Found Deceased UK - Sarah Everard, 33, London - Clapham Common area, 3 March 2021 *Arrests* #11

[Whitehall 1212]

I’m wondering how many years this will take to get to trial because of the massive backlog the courts have.


I am wondering if he will go with some kind of mental breakdown as it seems like he hurt himself in his jail cell. He was exposing himself days before the murder. He took time off for stress so a insanity plea may be his best option.

I think that due to the seriousness of the case and the fact a serving police officer is accused, that the trial will be expedited and could take place later this year.

MOO

 

[Herat]

Thanks to @FindersKeepers ( post #1796 on Thread #10) about the hired car.

If he did, indeed, deliberately choose a hire car that was the general make, model, and color of a police vehicle, marked or unmarked, this goes to a very premeditated crime and his state of mind in this crime.

And are there any simple decals he could have added that would make this look like a police vehicle in the dark? Like a striped hazard tape on the back bumper or something?

 

[Lyanna]

Candle shining brightly for Sarah tonight xx

 

[BrianJohnson]

If she ended up getting into the car in the front seat she must have been incapacitated/dead/unconscious before entering the car surely

Even with child locks on the doors she is still likely to make an attempt to grab the wheel, make the car swerve all over the place, or try and bite his arm to again cause an accident

 

[Urbanfox1]

I think you have to be properly nuts for that to stick. Also will end up being committed to somewhere like Broadmoor indefinitely (due to your insanity) so you don’t get off as such eg Robert Napper who murdered Rachel Nickell who was convicted of manslaughter on the grounds of diminished responsibility and sentenced to jail in Broadmoor indefinitely (note even Napper wasn’t deemed unfit to plead and even his own brief said he was crazy).

Will add to that IMO a sudden loss of self control defence would not work in this sort of case, as how on earth do you establish that in the apparent circumstances? The alternative is that you are basically so unstable that you lacked capacity to understand what you were doing - which is likely to lead you to a committal order. Someone on an earlier thread said that his lawyers would be unlikely to run that case, which makes sense to me. JMO

 

[Jenesaisquoi]

that’s quite a specific assumption

What do you mean?

 

[asyousay]

If she ended up getting into the car in the front seat she must have been incapacitated/dead/unconscious before entering the car surely

Even with child locks on the doors she is still likely to make an attempt to grab the wheel, make the car swerve all over the place, or try and bite his arm to again cause an accident

Unless she was handcuffed

 

[PleasantMess]

"Sickness during work
If you become ill while you are at work, your line manager may send you home. Unless this
becomes a pattern, this will not count towards sickness absence and you do not need to
update the portal"- this is from a freedom of information statement by the met. As shown in the link below.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.met.police.uk/SysSiteAssets/foi-media/metropolitan-police/disclosure_2018/may_2018/information-rights-unit---policysop-that-refer-to-case-conferences-for-sickness#:~:text=Phone%3A%2078222%20(external%3A%200207,2222)%20and%20choose%20option%201.&text=If%20you%20become%20ill%20while,manager%20may%20send%20you%20home.&ved=2ahUKEwiws96Jta7vAhUySxUIHTv7ApYQFjABegQIARAG&usg=AOvVaw14s3Q6VffXOUhOt7La4TGN


Met Police policy is that being sent home from work is not considered sick leave therefore day 1 of sick leave I would interpret as the next shift they are due to be in. I would expect them to call in sick for their next shift.

In conclusion, WC could have been sent home early on the 2nd. He could have started a 12 hour shift without finishing it and then phoned in sick on 5th. There is no information that stays he finished the 12 hour shift. Unless anyone has this info? Jmo

 

[JosieJo]

I have a gut feeling..which could obviously be very wrong..that his self harm by banging his head was not some pretence to aid his cause ..same with emailing to ask to remove his gun licence
I think he knows how dangerous he is .. I think its possible he realises he can't stop ...who flashes at McDonalds? Its asking to be caught
I think he will go guilty and will be a massive suicide risk

 

[asyousay]

I have a gut feeling..which could obviously be very wrong..that his self harm by banging his head was not some pretence to aid his cause ..same with emailing to ask to remove his gun licence
I think he knows how dangerous he is .. I think its possible he realises he can't stop ...who flashes at McDonalds? Its asking to be caught
I think he will go guilty and will be a massive suicide risk

if this was the case he wouldn’t of tried to conceal what he had done though.

