CA CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #8

[jstokes]

Abduction with a car hit. No evidence left at the scene.
Man hit US scientist with car before abduction and rape, say Crete police

I think this guy will turn out to be someone who is a local, or at least a hunter/off-roader very familiar with these areas, who was out that day looking for opportunity, who knows he can control a woman of a certain size and for whom this is a thrilling sport.

 

[LAhiker]

The two sites are at most 4-6 hours apart, I think.

I was also looking at the Schmierer deaths, and the fact that the couple wasn't together. It seemed quite possible that Susan was chased into the desert by someone because of where she was found, just like Sheryl Powell said she was chased. Perhaps her husband tried to go for help but couldn't make it back. I can't think of a reason an ordinary couple intending to walk a few steps to view a crater would become separated. Nor did either one seem like an off-trail hiker.

The desert is an unforgiving environment. IMO, it is all too easy for people to get separated on hikes. One person is tired or injured, the other decides to go on or get help.

To summarize my earlier post that I linked to a few minutes ago (and that I quote below), Sheryl Powell was missed sooner than Barbara Thomas was reported missing. When I consider the earliest that Sheryl Powell might've been missed, and the latest that Barbara Thomas might've been missed, I come up with 2 1/2 hours. It's at minimum a 4 3/4 hour drive between the two locations.

As far as I know, Sheryl Powell was near Grandview Campground on White Mountain Rd in Bishop when she said a knife-wielding man attacked her, causing her to run into the wilderness. Her husband called 911 at 2pm and said he'd been searching for her for a while -- maybe an hour.

That same day, RT reported BT missing; the search area was located at the intersection of Kelbaker Rd and Hidden Hill Road, and it looks like that was where he and BT pulled over for their walk. While reports vary as to when he found her missing, it seems like that must've been between around noon and 3:26 pm when he called 911. By his accounts, it was between noon and ~2 or 2:30.

According to Google maps, the shortest route between those two points takes around 4 3/4 hours. So even if Sheryl Powell was missed at 1pm and BT was first missed at 3:30pm (though BT was probably missed sooner), it seems physically impossible for the same perpetrator to be involved.

JMO

 

[al66pine]

Similarities to Other Abduction Cases?

The sheriff's ....say there's no evidence of abduction; .... If you look at the example of the other woman who had to evade a knife-wielding attacker for four days, the cases are actually quite similar: both areas are remote campgrounds, both couples, both cases of women who were with men so seemed to be safe, both did something ordinary like walk a dog or take their beer back to the RV while their husband was distracted with another task.
Both women were petite or on the small side, neither was particularly young.... I don't find it hard to believe that a small woman could be intentionally bumped by a car hard enough to knock her down, put her in the car, and drive off - that would take 3 minutes max. No evidence. That's exactly what happened to the woman in Montana who was out for her ordinary jog when abducted by two oil workers (IIRC).
There is another case current that is disturbingly similar. Further north, at Discovery Bay, a rather rural hamlet, a woman went out to water plants - husband inside the home - and disappeared. Her husband flagged down cops. An extensive search found her body in the water nearby. Petite older woman....

@jstokes Thanks for your post. sbm ^bbm Welcome to Websleuths.
Per Missing Person Search (oag.ca.gov.search) and other sources, BT is 5 ft 9 in tall. At that height & 130 lbs, she could be described as thin, slight, slim, lean, lanky, etc, imo, but I don’t know about 'petite' or 'small.’ Maybe not so similar to other woman.

Agreeing w part of above post - a car could 'bump' someone of her size & build, then abduct quickly (tho not at top of my theory list).

Jmo, could be wrong.

 

[jstokes]

Google Maps are not only unreliable, they don't account for things like routes that are not the major roads. This is all desert and people familiar with this terrain know fire roads, off-roads, etc. It's also possible there were perps working in concert that day; one got successful and the other not, or the other abduction was pursued because the first was not successful. I don't really believe in coincidence when there are so many similarities of MO and victims.

60-something couples' bodies winding up in two different places is more than a standard desert occurrence. This is not person 1 left in the shade of a tree while person 2 goes for help. Susan Schmierer's body was found in a place that had been searched before through thousands of hours by many searchers; another odd occurrence.

 

[jstokes]

Similarities to Other Abduction Cases?

