OH Pike Co., 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #57

[Loomis124]

Sorry to be so vague. I have been uncertain how to approach this without it coming off in an unintended way.

That state shared that Angela threatened to kill Tabby and she hid until she got away and never went back.

If the defense can show pictures of her at Defiance Farms or Flying W in recent years, my opinion is "never" isn't accurate. She would have been comfortable enough to come around and her mom was comfortable enough working for the Wagners.

It's just my opinion and how I would see it. I would start to second guess what are the absolutes and what are exaggerations from the State. The same way I would question them in my mind from the defense.

As I reread this, it is my belief that the defense could really care less what the State said about whether or not Tabitha ever went back there or not. IMO, the State nor the Defense is concerned about the word "never" used in a way that has nothing to do directly with the murders. JMO Cool Cats nailed it in an earlier post. The importance of the statement was that Tabitha ran for her life after Angie threatened to kill her, and she never returned to LIVE there again. Thanks, JMO.

 

[Loomis124]

Charlie never gave up, he made a promise to the families and thank God he kept it. He may have bent, but he never broke. Much respect to him for all the hours he spent on this case, the tears he shed, and the sleepless nights he endured.



Charlie's words to the families:

“We’re done for now. Rejoice. You’ve got justice for now,’” Reader told the families.

But then, mindful of what is ahead, he told them to "be ready for the long road of prosecuting these cases, listening to the awful details and facing the difficult reality of what really happened inside those four rural homes."


Arrests in Rhoden case lift weight from Pike County sheriff

I feel so badly for Charlie, who gave all he had, heart and soul, and it has nearly destroyed him. I cannot imagine what he saw and has suffered.

 

[Johnny B Bad]

I feel so badly for Charlie, who gave all he had, heart and soul, and it has nearly destroyed him. I cannot imagine what he saw and has suffered.

Someone we haven’t talked about is James Manleys, Jake tried to act like his friend and the whole time he was talking to JM the Wagners was setting JM up to take the blame for the family murders, I think the reason the GPS tracker was put on JM’s truck was to keep track of JM to make sure he didn’t kill the Wagners, JMO, Charles Reader said in his interview when the Wagners where arrested that the Wagners told lie after lie

 

[Dudly]

Oh my I have done something wrong on this post. I was trying to reply but completely messed it up. Sorry.
Jmo completely agree with you Betty, none of them deserved this. One thing I do wonder about did the state mean crj was asleep prior and then hid behind or beside the bed after he heard something? That was a little confusing because they said the other victims didn’t hear due to silencer but reports was he had at least sec to try to hide. And reports of one dropped call coming from the house.
But there again the reports could be wrong, but it did take a while to find him according to lm. I may just be confused on this part.

It is unknown why or how CRjr got between the bed and wall, to us anyway. I doubt LE knows for sure. Only the person that shot him knows for sure. We may find out at trial.

 

[Dudly]

Someone we haven’t talked about is James Manleys, Jake tried to act like his friend and the whole time he was talking to JM the Wagners was setting JM up to take the blame for the family murders, I think the reason the GPS tracker was put on JM’s truck was to keep track of JM to make sure he didn’t kill the Wagners, JMO, Charles Reader said in his interview when the Wagners where arrested that the Wagners told lie after lie

Although he was part of the investigation, I’m not sure he should be discussed since he is not a suspect. Maybe a moderator will comment on him.

 

[Tiff23fr]

She never lived there again, doesn't mean she never went back to see her son, which she did.

Agreed
It wasn't stated that way is my point.
If child custody and past abusive relationships are the core motive, the defense will look for holes in how the State and their witnesses share these narratives. JMO

Below is what I heard:

AC: And when you said she fled the residence can you describe why she fled the residence?

RS: There was an incident on a particular day her and George had gotten into an argument. Eventually there was a comment by Angela that she was going to kill Tabitha so she fled to a gas station and ultimately never returned.

AC: Ok and actually specifically she first hid on the property until nightfall and then got on a bike and drove to a gas station and made her escape that way and never went back after that.

