SC - Paul Murdaugh, 22 and mom Margaret, 52, found shot to death, Islandton, 7 June 2021 #2

[Diddian]

You know how you'll sometimes have a thought tickling the back of your brain but you just can't call it up?

I've had that feeling for a while now, and finally, FINALLY, it's come to me.

Thinking about all the tragedy and wreckage associated with this family, I'm reminded very much of this line from The Great Gatsby:

“They were careless people, Tom and Daisy- they smashed up things and creatures and then retreated back into their money or their vast carelessness or whatever it was that kept them together, and let other people clean up the mess they had made.”

~ F. Scott Fitzgerald, The Great Gatsby

Thank you. That was the EXACT quote replaying itself in my mind the past week in relation to this case.

I was also motivated to reread The Prince of Tides by Pat Conroy. And, particularly the chapter in which Conroy first introduces the reader to the wealthy and prominent town attorney, Reece Newberry.

Like RM-III, Conroy was also awarded the Order of the Palmetto.

 

[Valiant]

Regardless of past history, Paul and his mother were the victims of this crime.
Some posts almost seem to imply Paul deserved his fate. That's more vigilantism than justice.

 

[BrownRice]

Thank you. I was also motivated to reread The Prince of Tides by Pat Conroy. And, particularly the chapter in which Conroy first introduces the reader to the wealthy and prominent town attorney, Reece Newberry.

Like RM-III, Conroy was also awarded the Order of the Palmetto.

BEST BOOK EVER.

If anyone ever wants to understand life in SC, Conroy is the perfect author.

 

[stmarysmead]

Regardless of past history, Paul and his mother were the victims of this crime.
Some posts almost seem to imply Paul deserved his fate. That's more vigilantism than justice.

I haven’t seen any posts that suggest PM ‘deserved his fate.’

But there’s a valid reason that every media outlet reporting on this case, includes details from those certain prior tragedies in the area. The past tragedies and these murders, until shown to be otherwise, seem to be absolutely entwined. Even LE has given us that impression.

Consider this, although very little has been released about the investigation, one of the few things that has been made public by LE …is that this investigation… has now caused the SS case to be reopened!

That’s pretty astounding!

And we have been informed officially that the “public is not at risk.” That suggests targeting. The answer to the question of why this family might be targeted …is proffered under many articles in the comment section.

Even in the comments under PM’s obituary with the eerie condolences from “Mallory.”

MB, SS, and the housekeeper.

Details about PM’s behavior are now part of the public record, available for all to read. Sworn statements, not gossip, that do not contradict each other. Given by his once closest friends.

A light has now been shown on how PM was treated in the legal system and it can be compared with how others have been treated.

Fair or not, true or not, it appears that, in the past, PM benefited from a very skewed application of the law in that area. That ‘benefit’ may actually have put him at great risk. When others begin to believe that the justice system is corrupted, it becomes meaningless to them…a joke.

It’s infuriating. That’s dangerous.

Paul did not create that skewed system, if in fact it exists, nor did his Mother. But they may have died because of it.

My uninformed opinions only.

 

[worm]

After reading those comments on PMs obit page yesterday, I’m more open to the revenge theory than before. I’m sure those have been followed up but it just seems more plausible to me now.

 

[Cryptic]

Fair or not, true or not, it appears that, in the past, PM benefited from a very skewed application of the law in that area. That ‘benefit’ may actually have put him at great risk.

When others begin to believe that the justice system is corrupted, it becomes meaningless to them…a joke.

It’s infuriating. That’s dangerous.

Paul did not create that skewed system, if in fact it exists, nor did his Mother. But they may have died because of it.

Very well said.

Then factor in that there may have been other factors feeding into a very volatile situation. As with your well expressed point, neither of the victims created these other factors:

- SC is traditional and members of a family are not always seen as individuals. Rather, they can be seen to be operating as a collective whole, even when they are not.

- People have an innate belief that they higher one's status is, the more they are expected to follow their own rules.

Yet, a family (technically an individual(s) ), but SC is traditional who criminally prosecutes others apparently wants no concequences for their own criminal actions. Rumor has it that they then hinder another investigation into a murder.

- The current uhmm..... "challenges" that the family is facing may be arising at a time when the family, neither as individuals nor as a whole, has the shrewdness and intelligence of the founding father (four generations back). Thus, they dont have the insight to see when discretion is called for:

No punishment verse quietly arranging minimal punishment served under pleasant conditions with early release.

No ankle monitor verse quietly arranging token conditions regarding it and how long it will need to be worn.

