GA - Ahmaud Arbery, 25, jogger, fatally shot by former PD and son, Brunswick, Feb 2020

[Matic]

Do you happen to know a date for that view? Wondering because that appears to maybe be the boat that was visible in two of the four previous nighttime videos.

Google Earth image date is 1/25/2019.
Whether that is accurate, idk.

 

[MsBetsy]

That's an interesting turn of phrase, "plundering around." Isn't to plunder to steal? And then English reportedly gives 2 stories, 4 days apart, stories that are completely in opposition to the other. Just waiting to see what he says under oath.

Out of curiosity, was he paid for either story? TIA

I was waiting for someone to comment on that.

Yes, plunder means to steal, usually by force and many times refers to taking over land or a town and taking the goods as spoils. It's not a word used often in modern times.

According to his lawyer English said that the man he saw in the nighttime videos didn't look like Arbery and in the report he gave police he said the man did not take anything. I think he is referring to those images, where he said he saw him four times. It seems more likely that he was 'rummaging' around as opposed to plundering.

Anyway, I don't think that's the same person as the one we saw in the first video, which does look like Arbery. The man in the nighttime video looks to be light skinned, taller, and thinner. He also said that when he saw a picture of Arbery he did not think he looked like the man in the video and he told that to a neighbor. So if it does go to trial the neighbor can testify.

I don't think he told two stories, since the report he made to police is consistent with him saying he never used the word burglary and was never robbed.

It was Barnhill, in my opinion, who said there was fishing equipment stolen. There is no quote from English that I can find indicating that he was robbed or had anything stolen from him. The only quote I have found is the one where he offered his condolences to the family.

And, no, I doubt he was paid for a story. As far as I can tell, he only answered questions in the Washington Post.

He is reportedly severely ill and said he was not planning to finish construction on his home. I'm not sure he will be well enough to testify if it comes to that.

Imo

 

[MsBetsy]

What information did Barnhill include? Sorry, I'm trying to catch up. TIA

He (reportedly) said that there was fishing equipment stolen from the home but there was no police report filed. Imo

 

[Satchie]

My post was in response to the post regarding the person who recorded the video - IMO, he was part of the hunt with the two others. He blocked him with his vehicle.
-----
@GBI_GA
Director Reynolds: We are investigating everybody involved including William Bryan, the third man who filmed the video of the shooting, tried to block Ahmaud Arbery with his own vehicle, and who has not been charged.

I agree, for most people, if they had no part of it and were enraged at the lack of arrest, IMO they would have released the video sooner, if only for the money. I don't think we know the actual circumstances of how the video came to be released, those circumstances will explain everything.

What I think is that Bryan's lawyer is telling him he will be going to jail if he doesn't insist that he had no part in this killing. He is scared of going to jail and is doing and saying exactly what his lawyer tells him: which is to keep his mouth shut except to say these exact words about "justice to the family" and let the lawyer do all the talking. The lawyer is being very slippery and you can see the CNN interviewer getting impatient at how the lawyer is using every tactic he can to try to divert attention away from what his client was doing there recording the video.

 

[Matic]

I was waiting for someone to comment on that.

Yes, plunder means to steal, usually by force and many times refers to taking over land or a town and taking the goods as spoils. It's not a word used often in modern times.

According to his lawyer English said that the man he saw in the nighttime videos didn't look like Arbery and in the report he gave police he said the man did not take anything. I think he is referring to those images, where he said he saw him four times. It seems more likely that he was 'rummaging' around as opposed to plundering.

Anyway, I don't think that's the same person as the one we saw in the first video, which does look like Arbery. The man in the nighttime video looks to be light skinned, taller, and thinner. He also said that when he saw a picture of Arbery he did not think he looked like the man in the video and he told that to a neighbor. So if it does go to trial the neighbor can testify.

I don't think he told two stories, since the report he made to police is consistent with him saying he never used the word burglary and was never robbed.

It was Barnhill, in my opinion, who said there was fishing equipment stolen. There is no quote from English that I can find indicating that he was robbed or had anything stolen from him. The only quote I have found is the one where he offered his condolences to the family.

