Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *Arrests* #51

[887sMtreme]

I't would make more sense to dig the hole, put the body in it and then burn it in the hole. More concealed that way. Except Prior asked the FBI guy if they found ash in the hole and he said no. MOO.
Edit by me

That’s true, but if the body could have been buried deeply, six feet under as it were, why burn it at all? In a gruesome way, I can see why dismemberment might have made sense for clandestine transport, but why burning after that fact? Was there something in the twisted Vallow/Daybell universe that made burning Tylee essential, even if it wasn’t completed? The evil in this is so horrifying. I can’t believe we’re trying to ascribe reason to any of it, yet here we are.

 

[Forever Young]

Thank you for sharing your insight into Chad’s personality.

I started to figure it out after the weird thing he wrote in my yearbook, telling me who I should be friends with. I didn't really see it until December 2019.

So you're saying that Chad was never a true believing Mormon? Yet, he raised his children that way.

I was thinking he was immersed in the faith, and that was the structure for his life. It is how he came off to just about everyone else who has given a statement as to their personal knowledge of Chad, not just me.

I was thinking that for Chad, it was all about exaltation in the Celestial World. I mentioned earlier today that if true that he thought he could not be divorced, he certainly would not think he could murder his wife and maintain his exaltation.

Lori, on the other hand, married outside the church right off the bat, and there are a string of court documents that say there were plenty of people who saw her as anything but a good LDS girl.

Don't get me wrong. I think they have him hook, line, and sinker on the conspiracy to conceal. Just not sure about actually masterminding, committing or ordering anyone's murder. It just seems to me that it would be dumb to tell people he saw Tammy dying young and then murder her, if he was that smart at hiding his true intentions.

But we will see how it all plays out. This is just how the story appears to me as an outsider trying to make the pieces fit. MOO

 

[Forever Young]

Perhaps. But murder is also grounds for losing one's temple recommend, and they didn't let that stop them.

And speaking of temples, they also claimed to have been married together up to seven times before in previous lives. And supposedly they also performed some super secret clandestine (and illegitimate) temple sealing together while in Arizona. If they truly believed and acted upon either of these things then in their own minds they could easily justify all that goes with a marital relationship, even as they were still married to other people.

They certainly felt comfortable and intimate with each other enough to be sending dancing videos, holding hands, kissing, slapping butts, and other displays of affection in public... even as Tammy was still alive. Whether or not there was physical adultery going on is irrelevant - they were clearly already committing emotional and spiritual adultery with each other. What is that scripture about looking on a woman to lust after her and commiting adultery in one's heart? MOO.

President Jimmy Carter, the Southern Baptist, quoted it from the Bible. It is Matthew 5:27-28

 

[Onsdag]

And HS as well, talked about it quite a bit.

Yes. Almost forgot. There certainly are a great number of rabbit holes directly or indirectly associated with this group isn't there?

 

[887sMtreme]

<snipped for focus>
Perhaps they were binding, gagging, and suffocating JJ in the garage or in some kind of enclosed storage or crawl space which opens to the back garage wall.

Lori “always had a plan.” Alex had managed to calm JJ down that night. With his medication, maybe? Was he already dead when he revealed him to Melanie and DW before putting him to bed? I don’t know that a great deal of struggling had to take place, though what little I’ve read about the frantic use of duct tape On the poor child suggests something ghastly along those lines.

 

[BeckyF]

Duplicate

 

[Redvines86]

So you're saying that Chad was never a true believing Mormon? Yet, he raised his children that way.

I was thinking he was immersed in the faith, and that was the structure for his life. It is how he came off to just about everyone else who has given a statement as to their personal knowledge of Chad, not just me.

I was thinking that for Chad, it was all about exaltation in the Celestial World. I mentioned earlier today that if true that he thought he could not be divorced, he certainly would not think he could murder his wife and maintain his exaltation.

Lori, on the other hand, married outside the church right off the bat, and there are a string of court documents that say there were plenty of people who saw her as anything but a good LDS girl.

Don't get me wrong. I think they have him hook, line, and sinker on the conspiracy to conceal. Just not sure about actually masterminding, committing or ordering anyone's murder. It just seems to me that it would be dumb to tell people he saw Tammy dying young and then murder her, if he was that smart at hiding his true intentions.

But we will see how it all plays out. This is just how the story appears to me as an outsider trying to make the pieces fit. MOO

Absolutely, positively, not only not a believing Mormon, but not a believer in God. Yes, he wanted people to believe he was a believer, that's how this works. Everyone I have talked to, friends, family, etc., believe it was a charade to get power and fame, and Chad certainly did not believe there was an actual, real Celestial Kingdom. He had to act like a Mormon, of course, for his plans to play out. Other serial killers have done the same thing. He was the mastermind behind at least three murders. What did he get? Look at that smile on his face in the Hawaii wedding photos. Btw, you can get divorced as a Mormon, there are people in my family that have and they're just fine church standing wise. It is complicated and confusing, many people have been taken in by the masks serial killers wear. MOO

 

[ab-initio]

Whereas I believe that Chad introduced the idea that the children were already "dead" and to release them they had to be murdered.