PM continuing to not only live locally, but doing so as "Timmy" in various ways verse PM quietly relocating to say, Savannah for a few years before and after minimal punishment

 

[zencompass]

Very well said.

Then factor in that there may have been other factors feeding into a very volatile situation. As with your well expressed point, neither of the victims created these other factors:

- SC is traditional and members of a family are not always seen as individuals. Rather, they can be seen to be operating as a collective whole, even when they are not.

- People have an innate belief that they higher one's status is, the more they are expected to follow their own rules.

Yet, a family (technically an individual(s) ), but SC is traditional who criminally prosecutes others apparently wants no concequences for their own criminal actions. Rumor has it that they then hinder another investigation into a murder.

- The current uhmm..... "challenges" that the family is facing may be arising at a time when the family, neither as individuals nor as a whole, has the shrewdness and intelligence of the founding father (four generations back). Thus, they dont have the insight to see when discretion is called for:

No punishment verse quietly arranging minimal punishment served under pleasant conditions with early release.

No ankle monitor verse quietly arranging token conditions regarding it and how long it will need to be worn.

PM continuing to not only live locally, but doing so as "Timmy" in various ways verse PM quietly relocating to say, Savannah for a few years before and after minimal punishment

Dear @Cryptic,

Great post!

When you say, "insight to see when discretion is called for", are you meaning that the M's may not have taken steps to avoid the public viewing that members of the M family seem to be treated differently in Court than the average individual?

It appears that it may be unusual for an individual in S.C. to not be ordered to wear an alcohol-detecting ankle monitor. Some news articles are making a comparison, whether this applied to P.M.'s case or not.

Perhaps the M's predecessors seemed to have more "insight" into how the family was viewed by the public? I do not know.

JMO

Judge orders alcohol-detecting ankle monitor as bond condition for teen charged in deadly DUI crash
"The judge set bond at $15,000 and ordered Hutchinson to avoid driving and to wear an alcohol-detecting ankle monitor while she is on bond."

https://www.islandpacket.com/news/local/crime/article230215104.html
"In some DUI cases, such as that of the S.C. 17-year-old who allegedly killed another teen while driving drunk this week as Fox Carolina reported, a judge will require the defendant to wear an alcohol-detecting ankle monitor while awaiting trial."

 

[Diddian]

I haven’t read any mention of it, but I wonder how much insurance was carried on the lives of PM and MM (who RM-IV described as “the rock in that family.”).

I also wonder who else was privy to that information or became privy once AM’s liability or blanket policy denied payout on the MB wrongful death claim because the policy didn’t cover boat crashes.

If AM was at some point a POI, as has been reported, I would think LE has asked those same questions.

 

[Warwick7]

I don't know if this has been posted already:

https://www.islandpacket.com/news/local/crime/article252189783.html

 

[Cryptic]

When you say, "insight to see when discretion is called for", are you meaning that the M's may not have taken steps to avoid the public viewing that members of the M family seem to be treated differently in Court than the average individual?

Thanks for the compliment. I am meaning two things regarding descretion:

1. As you stated, discretion to avoid the public viewing special treatment. For example:

Publically, PM has an ankle monitor like everyone else. Behind the scenes, PM has alot of exceptions built into his restrictions and may not need to wear it long. But.... he did leave Court with an ankle monitor.

2. Discretion to know that one is asking for too much and when "the last straw" might be coming up. For example:

With no direct evidence to the contrary, the public can accept a quick end to a death investigation and a hit and run determination. The public can also probably accept minimal punishment for PM. But.... the public cannot accept the quick end to a death investigation and no punishment for PM and not even a token ankle monitor.

 

[stmarysmead]

Thanks for the compliment. I am meaning two things regarding descretion:

1. As you stated, discretion to avoid the public viewing special treatment. For example:

Publically, PM has an ankle monitor like everyone else. Behind the scenes, PM has alot of exceptions built into his restrictions and may not need to wear it long. But.... he did leave Court with an ankle monitor.

2. Discretion to know that one is asking for too much and when "the last straw" might be coming up. For example:

With no direct evidence to the contrary, the public can accept a quick end to an investigation and a hit and run determination. The public can also probably accept minimal punishment for PM. But.... the public cannot accept both the quick investigation and no punishment for PM.

To your excellent point…here’s an article that the general public might have read. It shows that questions about how the boating case was been handled were being asked in the media long before the murders. Let’s remember that the M brothers appeared astonished on TV when asked about special treatment.

Mallory Beach death investigation: Why was no one breathalyzed after crash?

