Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #23

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Sharkbite said:
A bit more info in the Sun from the Discovery Plus documentary that premieres tonight.

"The woman - identified only as M in the documentary - said she had met Christian B in the summer of 2009 after he had returned from Portugal and was living in the motorhome.

She said: ''I was at a dance for over 30's - I was 52 and he was 32. I saw him and we started talking. “He told me he had camper van and that I could move in with him.''


Maddie suspect pictured in ‘lair where he hid 8000 child abuse images'
Click to expand...

I wonder what pixelated footage the Sun shows in the short video with MS and how the media got into possession of it.
 
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SuperdadV8 said:
I wonder what pixelated footage the Sun shows in the short video with MS and how the media got into possession of it.
Click to expand...
The pixelated video footage is nondescript...probably just artificially created for the documentary....imo .
They do show a couple of “police photos “ of inside of PDL farmhouse ...not necessarily photos from a camera of CB though I guess.
 
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Lilly b said:
Yes, just part 1, and nothing we probably don't already know, but, but you can tell its a build up, they have had to start from the beginning so to speak, but he did have the big motor home before she went missing, and Ms does quite a lot of talking, it mentions that his friend declined to speak,on the program, so that could be mt more than likely
Click to expand...

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/12638463/witness-mccann-guilty-christian-b/

Am guessing the “ accomplice of MS who declined to be interviewed for documentary ” is probably HB imo .
It was MS and HB who entered the farmhouse and took the camera while CB and MT were in jail.
Is possible HB has been told by police not to speak to media as he’s a key witness ..imo .
 
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misty48 said:
The documentary features a different Winnebago to the Burgundy Tiffin Allegro featured in press articles.
Click to expand...
He could have owned or borrowed two different ones and in different periods.
Makes one wonder: from where did he get those huge Winnebago's? Was there a good European market for Winnebago's in those days?
 
I follow this forum but do not write very often.
I watched part 1 of the Discovery doc yesterday and as others have stated, no new information.
They had an interview with Wolthers, where he said something like (translated to English, if you need excact German words let me know):
“I can’t reveil much about our suspicion at the moment. What I can say is that we have no forensic evidence, we have no body or body parts. On the other hand, we do have other evidence. This can be vitnesses, video or photographs”.

The fact that he states it can be vitnesses, video or photographs kind of made be think that they have all 3.
 
According to HCW's statement, that the suspect "possibly" abused the little girl after snatching her, i just tried to blank out any sexual motivation for the abduction, that obviously has been carried out very professionally.

Madeleine McCann ‘died shortly after being kidnapped’ (yahoo.com)

Without a sexual motive, i would assume that abductions take place to get hold of money. We discussed the theory of selling MM to a paedophile ring or to morocco before and came to the conclusion, that there isn't any info about a similar case in europe that can prove that theory.

So what kind of motive remains? Maybe ransom, what should make out the most likely reason to abduct a person. In the MM case a foreign child from "good situated" people was abducted, not from local inhabitants. Just coincidence?

While CB spent time in prison, he seemed to have lost almost everything he used to hide in his farmhouse. According to MS, HB and MS stole everything from CB, that had a value. Maybe even money?! By the end of 2006 CB should have been broken. Living in the campervan. According to former best friend MT, CB's goal was to get hold of one million euros. The 2006 conviction must have been a huge step backwards.


"Tatschl, a father of one, continued: He liked to brag about his crimes. He aimed to steal as much money as he could until he reached his dream of having a million euros. But the German guy and his friend took everything."

Madeleine McCann suspect's best pal tells cops Christian B is guilty and he may have sold her to a 'sex ring' (thesun.co.uk)

Always assuming a lack of ransom demands in the MM case, i came across this info almost by accident:

Cops failed to probe £1m Maddie ransom - Daily Star

"Police hunting Madeleine McCann ignored a £1million ransom demand from a man who said he had her, a shock report claimed last night. The man asked for the money in a call to a staff member at the Portuguese holiday apartment where the four-year-old was last seen nearly two years ago. He left the message on a phone belonging to a worker at the Ocean Club resort in Praia da Luz – with a child’s voice speaking English in the background."

Unfortuneatly there isn't much more to read about but if true, it brings me to the following conclusions, theoretically of course!

1. The prosecuters have concrete knowledge, that MM has been abducted for some reason, that doesn't include a sexual motive at first. The reason could just be money.
2. The abduction was planned, maybe with the help of a staff member or an other accomplice. Maybe someone, that can not be linked to the murder itself and the participation in the abduction can't be prosecuted anymore, due to legal limitations.

