TX - James, 48 & Michelle Butler, 46, driving RV to Fort Lauderdale from Corpus Christi, 14 Oct 2019

[zecats]

So they (or the perps) possibly went into town and came back?

Maybe to get gas? Supplies? Shovels? Take the cats somewhere? MOO

 

[Lilibet]

Except I'd think the truck and RV would be more circumspect on the way into the US. Searching and paperwork requirements more stringent. IMO

Are the searching and paperwork requirements particularly stringent for a “returning” U.S. citizen? I’m picturing someone who doesn’t appear to be Mexican. Fake identity and forged paperwork and it might be easy. I don’t know.

 

[cody22]

Does that mean that the truck GPS stopped working on Oct 21, or is that the last timestamp for the RV GPS? Both final vehicle GPS timestamps are on the same day?

Is there any information about where the truck was between Oct 16 and Oct 21?

Nope.....But I betcha it spent some time in San Antonio before it got word to take it across at Del Rio into Ciad Acuna. Nothing but miles of big ranch land below there. A lot of it American owned......I will never cross that border again. It is "survival of the fittest" down there any more.......moo

 

[MimosaMornings]

I surf/wade fish the beaches from Port Lavaca down south to Corpus Christi often. I will not set foot on those beaches at night without being armed. I leave my vehicles unlocked with nothing of real value in them. ....... Tackle,cooler, etc., thieves abound down there sadly....Lots of good people also, but be aware of your surroundings ....moo

About the same here, Sargent/Quintana with trips to Laguna Madre. Done some tournaments and awareness of people and your surroundings is important from what we have been told.

 

[zecats]

Are the searching and paperwork requirements particularly stringent for a “returning” U.S. citizen? I’m picturing someone who doesn’t appear to be Mexican. Fake identity and forged paperwork and it might be easy. I don’t know.

Well they are from Canada into the US so I’m guessing yes for Mexico.

 

[not.a.muggle]

Maybe to get gas? Supplies? Shovels? Take the cats somewhere? MOO

Yes, that's what I think and it's not unusual for folks to do when they're camping there. There are a couple gas stations just up the road at the intersection with Whitecap and a grocery store across the bridge in Flour Bluff.

I can't think about the cats...

 

[zecats]

Yes, that's what I think and it's not unusual for folks to do when they're camping there. There are a couple gas stations just up the road at the intersection with Whitecap and a grocery store across the bridge in Flour Bluff.

I can't think about the cats...

Breaks my heart even more to think of those poor frightened animals. It’s such a horrendously sad story.

 

[otto]

Nope.....But I betcha it spent some time in San Antonio before it got word to take it across at Del Rio into Ciad Acuna. Nothing but miles of big ranch land below there. A lot of it American owned......I will never cross that border again. It is "survival of the fittest" down there any more.......moo

So maybe a car thieving ring that works both sides of the border? It's only a 5 hour drive.

What takes 5 days in the world of vehicle theft? Why was there a 5 day delay between the murders and crossing the border?

 

[zecats]

So maybe a car thieving ring that works both sides of the border? It's only a 5 hour drive.

What takes 5 days in the world of vehicle theft? Why was there a 5 day delay between the murders and crossing the border?

View attachment 212965

If camper was seen on Oct 19 still on beach, then it’s only 2 days before leaving the area. Still 5 days after murders most likely. I agree it’s a mystery.

 

[Yesiamapirate]

So maybe a car thieving ring that works both sides of the border? It's only a 5 hour drive.

What takes 5 days in the world of vehicle theft? Why was there a 5 day delay between the murders and crossing the border?

View attachment 212965

Maybe car thieves. But what about the camper? Why not just steal the truck? Messing with 40 feet of trailer seems risky?

 

[cody22]

So maybe a car thieving ring that works both sides of the border? It's only a 5 hour drive.

What takes 5 days in the world of vehicle theft? Why was there a 5 day delay between the murders and crossing the border?

View attachment 212965

I would guess they had to take the rigs across at just the right time, with the right people on duty, on the U.S. side..... San Antonio is a big town with lots of hiding places and Cartel power....moo

 

[Yesiamapirate]

Breaks my heart even more to think of those poor frightened animals. It’s such a horrendously sad story.

Their beloved fur babies, their little home on wheels, taking them to their next adventure... their dream life. All taken from them. I can only imagine the terror and sadness in their last minutes. Heart breaking.

