GUILTY MN - George Floyd, 46, died in custody, Minneapolis, 25 May 2020 #19 - Chauvin Jury Deliberations #2

New Posts

Status
Not open for further replies.
Inthedetails said:
The jury members are not a naive, sheltered group who are shocked to see the city prepared for this verdict. They are from Minneapolis - they have seen the past 12 months first hand. They have seen trucks, guards, boarded up buildings, people in the streets - it's not as if they are wondering what is going on while they are in the courthouse.

Unless we find out otherwise (not just hand wringing), I think the jury are mature adults living in current times and understand their job is to look at the evidence about the day in question. If they are not capable of that, then we don't have a judicial system.

If they feel threatened, they need to tell the judge.

jmo
Click to expand...
It was the jury's job in the Jodi Arias trial to determine of she received the DP, or LWOP.
They were all asked if they would be able to decide on their questionnaire, and they all answered yes. Then when it came time to decide, they couldn't. That happened twice. What the jury is supposed to do, and what they do, are sometimes two different things.
 
RANCH said:
Let's say the jury does discuss Maxine Waters statement and the possible repercussions of a not guilty verdict. Would we necessarily know they did that? JMO
Click to expand...
Good point. I doubt we would, and I doubt they'd be required to tell the Judge they heard what she said. When a judge tells the jury "don't watch TV" and they get a news alert on their smartphone and they read it. They've done nothing wrong.
Just another reason they should have been sequestered. imo.
 
This case is really not that complicated! It shouldn’t take long for a verdict IMO. The only reason it would go past today is if there are 1 or 2 stealth/pro police jurors! Think about it - if this was not a cop - we would all be saying what a slam dunk case it is! The only factor that could bias this jury is that the defendant was a cop!

Having said that - I think the fact that he was charged and tried so zealously and that all these LE witnesses condemned his actions is HUGE! Precedent setting even! The fact that the whole world protested his actions is HUGE! The fact that the whole world is paying attention is HUGE! Let’s not lose sight of that. Whether he serves 10 years or 40 ultimately he’s been condemned by the whole world! Regardless of how much time he serves, good has won!!! His life is effectively over! He will never forget George Floyd’s name! Nor will the world!

JMO
 
Rocky1 said:
It was the jury's job in the Jodi Arias trial to determine of she received the DP, or LWOP.
They were all asked if they would be able to decide on their questionnaire, and they all answered yes. Then when it came time to decide, they couldn't. That happened twice. What the jury is supposed to do, and what they do, are sometimes two different things.
Click to expand...
Not being able to reach a decision happens. That's not the same as saying a jury will be influenced by what I'm assuming they already know - the world is on edge.

Of course some juries cannot agree. That happens. Could happen here.

jmo
 
Weki said:
This case is really not that complicated! It shouldn’t take long for a verdict IMO. The only reason it would go past today is if there are 1 or 2 stealth/pro police jurors! Think about it - if this was not a cop - we would all be saying what a slam dunk case it is! The only factor that could bias this jury is that the defendant was a cop!

Having said that - I think the fact that he was charged and tried so zealously and that all these LE witnesses condemned his actions is HUGE! Precedent setting even! The fact that the whole world protested his actions is HUGE! The fact that the whole world is paying attention is HUGE! Let’s not lose sight of that. Whether he serves 10 years or 40 ultimately he’s been condemned by the whole world! Regardless of how much time he serves, good has won!!! His life is effectively over! He will never forget George Floyd’s name! Nor will the world!

JMO
Click to expand...


@Weki, you say that this should not go past today... think about the poll here at WS where ~10% think not guilty on the bottom charge. After MONTHS of disecting on these threads and took so long for many to decide (myself included... still not sure myself and why I posted jury instructions again this am!)

If 11 of the 12 think guilty on the bottom charge, do you think they should go to the judge and state on the FIRST DAY for any of the 3 charges that we are hung..... after/within the first day?

I think not. MOO.
 
Inthedetails said:
Not being able to reach a decision happens. That's not the same as saying a jury will be influenced by what I'm assuming they already know - the world is on edge.

Of course some juries cannot agree. That happens. Could happen here.

jmo
Click to expand...
What I am saying is sometimes the jury does not do what they are supposed to do.
Everyone is bias. The Judge mentioned that yesterday. So yes, what they see and what they hear has an affect on their decision, regardless if it's supposed to or not.
IMO, there's not one juror that is not wondering what affect their decision is going to have on the entire nation., and on their personal/families safety.
 
Rocky1 said:
What I am saying is sometimes the jury does not do what they are supposed to do.
Everyone is bias. The Judge mentioned that yesterday. So yes, what they see and what they hear has an affect on their decision, regardless if it's supposed to or not.
IMO, there's not one juror that is not wondering what affect their decision is going to have on the entire nation., and on their personal/families safety.
Click to expand...
But what could be done to change any of that?They knew the moment they were chosen about all the protests and discord going on.
 
dixiegirl1035 said:
@Weki, you say that this should not go past today... think about the poll here at WS where ~10% think not guilty on the bottom charge. After MONTHS of disecting on these threads and took so long for many to decide (myself included... still not sure myself and why I posted jury instructions again this am!)

If 11 of the 12 think guilty on the bottom charge, do you think they should go to the judge and state on the FIRST DAY for any of the 3 charges that we are hung..... after/within the first day?

I think not. MOO.
Click to expand...

On another board I follow 1/3rd voted not guilty out of almost 500 votes. They aren't as savvy and knowledgeable as posters here but it's garnered tremendous attention on a forum that has nothing to do with crime. I've never seen anything like it in the 20 years I've been involved there.
 
