Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #136

[somequestions]

Excellent description of the process and the issues. The same issues come up in reconstructions of unidentified victims. Even the best recreation is an approximation of a possible face, not a photo of what the person looked like in life.

And people like us aren't the audience for either. It doesn't matter whether we think the sketches look alike or are two different people or whatever. The important thing would be whether someone who knows the person would recognize them and be motivated to tell LE.

Someone needs to pin this to the beginning of every Delphi thread! Thank you for articulating it so well.

This is only if the person depicted in the sketch actually does cause someone to recognize them. I think the general public should disregard the sketches and focus on the phone video. There are numerous cases that are many years old where LE is still waiting on the right person to call in who recognizes the sketch put out in any given investigation. In my opinion, you cannot expect the general public to think like LE and not do side by side comparisons. I wonder how many of the tips LE has in this case that are basically useless because of this.

Like it or not, when LE put out that young second sketch that became the new "face" of their investigation. The only things I have learned is that based on the sketches the suspect is between the ages of 18-70. He may or may not have hair. He may or may not have been wearing a hat. He may or may not be local to the Delphi, Indiana area.

In my opinion, when Carter said a sketch is not a photograph he is trying to keep the descriptions as broad as possible in case the actual description of the person responsible is very different. As long as you keep things as broad as possible you can always say later that you were right. In my opinion, this is also why press conferences have stopped. Do they really need to point to another sketch and tell everyone "this is the person responsible for the murders of Abigail Williams and Liberty German"?

In my opinion, LE is chasing an unknown and hoping for the day that someone sends in the tip(based on either the sketches or video) that connects their evidence to the person tipped in. Cases like this show that you have to be able to narrow the focus of who you are looking for or you will spend years chasing down false leads and tip descriptions from people who think they have seen bridge guy. And I do not doubt that many of these sightings are genuine from people who truly want to help.

Wouldn't it be something if the right tip was submitted before either sketch press conference? And LE simply did not think the person who submitted it was correct. Often times that seems to be how cases go.

 

[somequestions]

In my opinion, the number one problem with sketches: Being able to figure out the person who truly saw the person depicted in the sketch versus all the people who submit tips that think they have seen the person depicted in the sketch.

In this case you have two sketches and a phone video. There have probably been thousands of description tips sent in. Which one, out of all these people who genuinely care and think they recognize bridge guy by sending in a tip, is correct?

I think if you talked to some of the people who submitted description tips they would tell you they are convinced that they recognize the person in the sketch or phone video. Or else they would not have sent it in as a tip to LE.

 

[Yemelyan]

In my opinion, you cannot expect the general public to think like LE and not do side by side comparisons. I wonder how many of the tips LE has in this case that are basically useless because of this.

.

Snipped and bolded for focus....

That's the one thing LE has asked the public not to do.

I don't think LE cares what the "general public" - such as you and I - do on the privacy of our own computer in the sense that we can compare side by sides for our own personal entertainment all we like. But LE has said many times that they do not want these published on the internet for discussion, and they've said they don't want tips on comparisons of strangers like these unless the tipster has some personal information on how the person is linked to, or could know about, Delphi.

Furthermore, they've asked the general public to stop sending in tips of investigative strategy, i.e. "have you contacted Parabon?" "Did someone check all surveillance cameras?" "I think BG has a wooden leg."

I think they've been 100% clear on this. The fact that they've had to clarify it tells me that most of their 50,000 tips are useless.

I really don't think it's too much to ask for us to abide by their request. To your point in your follow-up post, there will always be people who want to insert themselves into investigations like this one by submitting useless tips. Though they have no chance of knowing any pertinent information due to geography, they often mean well. It's unfortunate for the investigators though.

 

[carbuff]

The way people behave over cases like this, it's no wonder many LE agencies have started to restrict public access to information. We turn out to be a time sink much more often than we're helpful.

 

[Snow_In _June]

The way people behave over cases like this, it's no wonder many LE agencies have started to restrict public access to information. We turn out to be a time sink much more often than we're helpful.

I agree with your statement totally and funnily enough had posted something similar on a different thread prior to reading your comment.

 

[minazoe]

.I was just thinking that with JBC having an upcoming trial that they would be eager to clear him of suspicion in Delphi..after all he should get a fair trial and not have this notorious double child murder hanging over him and the jury pool.

nope. not word one. mOO

 

[OverTheRhine]

The way people behave over cases like this, it's no wonder many LE agencies have started to restrict public access to information. We turn out to be a time sink much more often than we're helpful.

The facebook groups are some of the worst offenders. The stuff that goes on in there is absolute insanity. This is like a game for these people and they treat it like it's some alternate reality.

 

[minazoe]

LE is not looking at JBC because of the public and social media interest ..they have a legitimate reason , obviously and we may not have even uncovered that reason.they know way more than we do and they saw something about JBC that legitimately is of interest to them... wonder what it is? EVERYTHING????

I'm still on JBC. mOO

 

[carbuff]

I'm still of the opinion that if LE is seriously looking at JBC or anybody else, we won't hear a word about until they have a press conference announcing it.