Absolutely the impression I get.

 

[SouthernMom]

Whereas I believe that Chad introduced the idea that the children were already "dead" and to release them they had to be murdered.

This is the reason I think Chad is more in control than he would have people believe. I truly believe these two were each their own brand of evil and the combination of the two of them was devastating. As MG put it, like gasoline and fire.

 

[acutename]

I have a theory about this and I don't think it will be popular.

I do not think that Chad knew of any plan to kill Tylee. I suspect that either Alex or Lori turned up with Tylees body and he was in too deep to refuse. At that time, IMO, Tammy was Chads 'safe place' and IMO the text he sent Tammy was so out of the ordinary, it conveys his shock at what had happened. He needed to touch base with something real, to make sense of it (or not).

If you think about it logically, there was no reason to text Tammy at all. Chad didn't need to text her about the Racoon, nor burning the tree limbs and by the account of the FBI agent, this text and the content of it, was out of the ordinary. If Chad was normally Mr Chatty via text, then there would be similar text content on the phone.

What I don't understand, is the need to burn Tylee. I wonder who thought of that?

CD is really a cipher to me. unlike LV(D) he does not have a closet full of exes and all his children were born of TD (as far as we know). He was an author; not a "doer." it almost seems as if LV(D) ran with his theories and he was dragged along in the undertow... I wonder if he understands himself what he did and what happened. IMO.

 

[Kimmer]

That’s true, but if the body could have been buried deeply, six feet under as it were, why burn it at all? In a gruesome way, I can see why dismemberment might have made sense for clandestine transport, but why burning after that fact? Was there something in the twisted Vallow/Daybell universe that made burning Tylee essential, even if it wasn’t completed? The evil in this is so horrifying. I can’t believe we’re trying to ascribe reason to any of it, yet here we are.

The detective should have said no ash but plenty of burned bones and flesh that was scraped up and put in the body bag. I know we need defense attorneys but when they can't fight the facts so they just fight the investigators its maddening.

 

[Dontknow?]

Chad had plenty of chances if he was led by Lori to kill. He was sneaking behind CV's and Lori's marriage, with Lori. He knew Charles died and how. He knew Tylee disappeared at the least. He knew JJ was no longer around. He knew they came investigating about BB's event. He knew Tammy was shot at with something. He knew 11/26 what was going on but he chose booking it to HI and living the temporary dream with Lori. These two were depraved and didn't care who paid for their last big party. Unbelievable to say the least. RIP Tylee, JJ, Charles, Tammy. Alex is probably involved deeply but I guess I should say RIP to him also from being in this horrible web of evil. jmo

 

[Clair Louise]

Chad had plenty of chances if he was led by Lori to kill. He was sneaking behind CV's and Lori's marriage, with Lori. He knew Charles died and how. He knew Tylee disappeared at the least. He knew JJ was no longer around. He knew they came investigating about BB's event. He knew Tammy was shot at with something. He knew 11/26 what was going on but he chose booking it to HI and living the temporary dream with Lori. These two were depraved and didn't care who paid for their last big party. Unbelievable to say the least. RIP Tylee, JJ, Charles, Tammy. Alex is probably involved deeply but I guess I should say RIP to him also from being in this horrible web of evil. jmo

I totally agree.

 

[Kimmer]

Chad had plenty of chances if he was led by Lori to kill. He was sneaking behind CV's and Lori's marriage, with Lori. He knew Charles died and how. He knew Tylee disappeared at the least. He knew JJ was no longer around. He knew they came investigating about BB's event. He knew Tammy was shot at with something. He knew 11/26 what was going on but he chose booking it to HI and living the temporary dream with Lori. These two were depraved and didn't care who paid for their last big party. Unbelievable to say the least. RIP Tylee, JJ, Charles, Tammy. Alex is probably involved deeply but I guess I should say RIP to him also from being in this horrible web of evil. jmo

He also knew that the backseat and spare tire of CV jeep were removed and placed in the storage unit, and I believe he also knew there was an attempt on BB he also knew how much money LD was bringing in monthly from both of her kids dads being dead, so saying he knew nothing is not something I am buying no matter who is selling it.

 

[Clair Louise]

He also knew that the backseat and spare tire of CV jeep were removed and placed in the storage unit, and I believe he also knew there was an attempt on JR he also knew how much money LD was bringing in monthly from both of her kids dads being dead, so saying he knew nothing is not something I am buying no matter who is selling it.