@jstokes Thanks for your post. sbm ^bbm Welcome to Websleuths.
Per Missing Person Search and other sources, BT is 5 ft 9 in tall. At that height & 130 lbs, she could be described as thin, slight, slim, lean, lanky, etc, imo, but I don’t know about 'petite' or 'small.’ Maybe not so similar to other woman.

Agreeing w part of above post - a car could 'bump' someone of her size & build, then abduct quickly (tho not at top of my theory list).

Jmo, could be wrong.

Petite of frame was my point. Not 200 pounds, not hard to lift or control in that regard (although clearly her would-be abductor did not count on her speed).

 

[ChuckMaureen]

We assume there was enough time for this event because, well, BT is missing.

A major piece of backstory is also missing: motive.

Who and why would that who(m) want to disappear BT?

Spur of the moment or... planned?

If it was an opportunity-stalker, did the T's come across the 'abductor' while doing errands that day?

Has the FBI been asked to create a profile for the 'abductor' in this case?

Did BT have an ex-boyfriend(s) (from recent years, college or high school years past)?

Did anyone who BT knows need money / was refused?

Did RT or BT have 'enemies', be they business-related or neighbors?

We assume RT was carrying ID, because we assume he was driving. We are told BT was not carrying ID when she disappeared, was BT's ID in the truck or RV or left at home / elsewhere that day?

Did BT have her own credit/debit card(s); were any of them used that day (before BT's disappearance)?

Was the Honk Kong (round)trip the only upcoming / planned event in BT's future?

What did the T's have planned in the future (something they were to do together after the hike, after the Hong Kong trip)? Was anything purchased for those plans?

What did BT have already packed for her Hong Kong trip? How extensive was that pack (for a few days stay or for longer, how much longer)?

What is the most-recent electronic trail element from BT; social media, email, financial transaction, major purchase?

How many different types of hats does BT own? One, or more? Are they all 'baseball' style caps?

Were BT's fingerprints found in and/or on the truck and/or RV?

Did the T's own other vehicles? Recently purchased or sold?

Does the T's house include a basement?

Do the T's rent a storage unit(s)?

 

[jstokes]

Petite of frame was my point. Not 200 pounds, not hard to lift or control in that regard (although clearly her would-be abductor did not count on her speed).

Sorry - I mixed up Sheryl Powell's evasion of her attempted abductor with BT's disappearance. The Crete abduction was on my mind when I read about this because I had never heard of a woman being deliberately hit that way in order to perpetrate the crime and like others, assumed such a thing would leave blood or some evidence behind. But in Crete, apparently they caught the suspect because of where her body was found, and because he had made a YouTube video exploring those caves.

 

[MsBetsy]

It makes no logical sense to me.
We see pics of her at their campsite with her in a bikini. We also have a pic of her which looks like it might be a hike with her in a white t, jeans and tennis shoes.
I'm just not buying it that she started out on a walk in the desert in a bikini/underwear.

I doubt LE would have described her that way if they were not sure what she was wearing when she went missing.

 

[MassGuy]

I doubt LE would have described her that way if they were not sure what she was wearing when she went missing.

All they had to go on at the time (as far as we know), was the husband’s word.

Time was of the essence, and getting that information out to the public was incredibly important.

Even without independent sightings or video/photographic evidence, I absolutely believe they would have simply provided the description that Rob gave them.

 

[MsBetsy]

All they had to go on at the time (as far as we know), was the husband’s word.

Time was of the essence, and getting that information out to the public was incredibly important.

Even without independent sightings or video/photographic evidence, I absolutely believe they would have simply provided the description that Rob gave them.

I wonder if the pictures of her from that day look different from what he described and that's why there are some discrepancies.
It's a little strange that they describe her as wearing underwear. Imo

 

[katydid23]

The desert is an unforgiving environment. IMO, it is all too easy for people to get separated on hikes. One person is tired or injured, the other decides to go on or get help.

To summarize my earlier post that I linked to a few minutes ago (and that I quote below), Sheryl Powell was missed sooner than Barbara Thomas was reported missing. When I consider the earliest that Sheryl Powell might've been missed, and the latest that Barbara Thomas might've been missed, I come up with 2 1/2 hours. It's at minimum a 4 3/4 hour drive between the two locations.



JMO

wait, I;m confused...

