Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom arrested* #43

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But we don't know this, do we? I do follow the train of thought that involving Chad into the burials (if nothing else) makes his ties stronger to Lori AND puts pressure on Chad to 'deal' with Tammy (for want of a better word). I do think that murder charges against Lori, will be forth coming, and soon. My worry is that the charges they are currently holding Lori on will no longer be relevant and that they will be dropped. Perhaps a crim lawyer can chime in here? @AZlawyer

I don’t practice criminal law, except very occasionally to give advice on a criminal appeal issue. But I fully expect new charges against LVD that will more closely match the facts developed through investigation, probably before the preliminary hearing.
 
I haven't seen anything about her treating the kids badly. I have read comments that Annie made about tension between Lori and Tylee (not unusual with a teen) and about Lori's state of mind. We can all infer all sorts of things (and routinely do!) but I have yet to hear/see any specific examples of mistreating the kids prior to murdering them.
How about extreme neglect? A child goes missing for weeks and no one notices? There's an astonishing lack of involvement from adults in their lives.
This child was erased long before she went missing IMO.
Then there's total lack of empathy, withholding medication, selling a service dog...
 
Is this different than the one before?

Shane Bishop
@shanebishop

This just in: FBI releases new photo of Tylee, JJ and Alex Cox in Yellowstone National Pakr on last day Tylee was known to be alive.

https://twitter.com/shanebishop/status/1275115223326720001
Yes. Much clearer and more flattering for Tylee. Here's the original:
vallow-park2.jpg
 
Monday 6/22/2020 sitting in jail waiting more charges fo be filed..

VINELink

CHAD GUY DAYBELL
Court Record
Age51
GenderMale
ID: Fremont County Courthouse
Case NumberCR22200755
Case StatusOpen

VINELink

LORI NORENE VALLOW
Court Record
Age46
ID: Madison County Courthouse
Case NumberCR33200302
Case StatusOpen
Good eye @Ohmeohmy!

If I was a gambler, my money would be on charges relating to the deaths of TR, JV, TD and/or AxC.

As for AxC, his death certificate can be changed based on additional information obtained after the autopsy (ie additional testing).
 
Is this different than the one before?

Shane Bishop
@shanebishop

This just in: FBI releases new photo of Tylee, JJ and Alex Cox in Yellowstone National Pakr on last day Tylee was known to be alive.

https://twitter.com/shanebishop/status/1275115223326720001

Yes, it is different. My question is why did the FBI release the new photo today? The 11 page affidavit of probable cause was released Friday evening and today a new photo. They’re trying to accomplish something with these releases.

And I really want to smack that big grin off of Alex’s face.
 
JMO, but very little (of what little I know) that Chad taught was original to him at all. It is all pretty much "scriptural".

The word "zombie", of course, is not scriptural per se, but the word alludes to "the walking dead", and scripture does speak of the "spiritually dead".

I would be curious as to who introduced the term "zombie" into these teachings. It is not "scriptural", very dehumanizing and I believe, meant to be sensational and scary.

"The term comes from Haitian folklore, in which a zombie is a dead body reanimated through various methods, most commonly magic."
Zombie - Wikipedia
Good point. I actually just finished writing a YA novel about the Haitian tradition of zombification by anthropologist and researcher Wade Davis. Zombification is actually a cultural & religious experience, however, it has no connection to the Christian Bible. And in Haitian history is was not considered evil or dark. It was a source used to help a person or a family. It was George Romero who created the image of a flesh-eating zombie we have today - making the idea of real zombie's scary. In my earlier post when I said he did his research, I meant he explored other religions to put his puzzle together. However as much as I know about REAL/HISTORICAL zombies, I would still be concerned if my friend told me her kids where zombies. It would set off alarms in my eyes, of course, MOO
 
I don’t practice criminal law, except very occasionally to give advice on a criminal appeal issue. But I fully expect new charges against LVD that will more closely match the facts developed through investigation, probably before the preliminary hearing.

I respect your opinion but I don't expect charges until after the preliminary hearing. There certainly is no rush to upgrade the charges and the recent developments in the case have almost certainly shaken up a great number of people who otherwise would have hidden behind the chimera that the kids might be all right. This must be a VERY fertile time for investigation and I would expect there is a great deal of anxiety and worry among those who associated with Chad and/or Lori. My guess is there are detectives knocking on doors all over the place now and the information they uncover should be useful for framing the eventual charges.
 
You're post got me thinking. It's been said here on WS that certain toxins or poisons are difficult to detect after embalmment or time, especially if you don't know what you're looking for. If they can find a cause of death from the remains of JJ who's body was found intact and not embalmed or burned, perhaps they can then use that information to focus on specific trace elements in the deaths of the others. With that, if the method of murder was the m.o. of the murderers, wouldn't it be something if they can also find or perhaps even by now, already found these substances in someone's house, apartment, barn, or car?
How awesome would it be if JJ solves this crime!
 
The court has a hearing scheduled now for July 1. At least one of the parties has let the court know they would prefer more time (most likely the defense, by my guess) and the court has announced it will be amenable to moving the hearing to August, but only if both sides agree to the continuance in writing. The court does not want to continue the hearing and have one of the sides complain about the new setting or claim unavailability. This is how the court puts pressure on the parties to agree to the continuance. If they don't agree it will go forward as scheduled for July.
Thank you!! I read it thinking I understood but then realized, I was still confused. Thanks for the law lesson, very much appreciated!
 