Rocky1 said:
What I am saying is sometimes the jury does not do what they are supposed to do.
Everyone is bias. The Judge mentioned that yesterday. So yes, what they see and what they hear has an affect on their decision, regardless if it's supposed to or not.
IMO, there's not one juror that is not wondering what affect their decision is going to have on the entire nation., and on their personal/families safety.
Click to expand...

BBM
This is so true imo.
 
RANCH said:
Let's say the jury does discuss Maxine Waters statement and the possible repercussions of a not guilty verdict. Would we necessarily know they did that? JMO
Click to expand...
Jurors are required to follow the jury instructions which in part states their verdict must be based solely on the evidence and they can not allow public opinion to influence their decision. If an entire panel of jurors collectively decided to discuss issues outside of the evidence including matters of public opinion, that would be a dereliction of duty on their part. I think that the possibility of that happening are extremely low and not worth discussing. The chances of anyone knowing would be if one or more jurors took their responsibility seriously and alerted the judge to fellow juror misconduct.
I have faith that the majority of jurors take their responsibility very seriously and that includes my faith in the jurors for this trial.

It may help to read through the jury instructions to gain an understanding of their obligations as a jury.
https://www.scribd.com/document/503...-in-Derek-Chauvin-trial#fullscreen&from_embed
 
dixiegirl1035 said:
@Weki, you say that this should not go past today... think about the poll here at WS where ~10% think not guilty on the bottom charge. After MONTHS of disecting on these threads and took so long for many to decide (myself included... still not sure myself and why I posted jury instructions again this am!)

If 11 of the 12 think guilty on the bottom charge, do you think they should go to the judge and state on the FIRST DAY for any of the 3 charges that we are hung..... after/within the first day?

I think not. MOO.
Click to expand...

We never know who’s commenting on here and what their agenda might be. I’ll just leave it at that. But I think 12 reasonable people with common sense should be able to reach a verdict fairly quickly. The facts are not that complicated and the video speaks for itself. There just isn’t any justification nor is the cause of death at issue IMO. It’s pretty obvious why GF died. I think any holdouts would just be sympathetic to LE. And the others would have to work hard to bring them into the fold if they can. They definitely shouldn’t give up so easily if they can’t reach a verdict today! My point is if it goes past today, that’s the reason. JMO
 
I believe that the jury will do what the instructions require. I think the Water's issue is a red herring that people use to say that the jury will be tainted toward avoiding violence and a guilty verdict when it is not warranted. In the same way that the city preparation is used to say that the jury is intimidated to finding guilty. The work of the prosecution was excellent in this case. The work of the defense to create holes was what it was supposed to do but many don't think it was effective enough.

These jurors had been sworn to follow the rules and work to be impartial. I am a little sad that in this case they are not being given the benefit of the doubt. For these people to sit with what they have had to see (again and again) and hear the evidence is yeoman's work. To intimate that they can't rise above rhetoric is wrong. Now, if one of them says that there is an issue, then there is an issue. If the judge thinks there is an issue he needs to remedy it. The jury needs all of the love and support they can get.

I will add that the video of this man's killing is just the beginning of what will be the SOP of bystanders in police stops, interactions, and issues. We all need to get used to seeing shootings, etc in vivid color and not just from body worn cameras.

IMHO.
 
Chauvin jurors facing 'through the roof' stress as deliberations begin

I found this part of the article interesting.
Paul Applebaum, who handles both civil rights and criminal defense cases, said defense attorneys tend to oppose the use of sequestered juries and that being locked in a hotel could impact the outcome of the Chauvin verdict.

"People don't fight for a position when they are isolated and lonely," said Applebaum. "They throw up hands and want to go home.
Click to expand...

I agree with this and it's one of the reasons I feel this jury will vote guilty on all charges. JMO

Chauvin jurors facing 'through the roof' stress as deliberations begin
 
oceanblueeyes said:
Anyone should be outraged when a seasoned qualified judge who was a past prosecutor clearly said on the record MWs statements could overturn the conviction if found guilty.
Click to expand...
snipped

I was also not happy he made those statements. But, to be fair, he didn't go as far as saying her words could overturn, but they could be grounds for appeal. An appeal does not automatically mean a verdict is overturned. Unless I am missing part of his statement?

"The judge overseeing the trial of former Minneapolis police officer Derek Chauvin on Monday harshly criticized U.S. Representative Maxine Waters' remarks on the case, saying she might have given the defense grounds for appeal in the event of a conviction."

Judge blasts U.S. Rep Maxine Waters for 'abhorrent' comments about Chauvin trial | Reuters

Might sound nitpicky, but there is a difference between an appeal and an overturn (just like there is a difference between charges and a conviction).

jmo
 
oceanblueeyes said:
Anyone should be outraged when a seasoned qualified judge who was a past prosecutor clearly said on the record MWs statements could overturn the conviction if found guilty.

Yes, I'm outraged she made such volatile statements, and needlessly interjected herself, and compounded what will already be used by the defense on appeal.

I have followed many cases that have wound up being overturned on appeal, and I know EN has a good case for this one to be overturned.

Imo, eveyone should care when a case has very valid reasons to be overturned if they are truly not wanting it to be overturned.

MW has unnecessarily, and senselessly given the defense even more than they already have, and MWs timing couldn't be worse.

How that can't be highly upsetting for all who want's justice for George is mind boggling to me.

Jmho
Click to expand...
Agree. I do wish politicians would refrain from calling for any particular verdict while a trial is ongoing. It's not good for justice or for politics.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

DNASolves

Who is Escambia County John Doe (1989)?

Members online

... and 209 more.
Total: 3,742 (members: 210, guests: 3,532)

Online statistics

Members online
210
Guests online
3,532
Total visitors
3,742
Totals may include hidden visitors.

Forum statistics

Threads
592,256
Messages
17,966,314
Members
228,734
Latest member
TexasCuriousMynd
Back
Top