Madeleine McCann: Suspect Christian B was 'tipped off by Praia da Luz hotel worker' | World News | Sky News

3. MM died after the huge media interest and and maybe a ransom demand, that hasn't been taken seriously. The girl, the whole world is looking for in every corner, might have became more a danger to the abductor, than a possibility to make money. It's also possible, that she died accidentally but i would assume, she died not to tell anybody how her abductor might have looked like or in what kind of car she was taken away maybe.

4. The staff member or accomplice left the ominous message at 5A later, due to a bad conscience?!

Madeleine McCann: Letter Claimed Girl's Body Had Been Dumped In Reservoir | HuffPost UK Parents (huffingtonpost.co.uk)

5. The former accomplice in the abduction charges CB, maybe as a witness, so other things like PDL phone mast ranges etc. aren't that crucial for the prosecuters.

So we might have a crook accusing another crook to have taken and killed MM. Without a body, it won't be enough for a charge. But with a body and all the little puzzle pieces we know and maybe don't know about, it could make sense. Just a thought....
 
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From 0:50:

IMO he isn't talking about MS or HB! But he clearly knows, who is accusing CB. That person should be another criminal.

And as clearly he speaks about that one, i would assume that that person is a german citizen too. Hard to think, that FF has or gets a lot info about foreign criminals. But that's just assumption.

 
SuperdadV8 said:
From 0:50:

IMO he isn't talking about MS or HB! But he clearly knows, who is accusing CB. That person should be another criminal.

And as clearly he speaks about that one, i would assume that that person is a german citizen too. Hard to think, that FF has or gets a lot info about foreign criminals. But that's just assumption.

Click to expand...
Maybe MN? Or what about the young man, that lived near the kiosk in Germany, think may of had same first name as who I just mentioned, didn't he get sent to prison for something to do with a girl? But then again could be a multitude of people
 
Lilly b said:
Maybe MN? Or what about the young man, that lived near the kiosk in Germany, think may of had same first name as who I just mentioned, didn't he get sent to prison for something to do with a girl? But then again could be a multitude of people
Click to expand...

I have an assumption, that FF could be talking about an other infamous criminal, that could fit the description very well, yes!

But not just based on that. In another german forum a member stated, that he watched a trial in Hamburg a few weeks ago, with FF as the solicitor. After being asked by the judge or prosecutor if there are any news in the MM case, due to the all-time speculations, FF answered that the Braunschweig prosecuters don't do better investigations, than the prosecuters from Hamburg.

So that is a debatable quote due to the fact, that in germany the prosecuters are most often in charge, at the place where a suspect had his last adress, especially if the suspect is already imprisoned, as we see in the MM case.

So, the last known adress of the other criminal that i have in mind, has been in Hamburg.....;)
 
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SuperdadV8 said:
According to HCW's statement, that the suspect "possibly" abused the little girl after snatching her, i just tried to blank out any sexual motivation for the abduction, that obviously has been carried out very professionally.

Madeleine McCann ‘died shortly after being kidnapped’ (yahoo.com)

Without a sexual motive, i would assume that abductions take place to get hold of money. We discussed the theory of selling MM to a paedophile ring or to morocco before and came to the conclusion, that there isn't any info about a similar case in europe that can prove that theory.

So what kind of motive remains? Maybe ransom, what should make out the most likely reason to abduct a person. In the MM case a foreign child from "good situated" people was abducted, not from local inhabitants. Just coincidence?

While CB spent time in prison, he seemed to have lost almost everything he used to hide in his farmhouse. According to MS, HB and MS stole everything from CB, that had a value. Maybe even money?! By the end of 2006 CB should have been broken. Living in the campervan. According to former best friend MT, CB's goal was to get hold of one million euros. The 2006 conviction must have been a huge step backwards.


"Tatschl, a father of one, continued: He liked to brag about his crimes. He aimed to steal as much money as he could until he reached his dream of having a million euros. But the German guy and his friend took everything."

Madeleine McCann suspect's best pal tells cops Christian B is guilty and he may have sold her to a 'sex ring' (thesun.co.uk)

Always assuming a lack of ransom demands in the MM case, i came across this info almost by accident:

Cops failed to probe £1m Maddie ransom - Daily Star

"Police hunting Madeleine McCann ignored a £1million ransom demand from a man who said he had her, a shock report claimed last night. The man asked for the money in a call to a staff member at the Portuguese holiday apartment where the four-year-old was last seen nearly two years ago. He left the message on a phone belonging to a worker at the Ocean Club resort in Praia da Luz – with a child’s voice speaking English in the background."

