Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #12

[SnooperDuper]

I think "a third person did it and framed the fugitives" is a bit of a conspiracy theory and conspiracy theories are not allowed on the site.

Besides, why have these two ran and ran and ran to the ends of the roads and never once called home? They sure are acting guilty.

 

[Elliot_Alderson]

If they were able to walk along the shore of the Nelson River to 9km from the car, and leave personal items, why couldn't they continue to walk along the shore past the rapids?

From looking at maps, it looks like 9km from the car is just before the rapids, and 13km is just after the rapids. It doesn't really make sense that they would take a boat through the rapids when they could stay on the shore.

Do you think they are wily enough to leave items in an attempt to make it look like they went in the water?

 

[KALI]

Doesn't it seem more and more likely that these perps are deceased? How are they eating?

 

[MistyWaters]

Them not being charged (yet) doesn't mean they are innocent. There could be a number of reasons as to why they haven't been charged. When I was in high school my friends step mother went missing, and it was later discovered she had been murdered by a serial killer. He was not charged for all of the murders he was suspected of, but there was no doubt he was guilty imo.

Here's a (BC government) website that will give some ideas as to why charges have yet to be laid in their deaths.
Laying Charges - Province of British Columbia

Yes the media is filled with headlines “police are seeking so and so suspected in the murders of X and Y”. I’ve never noticed it questioned before whether the police have some type of incriminating evidence. If they didn’t, they wouldn’t have reason to name someone as a suspect.

What’s different in this case, had the suspects not fled from the province of BC and instead been arrested shortly thereafter, even if no charges had yet been filed, they would be detained as charges can be filed within 24 hours. However as it’s known they fled, the 2nd degree charges in the murder of LD now ensures an across-country arrest warrant has been filed which supports an arrest in all provinces and if found, they’ll be returned to BC.

But as they haven’t been located, additional murder charges proves nothing at this point as they’ve already been identified as suspects in the murder of L&C. As you mention, formal charges not being laid doesn’t prove innocence, nor does it prove guilt for that matter. JMO

 

[FactFinder3000]

There are no dams downriver from where the RAV4 was dumped. It's a straight run to Hudson Bay. Which is interesting, actually. They went to the river at a point that is just past all the dams. If they were suicidal, suicide by drowning is surprisingly common, and they may have wanted their bodies to never be found.

 

[Optics]

I'm also suspecting that the items were washed up on shore, and not merely left behind along the shore. Items found washed up on shore would imply that they were either tossed into the river or were once in a boat that capsized.

Yes I agree, the waters on either side of a hydro dam are extremely turbulent even though they may seem calm. It is extremely dangerous even for divers to go down and search for a body in those areas. Also in the case of Sundance area the glacial silt impedes visibility too. I don't think many people realize how extremely dangerous it was for those divers to go in where they did, so for 2 guys trying to navigate that section would be even more dangerous.

 

[otto]

Playing with this idea for a second, there were a couple of dams near where I grew up, and they would release water during rainy periods that caused a surge in the river below. They would post the release times beforehand, and we would all grab inner tubes or floaty things and float along on the surge.

I'm at work, so shouldn't even be looking here (but I can't pull myself away!), but does Manitoba Hydro post water release times if they do such things at say the Limestone converter station just upstream? Just a thought ...

Did a bit of reading and it looks like the levels are checked every hour, and the level cannot rise more than 1 foot. My impression is that it's about protecting the shoreline and not spilling into land.

https://www.gov.mb.ca/sd/pubs/water-use-licensing/limestone/licence_drawing2.pdf

Sustainable Development | Province of Manitoba

 

[MistyWaters]

Playing with this idea for a second, there were a couple of dams near where I grew up, and they would release water during rainy periods that caused a surge in the river below. They would post the release times beforehand, and we would all grab inner tubes or floaty things and float along on the surge.

I'm at work, so shouldn't even be looking here (but I can't pull myself away!), but does Manitoba Hydro post water release times if they do such things at say the Limestone converter station just upstream? Just a thought ...

I was thinking about additional release of waters by the dams downstream because of the rainy weather too. Early on the photos of the police vehicles are rife with mud.



“On Thursday morning an armoured RCMP vehicle was parked outside of Gillam Town Office.”
Car found burned in Gillam area used by suspects in B.C. deaths: RCMP

 

[otto]

Doesn't it seem more and more likely that these perps are deceased? How are they eating?

Everyone was saying last week that they must be deceased, then more evidence is discovered that proves they are alive.

 

[Kittybunny]

So sorry folks, just catching up and trying to read back, but could they have set personal items in the boat and then pushed it out/let it go to confuse the trail, and then set in a different direction? Or do we think "Items connected to them" means something more? I think they could be crafty enough to do something like that.