RS: Correct

 

[Johnny B Bad]

Although he was part of the investigation, I’m not sure he should be discussed since he is not a suspect. Maybe a moderator will comment on him.

Your right about one thing he not a suspect now but JM is surely a Victim also, JMO

 

[Cool Cats]

Agreed
It wasn't stated that way is my point.
If child custody and past abusive relationships are the core motive, the defense will look for holes in how the State and their witnesses share these narratives. JMO

Below is what I heard:

AC: And when you said she fled the residence can you describe why she fled the residence?

RS: There was an incident on a particular day her and George had gotten into an argument. Eventually there was a comment by Angela that she was going to kill Tabitha so she fled to a gas station and ultimately never returned.

AC: Ok and actually specifically she first hid on the property until nightfall and then got on a bike and drove to a gas station and made her escape that way and never went back after that.

RS: Correct

I don't think it matters to GW4's case if the defense says that they found out that later on Tabitha visited her son at Peterson Rd. The Prosecution could simply say she never lived there again but later was granted visitation and visited her son when she felt safe enough to not get killed by Angela.

Has no bearing on the case. Context was to show how they are a cult-like insular family doing everything together, including voting as a family, and the context was what ended GW4's marriage. Angela threatening to kill Tabitha so she got the heck out of there.

Tabitha never went back to resume the marriage or to resume living with the Wagners is the point. And also that she gave up her parental rights, GW4 had an attorney fighting for him but she had no attorney.

In this cross-examination Prosecution showing :

1.) Obsessed with child custody. (GW4 took custody away from his ex wife)
2.) Angela threatening to kill GW4's wife. (Angela killed Jake's ex)
3.) Wagner's did everything together. (They ALL did the murders together)

 

[Sillybilly]

Although he was part of the investigation, I’m not sure he should be discussed since he is not a suspect. Maybe a moderator will comment on him.

JM can be discussed according to what was said about him or by him in MSM or from LE or other WS approved sources, and although he was part of the investigation, he is not a POI or suspect and therefore is off limits for actual sleuthing.

 

[GoBuckeyes]

Given what we now know about AW threatening to kill GW4’s ex. Do you think she could have been one of the shooters? If so you’d have to pin the smallest caliber weapon to her, in my opinion.

Not necessarily, regarding the caliber.

 

[Dudly]

JM can be discussed according to what was said about him or by him in MSM or from LE or other WS approved sources, and although he was part of the investigation, he is not a POI or suspect and therefore is off limits for actual sleuthing.

Thanks SillyBilly. I wasn’t sure how he could be discussed...

 

[DustyDog]

I believe JM was initially suspected due to a long deleted (or hidden) SM post from "DR" to AM which asked something to the effect of "Hey sis, Why's your truck over there so late." MOO

The morning of the murders, I searched the victims on FB and the post was there. By the afternoon it was hidden. I believe that was the reason JM was looked into so closely, so quickly, resulting for one, in LE tracking JM truck.

I also suspect it was a W who posted that to divert attention towards the M family (they went to great lengths to make it look like this crime was done by a M) I also believe that that post will give a good idea of the actual time of the murders. MOO

I believe this post will come back out at the trials. MOO

 

[Myland]

I don't think it matters to GW4's case if the defense says that they found out that later on Tabitha visited her son at Peterson Rd. The Prosecution could simply say she never lived there again but later was granted visitation and visited her son when she felt safe enough to not get killed by Angela.

Has no bearing on the case. Context was to show how they are a cult-like insular family doing everything together, including voting as a family, and the context was what ended GW4's marriage. Angela threatening to kill Tabitha so she got the heck out of there.

Tabitha never went back to resume the marriage or to resume living with the Wagners is the point. And also that she gave up her parental rights, GW4 had an attorney fighting for him but she had no attorney.