Unfortuneatly there isn't much more to read about but if true, it brings me to the following conclusions, theoretically of course!

1. The prosecuters have concrete knowledge, that MM has been abducted for some reason, that doesn't include a sexual motive at first. The reason could just be money.
2. The abduction was planned, maybe with the help of a staff member or an other accomplice. Maybe someone, that can not be linked to the murder itself and the participation in the abduction can't be prosecuted anymore, due to legal limitations.

Madeleine McCann: Suspect Christian B was 'tipped off by Praia da Luz hotel worker' | World News | Sky News

3. MM died after the huge media interest and and maybe a ransom demand, that hasn't been taken seriously. The girl, the whole world is looking for in every corner, might have became more a danger to the abductor, than a possibility to make money. It's also possible, that she died accidentally but i would assume, she died not to tell anybody how her abductor might have looked like or in what kind of car she was taken away maybe.

4. The staff member or accomplice left the ominous message at 5A later, due to a bad conscience?!

Madeleine McCann: Letter Claimed Girl's Body Had Been Dumped In Reservoir | HuffPost UK Parents (huffingtonpost.co.uk)

5. The former accomplice in the abduction charges CB, maybe as a witness, so other things like PDL phone mast ranges etc. aren't that crucial for the prosecuters.

So we might have a crook accusing another crook to have taken and killed MM. Without a body, it won't be enough for a charge. But with a body and all the little puzzle pieces we know and maybe don't know about, it could make sense. Just a thought....
Click to expand...

Often thought about this ?? she saw Mr McCann at the avenida of Lagos when she tried to withdrew (sic) money from the cash machine next to the Banif outlet.
- Mr McCann looked very upset and said a few time the following ?Don't hurt Madeleine?.
- Carolyn felt this was a very bizar (sic) situation but thought this men (sic) must be an actor or a journalist as he repeted (sic) again and again this sentence.
- Carolyn then walked to the Banco Espiritu Santo outlet a few 100 meters. Carolyn is a customer of BES for many, many years and the staff know her well at the bank.
- The bank staff asked that they whether she heard the latest (sic).The bank staff told her about Madeleine going missing and Carolyn immediately made the connection to the man she saw in front of the cash machine. She told the bank staff that she must have seen Mr McCann just a few minutes ago. Pictures of Mr McCann on TV confirmed this later.P.J. POLICE FILES: CAROLYN KISH
 
Superdad, Thank you for posting this theory. I never thought about abducting for ransom as never heard about a ransom claim.
Very interesting. I hope there were no sexual abuse associated with what happened to MM.
 
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SuperdadV8 said:
From 0:50:

IMO he isn't talking about MS or HB! But he clearly knows, who is accusing CB. That person should be another criminal.

And as clearly he speaks about that one, i would assume that that person is a german citizen too. Hard to think, that FF has or gets a lot info about foreign criminals. But that's just assumption.

Click to expand...
Indeed, however I dont think FF knows for sure who the informer is as at 1.14 he says If this is the person I think it is ?? maybe he is just guessing ?
 
SuperdadV8 said:
I have an assumption, that FF could be talking about an other infamous criminal, that could fit the description very well, yes!

But not just based on that. In another german forum a member stated, that he watched a trial in Hamburg a few weeks ago, with FF as the solicitor. After being asked by the judge or prosecutor if there are any news in the MM case, due to the all-time speculations, FF answered that the Braunschweig prosecuters don't do better investigations, than the prosecuters from Hamburg.

So that is a debatable quote due to the fact, that in germany the prosecuters are most often in charge, at the place where a suspect had his last adress, especially if the suspect is already imprisoned, as we see in the MM case.

So, the last known adress of the other criminal that i have in mind, has been in Hamburg.....;)
Click to expand...
Oh :eek: I see who you mean.
 
SuperdadV8 said:
From 0:50:

IMO he isn't talking about MS or HB! But he clearly knows, who is accusing CB. That person should be another criminal.

And as clearly he speaks about that one, i would assume that that person is a german citizen too. Hard to think, that FF has or gets a lot info about foreign criminals. But that's just assumption.

Click to expand...

Think he does mean HB because in a similar interview he
mentions not being a reliable witness due to his arrest for
human trafficking/ hoping to get a reduced sentence . This would also tie in with the 10th anniversary programme and supposed drunken confession ? .
 
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