 

[bronbaby]

]

Abduction with a car hit. No evidence left at the scene.
Man hit US scientist with car before abduction and rape, say Crete police

I think this guy will turn out to be someone who is a local, or at least a hunter/off-roader very familiar with these areas, who was out that day looking for opportunity, who knows he can control a woman of a certain size and for whom this is a thrilling sport.

RT could fit that description.
IMO

 

[Curiousobserver]

Sometimes it takes a while. CF Missing persons in Joshua Tree.

Some missing persons in SBC will eventually be found after extensive initial searches. If she went off down HH Road further than they thought, for example.

She could have theoretically lasted for a couple of days. If she didn't wander in circles she could be quite far from those rocks.

e.g. If she was in great shape she could have walked 5 or more miles that first afternoon and a couple more that night or next day.

 

[katydid23]

She could have theoretically lasted for a couple of days. If she didn't wander in circles she could be quite far from those rocks.

e.g. If she was in great shape she could have walked 5 or more miles that first afternoon and a couple more that night or next day.

True.
But when she went missing, she was only a quarter of a mile away from the road, and the RV was in sight, if I understand correctly.

So I don't understand why she would wAlk miles in the wrong direction, and not be found in initial searches.

 

[rosesfromangels]

Abduction with a car hit. No evidence left at the scene.
Man hit US scientist with car before abduction and rape, say Crete police

I think this guy will turn out to be someone who is a local, or at least a hunter/off-roader very familiar with these areas, who was out that day looking for opportunity, who knows he can control a woman of a certain size and for whom this is a thrilling sport.

I posted this theory in one of our threads, and still believe it is entirely possible, although I still believe the likelihood of her being within the area last seen and yet to be found, is still the most probable.

My colleague from Bullhead still believes she ended up in one of the many mines in the area, which he says hold many crime victims, and are very deep; holding on to those ill fated souls.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[Cherwell]

I think abduction is the most unlikely scenario out of any possibility.
A would-be abductor just happens to be driving through the area.
A bikini wearing woman holding a beer just happens to be crossing the road alone.
This abductor manages to hit her with her car, with absolutely no one seeing or hearing a thing.
He bundles her inside, managing to make sure he leaves no trace behind (beer can, blood, clothing, tire marks, blood, car parts; anything).
Then he escapes with his prey.
Even if you change the scenario a bit, it still requires huge leaps and tremendous luck.
I think it’s far more likely that she got lost in the desert, or was never there in the first place.
Abductions happen, but if one happened here, this guy should buy a lottery ticket.

The kind of abduction you describe is driven by opportunity, so there's no element of luck or coincidence. Such people strike when they see a likely victim, they don't necessarily go looking.
Plus they don't always use force to get the victim into the car.

 

[shanadk]

I don't believe that Barbara was wandering the desert that day in a bikini or 'underwear'.
Sorry, Just don't.

Remember the McStays.
SBLE kept info close to the vest, all thru investigation. I will assume they are doing the same for Barbara.

 

[shanadk]

We are told that Barbara
1. was not carrying ID that day;
2. was dressed in a bikini for hiking;
3. did not have a personal cell phone or personal Email, and 4. her phone calls were supervised by the husband.
I see red flags all over this description and relationship.

 

[Hair of the Dog]

I wonder if RT while he was looking for BT and/or waiting for LE, encountered anyone else hiking in the area or flagged down any passing cars to ask if they had seen Barb.

@dbdb11 did RT mention doing anything like that?

 

[Curiousobserver]

The desert is an unforgiving environment. IMO, it is all too easy for people to get separated on hikes. One person is tired or injured, the other decides to go on or get help.

To summarize my earlier post that I linked to a few minutes ago (and that I quote below), Sheryl Powell was missed sooner than Barbara Thomas was reported missing. When I consider the earliest that Sheryl Powell might've been missed, and the latest that Barbara Thomas might've been missed, I come up with 2 1/2 hours. It's at minimum a 4 3/4 hour drive between the two locations.



JMO

This is a great example of how easy is it to get lost in the desert (assuming everything about that story is true).

Her husband was a few hundred feet away at most and only gone for <5 min. minutes and she went missing. Even with searchers and helicopters she wasn't found for days and yet she was only around 2 miles from where she was last seen. Had her dog not been found, she might still be out there.