And, no, I doubt he was paid for a story. As far as I can tell, he only answered questions in the Washington Post.

He is reportedly severely ill and said he was not planning to finish construction on his home. I'm not sure he will be well enough to testify if it comes to that.

Imo

I agree that that doesn't look like AA in the nite time vid.
He also has what looks to be partial or full sleeve tats. Not AA IMHO.

 

[Reasonable & Just]

I agree.
Like just hemming him up and trying to slow him down without actually touching him until the police showed up.

What exactly do you think they had in mind if I may ask?

Could be so many things. Sexual assault. Beating. Drowning. Hanging. Strangling. Websleuths has many examples of what can happen to joggers who are accosted by aggressive people.

If they were going to do what you suggested, why not just track him home or keep an eye on him while he ran until the police got there and could interrupt his jog? But really, why do it at all, since he doesn't match the suspect description? Doesn't sound like they had good intentions. JMO.

 

[MsBetsy]

Sounds like a play on words or a mistake for "blundering around."

That sounds more like it. The man in the earlier (nighttime) videos looks like he has a unique type of swagger, but a little clumsy or awkward. It was the first thing I noticed. He has a different demeanor than the person in the daytime video, which is thought to be Arbery. Imo

 

[SharonNeedles]

IMO: The fact that Senior was on the phone even after the the first shot was fired could clarify his intention.

 

[Reasonable & Just]

IMO: The fact that Senior was on the phone even after the the first shot was fired could clarify his intention.

Or, he was hoping Mr. Arbery would submit to them accosting him, maybe allow himself to be removed to another location. When Mr. Arbery was not submissive and things went sideways, Mr. M. Sr had to control the optics. Other people might have heard the shot, and he had already had contact with the police.

 

[Hope4More]

Hadn't seen an overhead view of how close the houses are on Satillo dr but it looks
as though they are very close with just a small strip between the houses.

4 houses in between, with big front yards full of trees & driveways with parked big 'ole trucks = no line of sight. Looking at a street level, not overhead view gives a more accurate sense of what was possible.

 

[oviedo]

Or, he was hoping Mr. Arbery would submit to them accosting him, maybe allow himself to be removed to another location. When Mr. Arbery was not submissive and things went sideways, Mr. M. Sr had to control the optics. Other people might have heard the shot, and he had already had contact with the police.

How in the world did they think this was ok??? I just cannot understand this level of violence without provocation
JMO

 

[zencompass]

This investigation will be absolutely thorough, in my opinion, especially given the national (and international) exposure to this case.

They have likely already amassed quite a bit of evidence, especially data from cell phones and the bodycam from the first officer arriving at the scene. I imagine they'll have a lengthy list of witnesses as well to interview.

 

[Boxer]

How in the world did they think this was ok??? I just cannot understand this level of violence without provocation
JMO

I think the most of public suspects why they thought it was ok.

 

[Hope4More]

Not on point for a bunch of different reasons, imo. But, ultimately, asserting a defense that "the victim was known to be violent" to justify attacking him with a baseball bat is completely different from asserting a defense that AA "attempted to take McMichael's gun" and therefore their actions were reasonable under the circumstances -- which is what the defendants in this case are saying.

From the link:

At trial, the State stipulated to Carter's introduction into evidence of a police report that charged the murder victim, Edwards, with aggravated assault. The police report stated that Edwards and another man had once chased an individual whom they believed had burglarized the other man's home, and assaulted the individual with a baseball bat. Carter intended the evidence to support his justification defense by showing Edward's purported propensity for violence. In response, the State contended that Edwards had not assaulted anyone, but rather had merely effectuated a citizen's arrest. At the State's request, the trial court gave a jury charge on citizen's arrest.