 

[stmarysmead]

And this…


The Feb. 24 boat crash near Parris Island that killed Mallory Beach is not the first time Paul Murdaugh, the 20-year-old Hampton man charged with driving the boat under the influence that night, has been accused of an alcohol-related crime by the S.C. Department of Natural Resources in Beaufort County, court records show.

At Murdaugh’s bond hearing Monday, prosecutors told the court that Murdaugh’s potential alcohol use was a concern should he be released on bond, however they did not request any alcohol-related restrictions be placed on Murdaugh, such as requiring him to submit to breathalyzer testing while awaiting trial.

Prosecutors also did not ask the court to consider a citation Murdaugh received two years ago for possession of alcohol. DNR confirmed the misdemeanor charge Wednesday.

snip
When asked whether Murdaugh was on a boat when he charged in 2017, McCullough declined to answer, saying the case had been expunged.

Though McCullough used the word “expunged” to describe the status of the charges, court records associated with the case are still available to the public and do not contain the word “expunged” on them.

Snip


Just over a month before Murdaugh’s 2017 alcohol possession charge, he had another run-in with DNR on Beaufort County waters.

On April 22, 2017, Murdaugh was charged with littering “less than 15 pounds or 27 cubit feet in volume” by a DNR officer at McCalley’s Creek sandbar, according to court records.


Read more here: https://www.islandpacket.com/article230215104.html#storylink=cpy

 

[sunshineray]

"Sources" - lol - someone saw them arguing over where to put their towels on the beach.

Your comment reminded me of Jane Austen's Mr. Bennett~"For what do we live, but to make sport for our neighbors, and laugh at them in our turn?"

Rural living puts you more on show as opposed to being able to lose oneself in the city crowd. I'm sure locals know quite a lot about the Murdaugh but just keep quiet.

 

[stmarysmead]

https://www.islandpacket.com/news/l...RuMbwkm6LgNtZAr6BdX1jR7b3sB8pereStavqSJMORx-Y

Here LE explains or tries to explain…why they did no breathalyzer.

These sorts of articles have been read by the locals for years now. There has LONG been outrage about the handling of the MB case. Until I did this deep dive today, I did not realize that there was so much negative media reporting for so long.

Yet the M br0thers were unaware of this…puzzled even???

Very strange.

 

[sunshineray]

Thanks for the compliment. I am meaning two things regarding descretion:

1. As you stated, discretion to avoid the public viewing special treatment. For example:

Publically, PM has an ankle monitor like everyone else. Behind the scenes, PM has alot of exceptions built into his restrictions and may not need to wear it long. But.... he did leave Court with an ankle monitor.

2. Discretion to know that one is asking for too much and when "the last straw" might be coming up. For example:

With no direct evidence to the contrary, the public can accept a quick end to a death investigation and a hit and run determination. The public can also probably accept minimal punishment for PM. But.... the public cannot accept the quick end to a death investigation and no punishment for PM and not even a token ankle monitor.

Concerning #2...Asking too much, the last straw. I can see those applying to someone who always seemed to skirt having to pay consequences for their actions, especially a young someone who has grown up with great privilege being afforded him.

Concerning a much loved, and thought kindly of matriarch figure, why the last straw concerning them? She was killed with an assault rifle, multiple shots.

If PM was the fed-up with last-straw target why kill his, from what I've read, very well-liked mother just as violently? How does MM fit into the last straw?

 

[zencompass]

And this…


The Feb. 24 boat crash near Parris Island that killed Mallory Beach is not the first time Paul Murdaugh, the 20-year-old Hampton man charged with driving the boat under the influence that night, has been accused of an alcohol-related crime by the S.C. Department of Natural Resources in Beaufort County, court records show.

At Murdaugh’s bond hearing Monday, prosecutors told the court that Murdaugh’s potential alcohol use was a concern should he be released on bond, however they did not request any alcohol-related restrictions be placed on Murdaugh, such as requiring him to submit to breathalyzer testing while awaiting trial.

Prosecutors also did not ask the court to consider a citation Murdaugh received two years ago for possession of alcohol. DNR confirmed the misdemeanor charge Wednesday.

snip
When asked whether Murdaugh was on a boat when he charged in 2017, McCullough declined to answer, saying the case had been expunged.

Though McCullough used the word “expunged” to describe the status of the charges, court records associated with the case are still available to the public and do not contain the word “expunged” on them.

Snip


Just over a month before Murdaugh’s 2017 alcohol possession charge, he had another run-in with DNR on Beaufort County waters.

