids. But many if those children grow up to be fine people. Conversely, occassionally children with excellent parents have no moral compass whatsoever. No doubt proper nurturing is critical, but sometimes nature trumps all.

"And if parents had been on the ball in the first place the kid wouldn’t even need help"

I take your comment at face value, once again awed by the naivete, IMO

 

[IzzyBlanche]

"And if parents had been on the ball in the first place the kid wouldn’t even need help"

I take your comment at face value, once again awed by the naivete, IMO

I read that comment as sarcasm, considering the first line of the post. Because it is very true that until you know a kid like this, it’s almost impossible to imagine a reality where there is no help.

And if you are living that reality, it is very easy for others to make judgments like "if the parents had been on the ball in the first place the kid wouldn't even need help."

 

[kbpirate]

As a teacher, what do you think needs to be done to identify these kids, “fix” them if possible, and keep them out of your classrooms if not? You shouldn’t have to worry about your safety and the safety of your other students.

Put them in alternative learning environments, where they can at least be closely monitored. There is no perfect answer. I think sometimes people are just bad and there is no way to weed these people out of society until they have already done something horrible.

There is also the stigma that comes from having a “bad child.” The parents know they will be judged and most of the time they love their child. They probably thought they could keep him from snapping if they kept him close.

I don’t know what the right answer is in these situations. Who does the responsibility fall on?

 

[MsFacetious]

Are you thinking they may have some legal repercussions?

Yes. I think they are concerned about appearing to accept any responsibility for legal/lawsuit reasons.

I would want to apologize because if I hadn't birthed a monster those other people would still be alive. I would feel horrible just for that, nevermind all the ways I could have prevented the massacre. I would feel responsible, maybe they do not.

At least one person reported him to the police, but said nothing happened. I posted the link somewhere on this thread.

That was another one from his school days.
Megan's friend who was strangled and the friend who had a gun held to his head did not report.

"And if parents had been on the ball in the first place the kid wouldn’t even need help"

I take your comment at face value, once again awed by the naivete, IMO

Colorado was pointing out the naievete of people. Clearly they have experience in this area.

It was clear to me that they were explaining this is what people believe to reassure themselves it cannot happen to them.

 

[Murphy1950]

My apologies if I missed the implications. That is why I stated "face value". Tired I guess and thanks for the clarification.

 

[MsFacetious]

A woman, who was shot in the head during the horrific mass shooting in Dayton, Ohio early Sunday morning, expressed one heartbreaking final wish on the phone with her boyfriend — to get home to her children.

In an emotional Facebook post, Daryl “Dee” Lee shared his girlfriend Lois “Lola” Oglesby’s last words.

“She FaceTimed me and said ‘Babe, I just got shot in my head, I need to get to my kids,” Lee wrote on Sunday following the massacre.

“Like that’s strong as f— to hold off to call me!!” Lee continued. “She was letting me know she loved me and to take care of these kids and I got you babe!!!!!!!! I can’t stop crying!!!!!!!”

Woman Shot in Head During Dayton Massacre Called Boyfriend and Said She Needed to Get to Her Kids