How much would she have been getting for the kids from SS? Just a guess will do.

 

[Kimmer]

How much would she have been getting for the kids from SS? Just a guess will do.

The number I heard was a total of 6000 a month and that was with SS from JR to Tylee and SS for JJ from CV as well as benefits for JJ thru SSI for his medical condition and I would also guess food stamps for the kids since she doesn't seem to like to work unless it working on a plan to off people that she can benefit from.

 

[Colorado303]

I don’t know. There were posters who kept up with past cases for Juan Martinez’s convictions during the Jodi Arias trial. He was the DA and he was amazing.

I was hoping the DA was playing dumb since it was a preliminary or maybe he was too sure of himself since he knows how much evidence he now has. Either way, I agree with you. He did not come across very well spoken or convincing.

Wasn’t there something filed a couple of months ago saying the state’s attorney/prosecutor’s office would be assisting in the prosecution of Lori (and possibly Chad). If that’s the case is it possible Woods will be replaced after the preliminary hearing just as Judge Eddins was?

I’m going to miss Eddins. Wood, not so much. I don’t think he did a bad job per se, but he lacks charisma. And a charismatic presence is a huge plus if jurors are going to be watching you day in and day out for weeks.

That said, it’s possible Woods viewed the preliminary hearing as an actor would a “table read” and didn’t want to demonstrate his presence before necessary. Perhaps a whole different Woods will show up when it’s not rehearsal. If he remains as the first chair prosecutor I sure hope so!

 

[Colorado303]

I think Prior is going to have to take the "confuse 'em" tact, because there really isn't any alternate narrative he can present (in which CD is completely innocent and was ignorant of the bodies in his yard) that makes any sort of sense.

Yep, I don’t think the “my client is more stupid than you can possibly imagine” defense is going to fly.

 

[Colorado303]

Before the hearing, having never seen or heard DW personally, I had a very different mental image of him. From things MG intimated about him he seemed to be the intelligent and very well reasoned type, able to convince her that she had been manipulated and deceived by Chad and Lori, point out scriptures that refuted their teachings, and convince her that she needed to go to the police with what she knew.

However, during his testimony I saw a completely different person. He seemed rather naive, unknowing and inexperienced with manipulation and deception (e.g. JP seemed to be taking advantage of him and carefully manipulating him to get the testimony he wanted), and rather child-like. He also seemed to struggle with understanding what was said or being asked of him. It was clear he had a hearing impairment, and I'm certain that had an influence, but it also seemed like it went beyond that, as though he was also struggling with somewhat diminished mental faculties.

Let me be clear, I don't say any of this to be mean or judgemental, just that he came across as having some challenges he is dealing with. I say this because I believe Chad also saw his weaknesses and tried to take advantage of them himself. I don't know how much or to what extent, but he had been pulled in to this group to some degree and Chad had at least tried to convince him to buy the property nearby. I believe Chad is still trying to exercise an influence over him. At the beginning of JP's cross examination you can see Chad look at DW and give a couple of slight nods of the head, as if encouraging him. Later, when JP asks if there are three bedrooms in Lori's townhome, you again see Chad look up at DW, smile, and give a barely perceptible nod or two, whereupon DW answers "yes" and Chad looks down again. A bit later and JP asks DW if he is aware of Chad's writings, and Chad again makes eye contact with him and nods, DW asks JP to repeat the question and as he does so Chad breaks eye contact to look downward and tilts his head upward in an apparent look of grandiose piety. And then at the end when JP thanked him Chad again looked at DW and nodded his head vigorously in approval.

I don't know if it's all some kind of coaching, influencing effort, manipulation, attempt at befriending him like "You did good and I'm on your side" type of thing, or what, but it did strike me as noteworthy as I can't recall observing Chad doing the like with any other witnesses. JMO.

I felt the same way watching DW. He reminded me of family members in early stage of alzheimers. And this is the guy Melanie spoke so highly of and left her husband and children for? MG seems to have lots more going for her than you’d expect from someone who chooses to throw away their family for him. I don’t think there’s anything evil or wrong w/DW, in fact he’s probably a fine man. But I can’t help but wonder if she chose him primarily for his assets and life insurance policy.

After seeing Melanie testify at the prelim hearing my opinion of her improved. And when DW took the stand I became more suspicious of her than ever before.

MOO

 

[Clair Louise]

The number I heard was a total of 6000 a month and that was with SS from JR to Tylee and SS for JJ from CV as well as benefits for JJ thru SSI for his medical condition and I would also guess food stamps for the kids since she doesn't seem to like to work unless it working on a plan to off people that she can benefit from.

That is very liveable, even in Hawaii.