GUILTY OH Pike Co., 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #61

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Seattle1 said:
^^rsbm
Any charges against the grandmothers would have to be new, never charged before.
I think the worst is behind them. They have to live with themselves. And as for God-fearing women -- not so much. MOO

ETA: Per link by @Ann99 - it appears RN was not yet sentenced but no doubt her attorney would not agree to extend the statute of limitations here. Per her plea agreement, her charges reduced to a misdemeanor obstructing official business. RN is also not on house arrest and is not on ankle monitor. The maximum sentence for her charge would be 90 days.
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OK, TY! I appreciate the clarity.
RN would still be able to provide information as everything moves forward.
I don't think she would tell lies now, after all that she has been through.
Or maybe there is info under seal.

I am thinking Prosecutors do not readily publicize all they have in their back pocket as evidence. Look how Canepa would delay and delay turning info over to defense. I feel sure there are details we do not know. Remember under seal.
Could include info from Rita. Maybe not.
Ok, done with Rita

Now, Look at the dates here

Edward “Jake” Wagner’s defense attorneys question evidence in Pike County massacre case

We now know Canep began to put together the plea deal on 4/12.
I am willing to bet she provided or intimated in one on one conversations with Jakes attorney that the State held additional damaging info/ evidence.
Jakes ttorney could not have advised him to accept the deal without strong reason to believe prosecutors had a very solid case.
Nor could it be offered to the other 3W's and assume their attorney would advise their client to accept the deal unless their attorney felt it was appropriate. The death penalty and secondary attorney in each case has a very high standard (and is scrutinized carefully) regarding advice to their client.
 
Seattle1 said:
^^rsbm
Any charges against the grandmothers would have to be new, never charged before.
I think the worst is behind them. They have to live with themselves. And as for God-fearing women -- not so much. MOO

ETA: Per link by @Ann99 - it appears RN was not yet sentenced but no doubt her attorney would not agree to extend the statute of limitations here. Per her plea agreement, her charges reduced to a misdemeanor obstructing official business. RN is also not on house arrest and is not on ankle monitor. The maximum sentence for her charge would be 90 days.
Personally, I think holding off on sentencing is being used as a reminder to keep her from communicating with her daughter Angela. They've violated that order before.
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Yes, I agree that's likely the state's strategy. Nothing changes until all of the cases of the 4 W's are resolved.

According to DeWine in his interview behind the court house after Jake's status hearing, the gag order, etc. stays in place until all the cases are resolved.

State is not taking anything for granted. No one (defendants, family, etc.) gets to talk to anyone else, etc. No new information revealed to the news media or public. They're still in the process of finalizing the court's approval of Jake's agreement. There are still a lot of i's to dot and t's to cross.
 
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Ann99 said:
OK, TY! I appreciate the clarity.
RN would still be able to provide information as everything moves forward.
I don't think she would tell lies now, after all that she has been through.
Or maybe there is info under seal.

I am thinking Prosecutors do not readily publicize all they have in their back pocket as evidence. Look how Canepa would delay and delay turning info over to defense. I feel sure there are details we do not know. Remember under seal.
Could include info from Rita. Maybe not.
Ok, done with Rita

Now, Look at the dates here

Edward “Jake” Wagner’s defense attorneys question evidence in Pike County massacre case

We now know Canep began to put together the plea deal on 4/12.
I am willing to bet she provided or intimated in one on one conversations with Jakes attorney that the State held additional damaging info/ evidence.
Jakes ttorney could not have advised him to accept the deal without strong reason to believe prosecutors had a very solid case.
Nor could it be offered to the other 3W's and assume their attorney would advise their client to accept the deal unless their attorney felt it was appropriate. The death penalty and secondary attorney in each case has a very high standard (and is scrutinized carefully) regarding advice to their client.
Click to expand...

I think the idea of a plea agreement had been lobbied back and forth since around February. However, I think both sides got serious in chambers at the April 12 hearing where the Judge likely gave them the OK to firm up the details.

