Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #132

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Was it common for Abby to sleep over at Libby's? Or vise versa? And do we know anything about how this sleep over materialized (were they hanging out on the previous day etc.)?

Also, does anyone have any more information on the circumstances surrounding the FBI agent who was in Delphi at the time of Libby's and Abby's disappearance , above and beyond his visiting family and participating in the search?

Lastly, it is my understanding that it was Toby's decision to end the search at midnight. I will just say that in imho this decision is truly bizarre. The number of nonsensical rationales I have heard from people trying to 'justify' this decision is mind-boggling?
In the recently broadcast HLN show on the Delphi murders, while the search was called off officially, many officials remained in those woods searching. Libby's phone (I believe it was Libby's) was pinging in the early morning hours and Sheriff Leazenby called the fire house to get better lighting down at the search area to try and find it.

I've never understood officially calling it off either under the cold weather circumstances and the missing being kids not dressed well for those overnight temps.
 
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In the recently broadcast HLN show on the Delphi murders, while the search was called off officially, many officials remained in those woods searching. Libby's phone (I believe it was Libby's) was pinging in the early morning hours and Sheriff Leazenby called the fire house to get better lighting down at the search area to try and find it.

I've never understood officially calling it off either under the cold weather circumstances and the missing being kids not dressed well for those overnight temps.
Maybe LE didn't think they were in the woods. I remember one of the grandfathers speculating where they might have been.
 
In the recently broadcast HLN show on the Delphi murders, while the search was called off officially, many officials remained in those woods searching. Libby's phone (I believe it was Libby's) was pinging in the early morning hours and Sheriff Leazenby called the fire house to get better lighting down at the search area to try and find it.

I've never understood officially calling it off either under the cold weather circumstances and the missing being kids not dressed well for those overnight temps.

Not saying I agree with the decision, but there were two main factors IMO, based on interviews in Down the Hill and the HLN special:

1. Until they received info about the ping from Libby's cell phone well after midnight, LE and Fire did not think the girls were still near the bridge. See TL's comments in Episode 2 of DTH about "the twist" - Carroll County had always been successful in finding its missing people and the authorities thought they had a handle on what missing teens do. As AW said "the police officer told me....the late movie gets out in Logansport right about now" (paraphrasing). LE weren't expecting foul play given the crime rates in Delphi, what they were able to discern about the girls' behavior, etc.

2. Overnight conditions were dangerous for searchers. In Episode 2 of DTH we learn that the fire chief (who was a close friend of MP - he sheds tears on this episode thinking about the fact that "he {MP} only ever asked me one thing {to find the girls} and I couldn't give it to him" - was involved in the decision to stop searching and he cited the fact that the terrain was dangerous to search even in daylight hours. There was heavy fog forecasted to come in the overnight/dawn. IMO they feared a searcher would fall off the bridge itself in the darkness or they would have some other kind of serious injury to deal with if they sanctioned people searching all night. They knew, however, that they couldn't stop the family/close friends and MP kept searching all night along with others.
 
As the sketches were made from peoples accounts of someone that they saw out there that day, would these same people be asked by LE to identify against pictures of potential POI’s or people tipped in??

that's not very probable
first you have two sketches with different sets of witnesses
le doesnt seem to be sure which witness to trust or whether they saw bg at all .. with different statements as usual
the first sketch was made by both witness description and the artist looking at the video image .. which might have created conflict of opinions in the end results
so my opinion is that le are no longer in contact with any witness .. and that no witness actually saw bg clearly to recognise him from a lineup
 
In the recently broadcast HLN show on the Delphi murders, while the search was called off officially, many officials remained in those woods searching. Libby's phone (I believe it was Libby's) was pinging in the early morning hours and Sheriff Leazenby called the fire house to get better lighting down at the search area to try and find it.

I've never understood officially calling it off either under the cold weather circumstances and the missing being kids not dressed well for those overnight temps.
MOO the search was called off because LE thought they were runaways or spending the night at the home of a friend.

Because of their ages and the lack of violent crime and feeling of relative safety in the small town.
 
I feel the faces are essentially "made up' at this point..and if the perp matches the second sketch and not the first or vice versa, he can then say it's mistaken identity and he is being arrested based on an erroneous sketch.

I feel like a lawyer could use this double sketch thing down the line..or maybe anything based on the sketches won't be allowed.. I hope we can argue these points someday soon.

mOO
 
IMO, the change in sketches, along with some of LE's comments about them, only seem questionable if LE has already identified the killer. If they have not, then they therefore do not know what he looks like or can fully verify which one, or to what extent, each sketch resembles him.

LE has stated that they do not know if the DNA they have belongs to the killer. This is another statement that is treated as controversial, but imo, only points to the fact that they have not ID'd the killer and need someone to come forward with his identity so they can use the evidence they have to prove him a match. JMO
 
I feel the faces are essentially "made up' at this point..and if the perp matches the second sketch and not the first or vice versa, he can then say it's mistaken identity and he is being arrested based on an erroneous sketch.

I feel like a lawyer could use this double sketch thing down the line..or maybe anything based on the sketches won't be allowed.. I hope we can argue these points someday soon.

mOO

They are essentially made up and they always were...like all police composite sketches, they are only an artist's interpretation of someone else's memory.

No one is arrested or convicted based only on resemblance to a composite sketch. The sketch is only to jog people's memories enough that, hopefully, a tip can come in with a person's name. The identity will be used to determine if enough evidence exists to further investigate the tipped person.

When/if the Delphi killer is found, some will say "he looks nothing like the sketches" and others will inevitably say "it's eerie how much he looks like the sketches." It is all subjective. IMO
 
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LE can’t even decide how or if either one of the sketches relates to the case. If they are of any importance LE has rendered them useless by their seemingly constant attempts to clarify and reclassify them. By now, they are pretty worthless in my opinion.
 
not very clear, but its there.
photos of face taken from a 54 second video
 

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I wonder who this guy was??? Wearing all black.