 

[KR72]

From Austin Grabish Twitter.

"The RCMP say human remains were found in The Pas, Man. last night near the University College of the North. Police say the identity of the remains is unknown right now. No other details released."

Austin Grabish on Twitter

 

[otto]

So sorry folks, just catching up and trying to read back, but could they have set personal items in the boat and then pushed it out/let it go to confuse the trail, and then set in a different direction? Or do we think "Items connected to them" means something more? I think they could be crafty enough to do something like that.

I think that's a good possibility. It doesn't make much sense to me that their personal items are at 9km from the car, just before the rapids, and the boat is at 13km, just past the rapids.

If their things were in the boat and it capsized, their belongings would not be upstream of the rapids. It makes more sense that they left their possessions there. If they were on shore upstream of the rapids, why would they get in a boat to go through the rapids when they could continue on shore?

Maybe they did not know that the rapids were nearby? Was it a wild adventure that didn't turn out as they expected?

 

[steelybird]

A gross thought: what if they died in the river and then as they rotted, their shoes came off and then washed up? Can that happen?

We frequently have shoes wash up on shore here in BC with the feet still in them. But I think it takes awhile for that decomposition process to happen. If you go to the Government of Canada website their is actually a link for unidentified remains but I will caution you that some images are quite disturbing.

Canada's Missing | Search results

 

[Gina20]

Southern Alberta RCMP take a helicopter out in the fall when water levels drop to check rivers, creeks and irrigation canals for human remains. FYI.

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

From Austin Grabish Twitter.

"The RCMP say human remains were found in The Pas, Man. last night near the University College of the North. Police say the identity of the remains is unknown right now. No other details released."

Austin Grabish on Twitter

Google Maps
That's near a university with approx. 2400 students.

 

[scrappinkat]

Aug 7 2019
As manhunt drags on, Chynna Deese’s family worries they might never get answers if suspects aren’t caught alive
"The details shared by police aren't enough for Deese's family to begin to understand the reasons for her death, her brother Stetson Deese said on Tuesday. Yet, like the general public, it's all they've heard since Deese and Fowler were found shot to death on the side of the Alaska Highway on July 15.

"I'd say the best word for it is confusing," said Stetson, 30, in a telephone interview from Charlotte, N.C. "These kids aren't going to turn themselves in and we're never really going to know why this happened."

The uncertainty about the suspects' whereabouts and the possibility that they may never be found alive is weighing on the Deese family, many of whom have yet to return to work due to the trauma caused by her sudden death.

"Everybody is having trouble accepting it. It's just one of the hardest things to accept," Stetson said. "She was perfectly healthy, she had what probably would have been her husband who she was travelling with."

"Some information has reached Deese's family through an unexpected source — Canadians who are alerting them to new tips through private messages on social media.

"It's comforting. It shows there's a lot of Canadians that really care," Stetson said. In the meantime, the family is eager for as much "inside information" they can get from the police, like updates on locations they searched every day".

I wonder how differently a case like this is handled in USA and NSW where Stephen Fowler has experience. Are family members who’ve lost loved ones in a violent crime kept more informed about details during the investigation? In the case of Stephen Fowler and his years of experience if victim’s family are kept more informed this must be a huge frustration for him. Are there rules about putting in a FOI request? Could the Deese or Fowler family do that if they were so inclined or it something you must be in Canada or a citizen to do so?

 

[steelybird]

Pack it up everyone, case closed, his friends and family don't think he did it so there's no way he could have. /s

omg lol

 

[Moonlitnight]

I think these theories about them being framed, etc. are coming about because of how young they look. Like even the guy who pushed them out of the mud said "I can't imagine those two killing anyone, they didn't even know how to give a proper handshake." It's really shocking to think that these two teenagers just out of high school could do this. But, the evidence indicates they did.

Exactly! Those are my sentiments plus a whole lot of cognitive dissonance. They look like such young and innocent boys. How could they possibly have done this?

 

[derweezy]

Because what they found was enough to conclude that the two were likely dead, or soon to be dead? After that they made a good faith effort to find their bodies just for closure, but then decided that it wasn't worth the risk to the divers to continue, since the current is very strong there, and they were pretty sure the two died already. JMO.

This could be true, but they may not have been looking for just bodies, but evidence that they were in the water, even a gun or something that could sink and become wedged in a rock. I'm stuck on the items found on shore, but nothing in the water, so I keep thinking the items on shore were left there as a camp, or discarded. The items found on shore could not be related to the boat at all, I think they were even found at different times. thanks for the reply though!

 

[Diezelmonster]

From Austin Grabish Twitter.

"The RCMP say human remains were found in The Pas, Man. last night near the University College of the North. Police say the identity of the remains is unknown right now. No other details released."

Austin Grabish on Twitter

That is on the other side of the province..