Yes, it is different. My question is why did the FBI release the new photo today? The 11 page affidavit of probable cause was released Friday evening and today a new photo. They’re trying to accomplish something with these releases.

And I really want to smack that big grin off of Alex’s face.
I’m wondering that too.. did they recover it from someone’s iCloud account ? Separate from the last pic we saw? Sending a message about what info they have?
 
I had the same reaction to the Raccoon shooting as well. First of all I have never seen a adult raccoon in the middle of the day, and I live in Colorado where we have many (although I do understand it’s not unheard of). Why murder an innocent animal? Makes no sense!
CD wanted to be with a hot blonde and feel like a king. He didn’t want anyone blowing his cover like a strong minded teen. He wanted to live in paradise and start a new life. LV wanted the same thing. These people give religion a bad name because they used it to get what they really wanted which had nothing to do with God or church. CD is a narcissist who wanted to be god himself. I think he made it up as he went along and found a lot of reference material that helped support his fictional tale.

Thanks, Queasy! Great reply!
 
Maybe I'm not supposed to comment on appearance, but has anyone else felt that gurus/cult leaders—especially the ones with a lot of women followers—are exceptionally frumpy? What's with that? I don't get the appeal at all.
But for every Jim Jones or Chad Daybell you have a David Miscavige or a Tony Robbins, so I dunno if the stereotype holds. These folks, regardless of how they look, or perhaps in some cases because of how they look, have mastered certain psychological techniques to bring people into their orbit. JMO
 
Good point. I actually just finished writing a YA novel about the Haitian tradition of zombification by anthropologist and researcher Wade Davis. Zombification is actually a cultural & religious experience, however, it has no connection to the Christian Bible. And in Haitian history is was not considered evil or dark. It was a source used to help a person or a family. It was George Romero who created the image of a flesh-eating zombie we have today - making the idea of real zombie's scary. In my earlier post when I said he did his research, I meant he explored other religions to put his puzzle together. However as much as I know about REAL/HISTORICAL zombies, I would still be concerned if my friend told me her kids where zombies. It would set off alarms in my eyes, of course, MOO

I read Wade Davis' book The Serpent and The Rainbow years ago. I seem to remember something, too, written about using poison from a certain toad, the poison being similar to the poison from puffer fish, that was used for zombification.
 
As far as Chad's beliefs, that zombies/"dark" people need to be gotten rid of, when did Chad learn about these beliefs? IMO, it seems like if he believed in it, there would have been deaths before CV (like before he even met Lori). It just seems odd, as far as we know, that these killings started with CV via AxC. Again, JMO.
Snipped for focus.

I think there's been other answers to this, but too many posts on zombies to go searching. And it's all just speculation.

Certainly the ideas about zombies are no longer just in the realm of B movies, they are now in the forefront of pop culture. In particular, there is a popular genre of fiction and movies about the 'zombie apocalypse', telling stories about civilization collapsing due to the mass rising of the dead as zombies. Zombie apocalypse - Wikipedia

I find it very interesting that the US Centre for Disease Control used the scenario of a zombie apocalypis as a tongue-in-cheek way to get people to prepare for real disasters (earthquakes, hurricanes, pandemics...). IMO anyone into doomsday scenarios and prepping must have come across this (tongue-in-cheek) but mainstream, scientific interest in zombies. https://www.cbc.ca/radio/whitecoat/...ead-to-teach-emergency-preparedness-1.4618330
 
This will not be popular, but MOO:
I’ve been wondering whether Alex was haunted by the kids’ murders & what was done to Tylee especially after. Whether the horror of it began to break through whatever hold CD & LV had over him, through the conditioning. Maybe he truly loved his niece & nephew, and maybe he sincerely believed what those two said about their souls being stuck in Limbo & their deaths being the only way to free them. (I’m far more skeptical about LV believing this.) But maybe he couldn’t deal afterwards. Maybe the reason his visit to CD’s was so much briefer for JJ & that JJ didn’t receive the same treatment post-mortem was that AC couldn’t do that again.

Maybe his additional visits to CD’s that month were to try to talk through what he was feeling. Maybe he could mentally deal with TD & JR & CV because they were adults, adults he wasn’t close to, adults he could more readily believe LV & CD’s stories about. But the kids were different.

Maybe it was getting worse over time, and he was married off to ZP so a true believer could watch over him. Maybe he ended his own life because he couldn’t deal with it...or maybe they were afraid he would talk and used ZP to take him out.

I’m not in any way exonerating him in my mind; I’m just looking at him from a different perspective - that of an easily influenced cult member who feels ostracized by their society for who he is, who is thus manipulated into carrying out the will of the leader(s) because they know how to make him do what they want.

JMO / pure speculation
 
How about extreme neglect? A child goes missing for weeks and no one notices? There's an astonishing lack of involvement from adults in their lives.
This child was erased long before she went missing IMO.
Then there's total lack of empathy, withholding medication, selling a service dog...
MOO That's right, killing these kids was a long and cruel process. Taking a teen girl from her friends and withering her support network and having zero future plans, till no one apparently got worried and took action except the grandparents.
 
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