 

[otto]

If camper was seen on Oct 19 still on beach, then it’s only 2 days before leaving the area. Still 5 days after murders most likely. I agree it’s a mystery.

True, but the last text from them was on Oct 16. They are for all intents and purposes missing as of the last contact from them. There was activity around their vehicles after Oct 16 until Oct 19, but given what we know today, it's not a stretch to suspect that someone else could have been at their vehicles at that time.

Agree, most likely 5 days between murders and crossing the border. Mystery that must have some explanation - presumably related to vehicle theft?

 

[otto]

Maybe car thieves. But what about the camper? Why not just steal the truck? Messing with 40 feet of trailer seems risky?

Car thief with a lot of guts to steal the truck on Oct 16, come back for the RV three days later on Oct 19, and cross the border another two days later on Oct 21.

 

[otto]

I would guess they had to take the rigs across at just the right time, with the right people on duty, on the U.S. side..... San Antonio is a big town with lots of hiding places and Cartel power....moo

I'm wondering whether the 5 day delay is in any way related to who was partrolling the border crossing that day and that time.

 

[zecats]

True, but the last text from them was on Oct 16. They are for all intents and purposes missing as of the last contact from them. There was activity around their vehicles after Oct 16 until Oct 19, but given what we know today, it's not a stretch to suspect that someone else could have been at their vehicles at that time.

Agree, most likely 5 days between murders and crossing the border. Mystery that must have some explanation - presumably related to vehicle theft?

True. That and RV theft.

Here's something to consider. Seems they had been camping in the area for a few weeks, and staying at the RV park at Padre Bali Park, where they checked out on Oct 14....only to go about 3+ miles south on the same beach to camp remotely. They had to have met people at the park. Someone maybe suggested they could camp for free if they moved their camper out of the park. Could that be a link to what happened to them? Someone knowing where they went and what they were driving / pulling?

 

[not.a.muggle]

Car thief with a lot of guts to steal the truck on Oct 16, come back for the RV three days later on Oct 19, and cross the border another two days later on Oct 21.

What is this based on? They were last heard from on the 16th and RV was seen without the truck on the 19th. That doesn't necessarily mean the RV was there for three days without the truck.

 

[otto]

True. That and RV theft.

Here's something to consider. Seems they had been camping in the area for a few weeks, and staying at the RV park at Padre Bali Park, where they checked out on Oct 14....only to go about 3+ miles south on the same beach to camp remotely. They had to have met people at the park. Someone maybe suggested they could camp for free if they moved their camper out of the park. Could that be a link to what happened to them? Someone knowing where they went and what they were driving / pulling?

Vehicle GPS has last ping date and time. I'm guessing that the 2018 truck and the RV each had a GPS.

Can we find out the last ping time for the truck and the RV? Was it both on Oct 16, maybe the truck on the 16th and the RV on the 19th? Maybe the RV did not have GPS?

Camping for 2 weeks? I think that is upthread.

So they were at the RV place for 2 weeks until Oct 14, they moved farther South, near "the bowl" (3 miles South of the Bob Hall Pier)?

Something like this?

 

[otto]

True. That and RV theft.

Here's something to consider. Seems they had been camping in the area for a few weeks, and staying at the RV park at Padre Bali Park, where they checked out on Oct 14....only to go about 3+ miles south on the same beach to camp remotely. They had to have met people at the park. Someone maybe suggested they could camp for free if they moved their camper out of the park. Could that be a link to what happened to them? Someone knowing where they went and what they were driving / pulling?

If they were at the RV park and checked out on Oct 14 to go South, and were last in touch on Oct 16, three miles South where their bodies were found, are you thinking that the link has to be someone who was at their RV spot in the two week prior to Oct 14?

 

[otto]

What is this based on? They were last heard from on the 16th and RV was seen without the truck on the 19th. That doesn't necessarily mean the RV was there for three days without the truck.

Trying to understand the big picture, dates, GPS, and activity at the two camp sites from Oct 14 until Oct 19th. When they were parked with their truck and RV three miles South of the Bob Hall Pier, did several people see activity around the RV from Oct. 16 to Oct. 19th? If so, it sounds like a regular RV parking spot, so someone must have noticed some trouble at their RV - at the very least when the bodies were being moved.

OR were they parked in a deserted remote area alone at no charge? Were they inclined to take chances for a freebie?