 

[SMK777]

.I was just thinking that with JBC having an upcoming trial that they would be eager to clear him of suspicion in Delphi..after all he should get a fair trial and not have this notorious double child murder hanging over him and the jury pool.

nope. not word one. mOO

It’s perplexing.

 

[carbuff]

.I was just thinking that with JBC having an upcoming trial that they would be eager to clear him of suspicion in Delphi..after all he should get a fair trial and not have this notorious double child murder hanging over him and the jury pool.

nope. not word one. mOO

That wouldn't likely postpone his trial anyway. At most he could get a change of venue.

 

[SMK777]

LE is not looking at JBC because of the public and social media interest ..they have a legitimate reason , obviously and we may not have even uncovered that reason.they know way more than we do and they saw something about JBC that legitimately is of interest to them... wonder what it is? EVERYTHING????

I'm still on JBC. mOO

I more or less agree with @carbuff : If LE are planning a move regarding JBC, we won’t hear about it until it’s already done. It will be suddenly announced, with no lead up.

 

[TL4S]

I more or less agree with @carbuff : If LE are planning a move regarding JBC, we won’t hear about it until it’s already done. It will be suddenly announced, with no lead up.

Agreed. Plus, LE has stated all along that they have not officially "cleared" anyone.

Sheriff Leazenby continues to answer double homicide questions | Carroll County Comet

Q. In January 2019, you did an interview with a woman named Angela explaining that Ron Logan has been “covered” and not “cleared”. Have you been able to clear Ron Logan yet?

A. No one is truly “cleared” until we have the alleged responsible party in custody and formal criminal charges are filed by the prosecutor.

 

[TwoLea]

Re: witnesses and DNA - I recall a few years ago the emphasis that the suspect's eyes were definitively "not blue."

That has always made me wonder about DNA in the case, because colored contact lenses are a thing. How would they KNOW his eyes are positively not blue without DNA?

 

[kkdj]

I'm still of the opinion that if LE is seriously looking at JBC or anybody else, we won't hear a word about until they have a press conference announcing it.

I believe they said they are looking into JBC and if there is any connection.
Sorry no link, so moo.
But I'm sure there's one out there. imo

 

[Ozoner]

Re: witnesses and DNA - I recall a few years ago the emphasis that the suspect's eyes were definitively "not blue."

That has always made me wonder about DNA in the case, because colored contact lenses are a thing. How would they KNOW his eyes are positively not blue without DNA?

The eye color is based on an eyewitness description. It is reasonable to assume that the suspect wasn't wearing colored contact lenses; that's a remote possibility. If they based descriptions of suspects on that possibility, every description would have to say, "Eye color unknown." They'd have to say, "Hair color unknown," too, because people can dye their hair and buy wigs. That doesn't happen, for every description is based upon how the perp looked at the time he or she was seen.

 

[sandy_80]

notice they are kinds of blue eyes that look different in different lights.. they appear black most of times

 

[Charlot123]

LE is not looking at JBC because of the public and social media interest ..they have a legitimate reason , obviously and we may not have even uncovered that reason.they know way more than we do and they saw something about JBC that legitimately is of interest to them... wonder what it is? EVERYTHING????

I'm still on JBC. mOO

I believe that JBC was ruled out pretty soon, if he was ever suspected at all. JMO.

 

[urbancoyote]

Ok I am new to this one, and its probably been covered, but there are 100s of pages, so....
What is the general consensus on how the guy on the bridge caught up with the girls? The photo shows him what, 20 yards away? And As I understand it, the girls are at that stage off the bridge. He is not a quick mover, going by the small clip. They are clearly alarmed by him, so how did they let him catch up, basically where they stood?! If that info is all correct, then doesn't that leave us with 2 potential scenarios - 1. That he called their names (therefore he is known to them, or somehow gives them the impression he knows them) and this caused them to not run away , or 2, there was a second person behind them. Something stopped them from running, so what was it?

 

[StarryStarryNight]

Ok I am new to this one, and its probably been covered, but there are 100s of pages, so....
What is the general consensus on how the guy on the bridge caught up with the girls? The photo shows him what, 20 yards away? And As I understand it, the girls are at that stage off the bridge. He is not a quick mover, going by the small clip. They are clearly alarmed by him, so how did they let him catch up, basically where they stood?! If that info is all correct, then doesn't that leave us with 2 potential scenarios - 1. That he called their names (therefore he is known to them, or somehow gives them the impression he knows them) and this caused them to not run away , or 2, there was a second person behind them. Something stopped them from running, so what was it?

Yes, it has been discussed. Everything has been discussed! HaHa!
Once you cross the bridge the trail stops. (Technically the bridge is not part of the trail either). There is nowhere to go except onto private property, and though the girls certainly could have turned and run, Libby had apparently expressed concern about getting in trouble for that kind of thing before.
The girls were surely unsettled by this guy, but weren’t thinking his true intent. We all try to explain away anxious moments like this. To always be polite, plus they were children. They were waiting for him to finish crossing so they could cross back over. Their way of distancing themselves from him.