Even though slight evidence is enough to justify the giving of a jury charge,[12] we conclude there was not sufficient evidentiary support in this case to warrant the trial court's charge on citizen's arrest. Although a private person may make a citizen's arrest under OCGA § 17-4-60, only force that is reasonable under the circumstances may be used to restrain the individual arrested.[13] Certainly under the facts that were recounted in the police report, Edward's alleged assault of the individual with a baseball bat entailed the use of unreasonable force, and could not have been part of a legitimate citizen's arrest. Accordingly, the trial court erred by charging the jury on citizen's arrest. However, in light of the overwhelming evidence of Carter's guilt, there is no reasonable likelihood that the erroneous charge lessened the State's burden to prove all essential elements of the crimes charged beyond a reasonable doubt, and therefore the error was harmless.[14]

There's very little I enjoy more than discussing/debating the law. . Even when there isn't much or even any agreement to be had.

The citation is exactly on point about citizen's arrests in GA, and one basis- unreasonable force- the Supreme Court has indicated disqualifies a defendant using the c.arrest as justification. Which was my point in citing the ruling.

The MM's defense won't make it to round 2- what they did the 3rd time they confronted AA, and if they can claim self defense, if the State makes the case their very pursuit of AA was illegal.

 

[Matic]

4 houses in between, with big front yards full of trees & driveways with parked big 'ole trucks = no line of sight. Looking at a street level, not overhead view gives a more accurate sense of what was possible.

I highly disagree.
Street view uses a magnified, fish eye camera lens. That's why everything looks longer. Including the houses and front yards.

 

[oviedo]

I highly disagree.
Street view uses a magnified, fish eye camera lens. That's why everything looks longer. Including the houses and front yards.

We need a local sleuther to drive down that street -IMO

 

[Blondie in Spokane]

Seeing M Sr. standing in the back of that truck, gun readied, is absolutely frightening. They had AA trapped and he had to be terrified. Whatever their intentions were, AA had no choices left, nowhere to escape to. He was at their mercy and we all know where/what that led to.

I really hate this case but can’t stay away.

 

[MsBetsy]

Really? There we plenty of opportunities to take a shot. Why wait until Arbery has his hands on the weapon?

Maybe because at that point they thought they would be justified in shooting and killing him.

They were the instigators in this crime. They provoked him by chasing him down with a weapon. They had no cause to believe that deadly force was necessary to stop him from committing a crime.

Basically, they provoked him to attack with the intention of using a deadly weapon in response. That is not self defense.

Imo

 

[GoBuckeyes]

I'm not too worried...they had a nice long run from justice up to this point, and they seem to have some connections and sympathizers. I just wish they had shown the same concern for poor Mr. Arbery's legal rights.

We should all be worried if they can't get a fair trial, even those who've, in their minds, already hung 'em high. It's their constitutional right to a fair trial. We can't apply that only when it's convenient or feels right under the circumstances. AMOO

 

[GoBuckeyes]

I was waiting for someone to comment on that.

Yes, plunder means to steal, usually by force and many times refers to taking over land or a town and taking the goods as spoils. It's not a word used often in modern times.

According to his lawyer English said that the man he saw in the nighttime videos didn't look like Arbery and in the report he gave police he said the man did not take anything. I think he is referring to those images, where he said he saw him four times. It seems more likely that he was 'rummaging' around as opposed to plundering.

Anyway, I don't think that's the same person as the one we saw in the first video, which does look like Arbery. The man in the nighttime video looks to be light skinned, taller, and thinner. He also said that when he saw a picture of Arbery he did not think he looked like the man in the video and he told that to a neighbor. So if it does go to trial the neighbor can testify.

I don't think he told two stories, since the report he made to police is consistent with him saying he never used the word burglary and was never robbed.

It was Barnhill, in my opinion, who said there was fishing equipment stolen. There is no quote from English that I can find indicating that he was robbed or had anything stolen from him. The only quote I have found is the one where he offered his condolences to the family.

And, no, I doubt he was paid for a story. As far as I can tell, he only answered questions in the Washington Post.

He is reportedly severely ill and said he was not planning to finish construction on his home. I'm not sure he will be well enough to testify if it comes to that.

Imo

I had not heard that he is ill. That's very sad. Do you have a link? TIA