Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #19

[Gina20]

It has been pointed out in long discussions here that the wording of both DS and KM's statements to the media is similar. IMO, it could have been taken from the same script.

We have no context for most of what has happened in this case. It bears repeating now, in light of new information, that none of the parents made a direct public appeal to their children to give themselves up. That is not a judgment. It is a fact. It also stands in contrast to what has become the norm in today's media age, where families appeal to their loved ones on the run from police to stand down and turn themselves in.

We might learn why this was in the near future when the RCMP release their report.

It does stand out, which is why I am repeating what has already been discussed here at length. It may have to do with the existence of videos.

 

[NJSleuth91]

Not to mention, all those hours on the road in the pickup, then later Leonard's RAV, you're going to have some deep end of ocean conversations with your road trip buddy. I know I would. I also pictured Bryer sitting in the passenger seat, interviewing Kam while he's driving or while they were parked, but maybe keeping video logs of their travel across Canada.

I still really wonder what they talked about during all those hours of driving.

I could see this. I actually don't think it's that weird at all that they filmed multiple videos. This is by far the most important thing they had ever been part of. And especially as part of the social media generation, they knew other people would want to know what they were thinking, what the trip was like, etc.

Another thing, I'm now 36 but I know lots of people round my age and younger love Snapchat. Personally I think it's stupid and don't use it but lots of my friends love making all kinds of random videos when were out and about or all gathered round having some deep discussions. (On top of taking photos.. ugh.) God knows how many videos of me exist out there. I do know there's thousands of photos. I don't recall anyone saying Bryer and Kam had Snapchat accounts but who knows. I'm sure that would have been revealed weeks ago with the Steam, Instagram and Facebook stuff.

It was said in an article that Bryer shared a video of himself pretending to masturbate to a picture of Hitler on Snapchat.

 

[MistyWaters]

But we don't know for sure if they could have seen it at certain times and if it would have mattered .... maybe yes, maybe no. The thing that I found odd is that a plea directly to THEM never came. It seemed the only logical/natural thing to do. Of course, as you pointed out, the RCMP could have told them otherwise. I'm just speculating, since we just don't have these facts. MOO

I think a public plea via the media would be the very most ineffective means of family members asking the two to surrender because it couldn’t be personalized without creating a whole lot of additional drama and sensationalism. The public wouldn’t need to be informed if they reached out through private means including voicemail or text messages or through other online communication apps. Police psychologists often assist in crafting a message in the hopes it will yield positive results.

 

[Satchie]

It has been pointed out in long discussions here that the wording of both DS and KM's statements to the media is similar. IMO, it could have been taken from the same script.

We have no context for most of what has happened in this case. It bears repeating now, in light of new information, that none of the parents made a direct public appeal to their children to give themselves up. That is not a judgment. It is a fact. It also stands in contrast to what has become the norm in today's media age, where families appeal to their loved ones on the run from police to stand down and turn themselves in.

We might learn why this was in the near future when the RCMP release their report.

It does stand out, which is why I am repeating what has already been discussed here at length. It may have to do with the existence of videos.

I'm not sure where you're from, but I think those emotional appeals on TV are more of an American thing. IMO there is a difference, Canadians are more reserved and private, and reluctant to 'make a spectacle' of themselves, especially on TV, but even in print.

I feel very sorry for AS, because by speaking on TV as he did, he's revealed that he's personally deeply troubled and has no one else to support him. IMO more stable people don't want to emulate him.

 

[LoisLane]

The reported videos were recorded late July/early August. The murders occurred on July 14/15th and 19th.

It could also be meaning the “later” part of July. The last two weeks of the month are the the “late” part instead of the “early” part of July, the first two weeks.

 

[Jan424]

I think a public plea via the media would be the very most ineffective means of family members asking the two to surrender because it couldn’t be personalized without creating a whole lot of additional drama and sensationalism. The public wouldn’t need to be informed if they reached out through private means including voicemail or text messages or through other online communication apps. Police psychologists often assist in crafting a message in the hopes it will yield positive results.

Very true and entirely possible. As I said, we don't know any of this for sure, and I'm just speculating with the little information that we have to work with.

 

[LoisLane]

This, times over.

Also a minor point perhaps but AS was only allowed view the video at the rcmp BC Surrey headquarters, a return ferry ride away. Did this apply to all family members from PA?

I can see good reason for keeping a viewing only in person, but a local rcmp office in PA or Victoria might have achieved the same tight lid on the video. So, was there was something more regarding AS?