In this cross-examination Prosecution showing :

1.) Obsessed with child custody. (GW4 took custody away from his ex wife)
2.) Angela threatening to kill GW4's wife. (Angela killed Jake's ex)
3.) Wagner's did everything together. (They ALL did the murders together)

Jmo agree with what the prosecution can say but when they question a witness what ever they open up can be cross examined and the defense can try to make juror see their way jmo And notice how they said Angela threatened to kill her not George Jmo

 

[Betty P]

Although he was part of the investigation, I’m not sure he should be discussed since he is not a suspect. Maybe a moderator will comment on him.

We've talked about him often back in 2016 and 2017, when he and BJM were being harassed by investigators. For the most part, everyone here defended him. Agree, he's very much a victim. I hope they call him as a witness in Jake's trial. It will be interesting to hear his side of the story in that whole mess.

 

[Myland]

We've talked about him often back in 2016 and 2017, when he and BJM were being harassed by investigators. For the most part, everyone here defended him. Agree, he's very much a victim. I hope they call him as a witness in Jake's trial. It will be interesting to hear his side of the story in that whole mess.

Jmo I never believed for one min even from beginning that Jm or Bjm was involved. I always felt sorry for them being harassed and losing their family members Jmo

 

[Cool Cats]

We've talked about him often back in 2016 and 2017, when he and BJM were being harassed by investigators. For the most part, everyone here defended him. Agree, he's very much a victim. I hope they call him as a witness in Jake's trial. It will be interesting to hear his side of the story in that whole mess.

I think he will be called as a witness because he is considered a witness for being the first person to discover the crime scene like BJM was first to discover 2 crime scenes and DS was first to go inside Kenny's camper, wasn't said if Kenny's son also went in.

Usually a witness discovering a crime scene will be called to testify.

Opinion

 

[Betty P]

I think he will be called as a witness because he is considered a witness for being the first person to discover the crime scene like BJM was first to discover 2 crime scenes and DS was first to go inside Kenny's camper, wasn't said if Kenny's son also went in.

Usually a witness discovering a crime scene will be called to testify.

Opinion

I wonder if there will be any testimony about the incident when LE placed the tracker on his and Jake's trucks? We know nothing came of that on JM's side, but wonder if there was something important learned from JW's side? Shortly after that, they took off for AK.

 

[Cool Cats]

Jmo agree with what the prosecution can say but when they question a witness what ever they open up can be cross examined and the defense can try to make juror see their way jmo And notice how they said Angela threatened to kill her not George Jmo

Already I can see some posters on here agree with what the defense said that not enough was brought out in the bond hearing to show GW4 is connected to the murders.

In that case he deserves bond.

However, most seem to agree with what the prosecution said. I agree with the prosecution (and Judge) that there was enough brought out at the hearing to show he was involved to some degree in the murders. Thus, he should not get bond.

Thank you Judge Deering.

 

[Johnny B Bad]

I think he will be called as a witness because he is considered a witness for being the first person to discover the crime scene like BJM was first to discover 2 crime scenes and DS was first to go inside Kenny's camper, wasn't said if Kenny's son also went in.

Usually a witness discovering a crime scene will be called to testify.

Opinion

I sure hope that the Prosecution calls Fredericka, RW,CN, RN, EW and Tabatha to be a wittiness just see how all 4 of the Wagners react to it, JMO

 

[OhioBlues]

Agreed
It wasn't stated that way is my point.
If child custody and past abusive relationships are the core motive, the defense will look for holes in how the State and their witnesses share these narratives. JMO

Below is what I heard:

AC: And when you said she fled the residence can you describe why she fled the residence?

RS: There was an incident on a particular day her and George had gotten into an argument. Eventually there was a comment by Angela that she was going to kill Tabitha so she fled to a gas station and ultimately never returned.

AC: Ok and actually specifically she first hid on the property until nightfall and then got on a bike and drove to a gas station and made her escape that way and never went back after that.

RS: Correct

Totally agree!

If the W4 don't receive the best defense possible then they can appeal the verdicts and possibly walk free.

A good Defense Attorney will pick on mistakes like these. jmo

Also, these types of mistakes can matter when the jury decides on DP, LWOP or 30 years etc.