The gag order prevents disclosing more details but the meeting in chambers did slip in during the hearing. MOO
 
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Seattle1 said:
I think the idea of a plea agreement had been lobbied back and forth since around February. However, I think both sides got serious in chambers at the April 12 hearing where the Judge likely gave them the OK to firm up the details.

The gag order prevents disclosing more details but the meeting in chambers did slip in during the hearing. MOO
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IMO, getting to a plea deal was the prosecution's intention all along. That's why they let it drag on interminably with trivial charges against the grandmothers, and so forth: divide and conquer. Also raise the possibility that one of the other accused may be ready to take a plea deal, so you better get in there first.
 
Satchie said:
IMO, getting to a plea deal was the prosecution's intention all along. That's why they let it drag on interminably with trivial charges against the grandmothers, and so forth: divide and conquer. Also raise the possibility that one of the other accused may be ready to take a plea deal, so you better get in there first.
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I agree -- the timing for statute of limitations and pressure for admission of prior acts evidence, etc., -- all fell in place -- not to mention the anniversary of this horrific tragedy. What is surprising is this is a family member.

I think it was a brilliant move by the state to immediately separate the defendants. I'm so relieved for the Rhoden family.

I also hope the other family members agree to change their pleas to guilty -- saving the state $1M+ for a trial.

‘Nobody expected this:’ Why a legal expert is shocked by Jake Wagner’s plea deal
 
Seattle1 said:
Finally, I do not believe there will be any additional charges here! In the April 12, 2021 hearing, Jakes's defense put the prosecutor to task by requesting the state bring all evidence forward (for any pending charges that they've long been threatening).

The prosecutor tried her best to keep the suspense going by requesting the defense object with more detail to any potential charge on the laundry list and the Judge wasn't having it. I'm surprised the state has gotten away this long dangling the suspicion of 403b evidence and think we finally saw the put up or shut up on April 12. MOO
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If Jake was cooperating for a long time, is it possible at the April 12, th hearing the knew the plea deal was coming and didn't want the other 3 family members to know that was coming? I think the evidence they had (the guns Jake lead them to and the vehicle, etc) was because Jake talked. If they reveal those cards, then the other 3 would have known he was talking. Is there a rule that protects this evidence in that case since revealing it would reveal one of the 4 was cooperating and cutting a deal?
 
justtrish said:
If Jake was cooperating for a long time, is it possible at the April 12, th hearing the knew the plea deal was coming and didn't want the other 3 family members to know that was coming? I think the evidence they had (the guns Jake lead them to and the vehicle, etc) was because Jake talked. If they reveal those cards, then the other 3 would have known he was talking. Is there a rule that protects this evidence in that case since revealing it would reveal one of the 4 was cooperating and cutting a deal?
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A deal is not a deal until it's signed, sealed, delivered, and approved by the court.
I think Jakes's defense attorneys would have been remiss if they did not carry on in court as if there was no deal. Motions were filed and heard -- the only difference I can think of leaning towards the agreement is that they requested an expedited hearing in April that was previously set for May 12. Then again, the April 12 hearing, IMO, was really a win for all the defendants. MOO
 
Felecia said:
Or for those that do not have enough work quarters to qualify for SSD. If a recipient has income, the SSI can be reduced depending upon the type of income.
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Probably not a factor in Billy's case. He 'worked' for his mother FW. I'm sure she paid him just enough reportable income, so he could collect the full amount of SSI. Additionally, off the record, I'm sure FW paid him in ways such as cash and underwriting his purchases and living expenses.

FW's charges were dismissed without prejudice. All of the her Amazon records could also indicate FW financed the murders and the deception used to evade LE. The Amazon records were from 2014 through 11/13/2018 - the date of their arrest.

I do not think it is over yet for FW, I think her nightmare is just beginning. Remember, they confiscated all of her business records during the course of the investigation. As we speak, IRS agents may be pouring through her records. Tax evasion???:cool:

All JMO, MOO, etc.
 