My guess is because his lawyer who is based in Vancouver was to be present it was more cost effective to have AS travel then for her. It is unfortunate that people with limited means would be required to endure extra costs of travel, loss of work etc for something such as this. He may have been able to view closer to home... assuming all the family members were extended a courtesy of a closer to home arrangement.

 

[raffielle]

BC RCMP headquarters are in Surrey. So I would assume that the detectives handling the case are in Surrey, if that's where they made AS go to view the video.

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By the way, I think it is highly unlikely that AS had contact with BS after leaving. He showed us the unanswered texts. He received no answer to texts sent on July 12, 13, 14, and 15. He would have said something if there was contact. His lawyer is mistaken, in my view.

I believe they viewed eh video in Surrey b/c AS is living (well was homeless/sheltered) in Vancouver now and think has been for a while - he visited BS in PA but didn't live there and I don't think he moved there since all of this - just my take.

 

[MistyWaters]

I still really wonder what they talked about during all those hours of driving.

I could see this. I actually don't think it's that weird at all that they filmed multiple videos. This is by far the most important thing they had ever been part of. And especially as part of the social media generation, they knew other people would want to know what they were thinking, what the trip was like, etc.

Do you really think they were in a frame of mind that would make their flee from police worthy of public interest?

I don’t think the videos will ever see the light of day. The attention they would garner is exactly what police forces all over the world are learning motivates some killings - the infamous notoriety involving the lives and actions of killers, created by the general public.

Think of it. Nobody other than a community of gamers, people in Port Alberni and family members knew these two existed prior to July 19th. Now people throughout the world are potentially antsy to see videos only because they killed three people. That AS allegedly told the media of the videos existence once again shines the spotlight on his “little me” by generating even more public interest, while displacing it from the tragedy involving three innocent victims who lost their lives. I can’t imagine how the victims families feel but I’m sure the ongoing focus on the adventures-by-video of B&K must make their grief and pain far more difficult.

 

[MsBetsy]

That’s true...it was startlingly raw and honest and part of what drew so many of us to this case I suspect!

I have wondered ever since though about AS’s comments about Bryer trying to escape the pain and how AS wished he could have saved him and basically saying good bye.

Maybe I’m just reading too much into a troubled and upset dad’s remarks, but at the time Bryer was still alive as far as anybody knew. He could still be helped. And what pain? ADHD? Or is AS projecting his own frustrations at life onto his son?

I wonder if Bryer's father recognized some of his own problems in his son.
Mental health disorders can be hereditary and in some cases are triggered when a child becomes an adult or a major change takes place, like going off to college or leaving high school.
I'm not saying I think that's what happened but it's possible.

I was shocked by the picture of he and his dad the summer they worked together. Bryer looked so thin and gaunt, the way he was holding himself up just seemed so odd, compared to his dad, who looked so proud. Imo

 

[Gina20]

I believe they viewed eh video in Surrey b/c AS is living (well was homeless/sheltered) in Vancouver now and think has been for a while - he visited BS in PA but didn't live there and I don't think he moved there since all of this - just my take.

I agree that he is likely based on the mainland now, and that is why he has a Vancouver lawyer.

 

[NJSleuth91]

Do you really think they were in a frame of mind that would make their flee from police worthy of public interest?

I don’t think the videos will ever see the light of day. The attention they would garner is exactly what police forces all over the world are learning motivates some killings - the infamous notoriety involving the lives and actions of killers.

Think of it. Nobody other than a community of gamers, people in Port Alberni and family members knew these two existed prior to July 19th. Now people throughout the world are potentially antsy to see videos only because they killed three people.

Regardless of whether the videos or their contents will be released -- and I think they will especially if there's a public inquiry, especially as Bryer's dad's lawyer is convinced of it and knows more about this subject than us -- Kam and Bryer must have thought the videos would be watched by someone, or they wouldn't have recorded them. Whether they meant the videos for the police, their family/friends, or the general public, who knows.

That AS allegedly told the media of the videos existence one again shines the spotlight on his “little me” by generating even more public interest, while displacing it from the tragedy involving three innocent victims who lost their lives.

I don't believe for a second that he leaked that info, because I don't believe for a second that the RCMP told him about it.

I can’t imagine how the victims families feel but I’m sure the ongoing focus on the adventures-by-video of B&K must make their grief and pain far more difficult.