 

[Merpedy]

Unless she was handcuffed

Does anyone know if handcuffing would count as 'force'?

I'm increasingly of the opinion that this may have been a more 'typical' case of kidnap that one would see on TV but also interested to know the limits/scope of such words

 

[BrianJohnson]

Unless she was handcuffed

Even handcuffed she could still shoulder charge into him/throw herself onto the steering wheel to try make him lose control of the car

 

[Parmalade]

If she ended up getting into the car in the front seat she must have been incapacitated/dead/unconscious before entering the car surely

Even with child locks on the doors she is still likely to make an attempt to grab the wheel, make the car swerve all over the place, or try and bite his arm to again cause an accident

This was my thought - it got swallowed at the end of the last thread but a thought around this that I had was if the model of Astra was a GTC - they’re three-door, so the route to the back seats, incapacitated or otherwise, would be through the passenger front door, hence why it might have been open when the second bus went by (and the driver’s front door had remained open for speed of re-entry after kidnap, showing both doors open simultaneously).

 

[Cannycat]

What do you mean?

The tooth theory... just seems a strange thing to come up with

 

[Whitehall 1212]

Thanks to @FindersKeepers ( post #1796 on Thread #10) about the hired car.

If he did, indeed, deliberately choose a hire car that was the general make, model, and color of a police vehicle, marked or unmarked, this goes to a very premeditated crime and his state of mind in this crime.

And are there any simple decals he could have added that would make this look like a police vehicle in the dark? Like a striped hazard tape on the back bumper or something?

There was comment yesterday that the existence of a hire car is questionable.

The police haven't mentioned it. A 'very local' resident who is on WS has stated that they didn't see any car removed on the evening that WC was arrested. Although, two cars were removed the following day.

Does anyone know of a credible source for the hire car theory?

 

[jazzygal19]

I think he may be trying to go for unfit for trial route instead
Insanity at the time of the crime is hard to prove by the look of things but of course it's very individual circumstance dependant

He may well try that. Although my friend's dad is a top forensic psychiatrist and his job is deciding if an offender is ultimately insane or not (he has had to do that for some chilling murderers. I don't want to say who as don't want to reveal his identity). Anyway, my point is, him bashing his head a few times is not going to deceive a highly qualified expert who will be able to see through this, and has years of experience in profiling serious offenders.

 

[Cannycat]

There was comment yesterday that the existence of a hire car is questionable.

The police haven't mentioned it. A 'very local' resident who is on WS has stated that they didn't see any car removed on the evening that WC was arrested. Although, two cars were removed the following day.

Does anyone know of a credible source for the hire car scenario?

well given that neither of his removed cars is a white Astra and that is the car found on cctv then yes

 

[JosieJo]

if this was the case he wouldn’t of tried to conceal what he had done though.

Possibly..but it could have been an initial reaction ..whilst fighting constantly with guilt in the days after .. if I wanted to lie low I'm not sure I'd be emailing my boss to ask for gun licence to be removed or going off sick ..anyone with no guilt or wanted to continue such crimes would Possibly try to carry on as normal

 

[Emmalt]

I think that due to the seriousness of the case and the fact a serving police officer is accused, that the trial will be expedited and could take place later this year.

MOO

When he goes to old Bailey Wednesday.. is that for his plea?

If so why is that so quick compared to when the Lindsay birbeck murder happened? He was charge in Aug and didn't have his plea hearing until December? Then the 1st trial started in the feb.

Could this go to trial in next couple of months? Say June time? Will we find that out on Wednesday when he enters his plea? If he goes not guilty of course.

Also.. if he pleads guilty will he just be sentenced and charged at the trial time? Will public get to know the details if he pleads guilty?

 

[Joolz1975]

There was comment yesterday that the existence of a hire car is questionable.

The police haven't mentioned it. A 'very local' resident who is on WS has stated that they didn't see any car removed on the evening that WC was arrested. Although, two cars were removed the following day.

Does anyone know of a credible source for the hire car scenario?

It was mentioned in court today. That his hire car was tracked from London to Kent.
Sarah Everard’s body found in builder’s bag, court told