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Puzzles8 said:
Probably not a factor in Billy's case. He 'worked' for his mother FW. I'm sure she paid him just enough reportable income, so he could collect the full amount of SSI. Additionally, off the record, I'm sure FW paid him in ways such as cash and underwriting his purchases and living expenses.

FW's charges were dismissed without prejudice. All of the her Amazon records could also indicate FW financed the murders and the deception used to evade LE. The Amazon records were from 2014 through 11/13/2018 - the date of their arrest.

I do not think it is over yet for FW, I think her nightmare is just beginning. Remember, they confiscated all of her business records during the course of the investigation. As we speak, IRS agents may be pouring through her records. Tax evasion???:cool:

All JMO, MOO, etc.
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I agree 100%. Tax evasion at the very least.
Who thinks FW would actually admit to anything at all,
regardless of the proof in front of her.
I want to know the whole story behind FW and her Husband.
And then her child Billy and grandchildren, George, Jake.
So, what makes her tick?
 
Seattle1 said:
A deal is not a deal until it's signed, sealed, delivered, and approved by the court.
I think Jakes's defense attorneys would have been remiss if they did not carry on in court as if there was no deal. Motions were filed and heard -- the only difference I can think of leaning towards the agreement is that they requested an expedited hearing in April that was previously set for May 12. Then again, the April 12 hearing, IMO, was really a win for all the defendants. MOO
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Agree, Jake still has a sentencing hearing ahead of him. In a sense the deal is finalized, but the details have yet to be worked out. It's complicated especially for him since his indictment includes 23 individual charges, many with specification. They all carry different kinds of penalties.

The same will probably apply for all the other defendants as they face about 22 charges each, also with weapons and other specifications.
 
Myland said:
Jmo we know two different guns used at Chris sr. What guns were used at the other six? Was Kenny killed with a gun used at Chris sr?
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State has only revealed the caliber of guns used at each scene (based on shells recovered). During Agent Scheiderer's hearing he talked about GW4's Glock and Jake's 22 pistol, called a Colt 1911 (IIRC). They also said they retrieved 2 weapons from the info Jake gave them in his plea deal. They haven't been any more specific than that.
 
Betty P said:
Agree, Jake still has a sentencing hearing ahead of him. In a sense the deal is finalized, but the details have yet to be worked out. It's complicated especially for him since his indictment includes 23 individual charges, many with specification. They all carry different kinds of penalties.

The same will probably apply for all the other defendants as they face about 22 charges each, also with weapons and other specifications.
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Jmo but he knows he will never ever walk out of prison alive unless he gets a chance of a what I guess would be a better prison why would the details matter? Jmo I don’t know if there is such a thing as a better prison but what else could he be giving up. I wonder if he really just confessed to get the death penalty off the table for the others but then even why not take the entire blame? Wonder who he says killed the other three? We will probably never really know the answers to the questions we have. In a sick mind like that how can you truly know the answers other than they did it.
 
Myland said:
Jmo we know two different guns used at Chris sr. What guns were used at the other six? Was Kenny killed with a gun used at Chris sr?
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Two different guns were used on GR. Don't know if one of those guns or another was used on CRsr.

I think we have agreed Jake used the .22,
G4 used the Glock .30
Billy used the .40 SKS with the night scope

I don't think we can yet connect any particular guns with the victims they killed. We know how many bullets killed each victim, but not the particular caliber of the bullets.

JMO, MOO, etc.
 
Puzzles8 said:
Two different guns were used on GR. Don't know if one of those guns or another was used on CRsr.

I think we have agreed Jake used the .22,
G4 used the Glock .30
Billy used the .40 SKS with the night scope

I don't think we can yet connect any particular guns with the victims they killed. We know how many bullets killed each victim, but not the particular caliber of the bullets.

JMO, MOO, etc.
Click to expand...
Which of these guns could blast thru a door?
 
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