"The teens said the man seemed out of place, though Chasity says that "could just be a rumor."

The children described the man wearing all black."

PLUS...

"We got the magnifying glass out," she said. "Those are what we call 'hunting pants,' what somebody into bird hunting would wear. Those were popular in the '90s."

(I've not been able to locate blue or blue jean looking hunting pants)

Memorial grows as police continue search for Delphi girls' killer | wthr.com
Hey, your post got me curious what old 90's duck clothing was, check out these hoodies! Camo top, hand pocket brown! Interesting!
Google Image Result for https://www.outdooralabama.com/sites/default/files/styles/full_size/public/Rainer%20articles/Youth%20waterfowl%202018.jpg?itok=RVHO1Mze
 
I'd post the photo but I don't have luck or I'm too dumb to figure it out. If someone would like to post the photo instead of the link please do. Thx
Youth%20waterfowl%202018.jpg

image from OutdoorAlabama.com

bbm

This what you wanted? Interesting, the two fabrics -- pattern, color, texture. Hhhmmm.
 
New to the case so I apologize in advance for any redundant terrain vis a vis my inquiries. Thx.

Would anybody happen to know how Abby got to Libby and the Patty's house on the 12th for the sleep over? Did Ana drop her off, or Derek, or was she picked up by either Becky or Mike or Kelsi? Or somehow otherwise?

I'm thinking that BG could have spotted either Abby, Libby or both some days/weeks before and if so then perhaps he was surveilling (voyeuristic stalking would probably be closer to what I'm implying) them, and then either followed them as they left Mike and Becky's that afternoon or catfished (I know this has supposedly been dismissed as a possibility) them to the bridge while he lay in wait

Have any of the families mentioned any odd occurrences that now really stand out in the days/weeks leading up to the bridge ambush?

What I would be most interested in, however, is an answer to my first question...how did Abby get to Libby's on the 12th?

Thanks.
 
Hey, your post got me curious what old 90's duck clothing was, check out these hoodies! Camo top, hand pocket brown! Interesting!
Google Image Result for https://www.outdooralabama.com/sites/default/files/styles/full_size/public/Rainer%20articles/Youth%20waterfowl%202018.jpg?itok=RVHO1Mze

It would play into his overall methodology (IMO). I imagine he fancies himself a hunter: someone coming to an area popular with adolescents, on a day they were not scheduled to be in school, using a route/circuit he is likely familiar with, and quite literally cornering the girls in an area beyond escape.

I don’t have any media pieces on this - but I feel like the idea of him being a duck/game/something hunter was floated around? Possibly because where the girls were found was popular with hunters?

All JMO
 
After watching the People Magazine Investigates show about the Delphi murders, I think it was ok. There was not a lot of new information, but LE said that the first sketch, the second sketch, the audio and video should all be considered when looking for a possible suspect.

When you look at the case from LE perspective, you realize they had to do something. The sketches themselves are from people they think may have witnessed this man on the bridge. Are either of the sketches possibly this bridge guy? That is your opinion.

The one thing I have noticed looking at cases is that people tend to follow whatever the prevailing LE theory is at the time. So if LE thinks it was a younger man driving a white car parked next to a building that was close to the trails, people tend to follow that information. The one thing that keeps hope alive is the video Liberty German got of this man walking on the bridge. Someday the right person might see it and call in the tip to police.

But as time passes by that last theory becomes the theory until enough time has passed and people forget because the media presence is no longer there and discussing the same thing over and over becomes boring. Then you have to start all over again.

There was this double murder case that happened back on February 13, 2017 involving two girls who were out walking the trails in Delphi, Indiana. Have you heard of it?
 
Not saying I agree with the decision, but there were two main factors IMO, based on interviews in Down the Hill and the HLN special:

1. Until they received info about the ping from Libby's cell phone well after midnight, LE and Fire did not think the girls were still near the bridge. See TL's comments in Episode 2 of DTH about "the twist" - Carroll County had always been successful in finding its missing people and the authorities thought they had a handle on what missing teens do. As AW said "the police officer told me....the late movie gets out in Logansport right about now" (paraphrasing). LE weren't expecting foul play given the crime rates in Delphi, what they were able to discern about the girls' behavior, etc.

2. Overnight conditions were dangerous for searchers. In Episode 2 of DTH we learn that the fire chief (who was a close friend of MP - he sheds tears on this episode thinking about the fact that "he {MP} only ever asked me one thing {to find the girls} and I couldn't give it to him" - was involved in the decision to stop searching and he cited the fact that the terrain was dangerous to search even in daylight hours. There was heavy fog forecasted to come in the overnight/dawn. IMO they feared a searcher would fall off the bridge itself in the darkness or they would have some other kind of serious injury to deal with if they sanctioned people searching all night. They knew, however, that they couldn't stop the family/close friends and MP kept searching all night along with others.
I don't think the local LE gave enough weigh that night to what the Patty's were telling them about Libby. BP very quickly knew, when DG called her and said LG wasn't answering her phone, that something was amiss. She tried LG's phone numerous times and then called her husband at work, who left immediately to come search at trails. BP stated not answering her phone was something Libby would never do, that she was very responsible about that.

As far as the bridge being a dangerous spot at night, in the dark, they'd just need to post an officer at each end. The rest of the searching could have continued with spot lights (hand held or generated even by vehicles parked) and led by professionals. AJMO

We know now it wouldn't have helped because the girls were already gone but that was unknown then. I can't imagine the desolation the family members felt being told LE was officially calling off their help overnight.
 
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