Have you considered that maybe some of their loved ones want to see what was on the videos too, to get more perspective on what happened? For example the victims of the Danforth Ave shooting said the comprehensive report was very helpful to them in processing what happened and why.

 

[MistyWaters]

I believe they viewed eh video in Surrey b/c AS is living (well was homeless/sheltered) in Vancouver now and think has been for a while - he visited BS in PA but didn't live there and I don't think he moved there since all of this - just my take.

Video conferencing is so common that I’m certain AS wouldn’t be made to travel anywhere, if it wasn’t convenient. Or just because the Major Crimes Unit is centred in Surrey doesn’t mean all the officers working in that unit sit there in an office all day. We don’t know where AS was shown the video but where ever it was, I don’t recall reading it was a concern of his.

 

[Gina20]

I'm not sure where you're from, but I think those emotional appeals on TV are more of an American thing. IMO there is a difference, Canadians are more reserved and private, and reluctant to 'make a spectacle' of themselves, especially on TV, but even in print.

I feel very sorry for AS, because by speaking on TV as he did, he's revealed that he's personally deeply troubled and has no one else to support him. IMO more stable people don't want to emulate him.

No, those emotional appeals by family members happen right here in Canada. The police are usually standing beside the family members. That did not happen in this case, which makes me wonder why.

 

[MsBetsy]

I still really wonder what they talked about during all those hours of driving.

I could see this. I actually don't think it's that weird at all that they filmed multiple videos. This is by far the most important thing they had ever been part of. And especially as part of the social media generation, they knew other people would want to know what they were thinking, what the trip was like, etc.



It was said in an article that Bryer shared a video of himself pretending to masturbate to a picture of Hitler on Snapchat.

Lovely! (The last part)
Sorry, I don't know how to snip or whatever its called.

But seriously, maybe that's an indication that he really does find the act of murder thrilling.
Many serial killers have said that it was the kill itself that was arousing.

And that's all I'm going to say about that.

Imo

 

[NJSleuth91]

Lovely! (The last part)
Sorry, I don't know how to snip or whatever its called.

But seriously, maybe that's an indication that he really does find the act of murder thrilling.
Many serial killers have said that it was the kill itself that was arousing.

And that's all I'm going to say about that.

Imo

I believe he intended the Hitler thing as a joke. But as for their motives, your guess is as good as mine.

 

[MistyWaters]

Regardless of whether the videos or their contents will be released -- and I think they will especially if there's a public inquiry, especially as Bryer's dad's lawyer is convinced of it and knows more about this subject than us -- Kam and Bryer must have thought the videos would be watched by someone, or they wouldn't have recorded them. Whether they meant the videos for the police, their family/friends, or the general public, who knows.

.

Where is this notion of a public inquiry coming from? Do you have a link stating the BC Coroners Office has scheduled one and for what reason would this homicide case impact public policy in order to prevent other innocent people from being murdered? Canada’s Criminal Code already determines homicide is a crime. Changes in public policy isn’t required to confirm that.

The most recent information published by the media has not changed - an update will be provided upon the conclusion of the RCMP’s investigation.

“RCMP Sergeant Janelle Shoihet said Thursday that Mounties are still committed to providing an update on the case, “however we have no definitive plans as to what will form that update, nor when the update will be provided.”...”
B.C. men who led police on a cross-Canada manhunt filmed several videos while on the run

 

[MsBetsy]

I believe he intended the Hitler thing as a joke. But as for their motives, your guess is as good as mine.

Yes, and of course we have no idea what other videos he may have viewed or enjoyed.
It's still a very odd thing to do. Imo

 

[NJSleuth91]

Where is this notion of a public inquiry coming from? Do you have a link stating the BC Coroners Office has scheduled one and for what reason would this homicide case impact public policy in order to prevent other innocent people from being murdered by B&K?

The most recent information published by the media has not changed - an update will be provided upon the conclusion of the RCMP’s investigation.

“RCMP Sergeant Janelle Shoihet said Thursday that Mounties are still committed to providing an update on the case, “however we have no definitive plans as to what will form that update, nor when the update will be provided.”...”
B.C. men who led police on a cross-Canada manhunt filmed several videos while on the run

Bryer's dad's lawyer said she was pretty certain there would be one and she seems to have more experience and expertise with the Canadian legal system than anyone here, as far as I know. She must have a good reason for thinking that.

 

[MistyWaters]

I don't believe for a second that he leaked that info, because I don't believe for a second that the RCMP told him about it.

.

See post #347, the tweet by the G&M reporter attributing the source to AS.