On April 22, 2017, Murdaugh was charged with littering “less than 15 pounds or 27 cubit feet in volume” by a DNR officer at McCalley’s Creek sandbar, according to court records.


Read more here: https://www.islandpacket.com/article230215104.html#storylink=cpy

Thank you @stmarysmead for this information.

In my opinion, these are details which citizens who lived there have read. It is from the news articles which "hate" could have grown in someone's mind to kill members of this family. Possibly. We have no idea who or why these horrid double murders occurred.

All of this information, in no way, implies that P.M. "deserved" to be murdered. No one deserves to be murdered or hurt in any way. I'm certain we all feel this same way.

These articles do show that because of the results of court cases involving P.M. - there could possibly be "disturbed" individual(s) who killed P.M. for whatever horrible reason they held in their minds

P.M. personally did not and could not have controlled Court decisions but maybe in a sick individual's mind - they felt he did.

We do know that there have been murders caused by individuals who have a seething rage against someone - which wouldn't make sense to us - but it does to them.

We do not know that P.M. was "targeted". All we know for certain is the brutal fact that 2 people were murdered. This is deeply saddening and horrific.

My heart goes out to P.M.'s and M.M.'s loved ones. May they be surrounded by love and comfort during this unfathomable time.

For whatever motivation they had, someone murdered P.M. and M.M. and hopefully soon, SLED will make an arrest, for the sake of the family as well as for the citizens there.

Just my thoughts and opinions.

 

[Sustained]

https://www.islandpacket.com/news/l...RuMbwkm6LgNtZAr6BdX1jR7b3sB8pereStavqSJMORx-Y

Here LE explains or tries to explain…why they did no breathalyzer.

These sorts of articles have been read by the locals for years now. There has LONG been outrage about the handling of the MB case. Until I did this deep dive today, I did not realize that there was so much negative media reporting for so long.

Yet the M br0thers were unaware of this…puzzled even???

Very strange.

The M brothers were very well aware of it - they're just not going to let on to the general public they are aware.

JMO

 

[Razz]

I haven’t seen any posts that suggest PM ‘deserved his fate.’

But there’s a valid reason that every media outlet reporting on this case, includes details from those certain prior tragedies in the area. The past tragedies and these murders, until shown to be otherwise, seem to be absolutely entwined. Even LE has given us that impression.

Consider this, although very little has been released about the investigation, one of the few things that has been made public by LE …is that this investigation… has now caused the SS case to be reopened!

That’s pretty astounding!

And we have been informed officially that the “public is not at risk.” That suggests targeting. The answer to the question of why this family might be targeted …is proffered under many articles in the comment section.

Even in the comments under PM’s obituary with the eerie condolences from “Mallory.”

MB, SS, and the housekeeper.

Details about PM’s behavior are now part of the public record, available for all to read. Sworn statements, not gossip, that do not contradict each other. Given by his once closest friends.

A light has now been shown on how PM was treated in the legal system and it can be compared with how others have been treated.

Fair or not, true or not, it appears that, in the past, PM benefited from a very skewed application of the law in that area. That ‘benefit’ may actually have put him at great risk. When others begin to believe that the justice system is corrupted, it becomes meaningless to them…a joke.

It’s infuriating. That’s dangerous.

Paul did not create that skewed system, if in fact it exists, nor did his Mother. But they may have died because of it.

My uninformed opinions only.

I haven’t seen any posts that suggest PM ‘deserved his fate.’

But there’s a valid reason that every media outlet reporting on this case, includes details from those certain prior tragedies in the area. The past tragedies and these murders, until shown to be otherwise, seem to be absolutely entwined. Even LE has given us that impression.

Consider this, although very little has been released about the investigation, one of the few things that has been made public by LE …is that this investigation… has now caused the SS case to be reopened!

That’s pretty astounding!

And we have been informed officially that the “public is not at risk.” That suggests targeting. The answer to the question of why this family might be targeted …is proffered under many articles in the comment section.

Even in the comments under PM’s obituary with the eerie condolences from “Mallory.”

MB, SS, and the housekeeper.

Details about PM’s behavior are now part of the public record, available for all to read. Sworn statements, not gossip, that do not contradict each other. Given by his once closest friends.

A light has now been shown on how PM was treated in the legal system and it can be compared with how others have been treated.

Fair or not, true or not, it appears that, in the past, PM benefited from a very skewed application of the law in that area. That ‘benefit’ may actually have put him at great risk. When others begin to believe that the justice system is corrupted, it becomes meaningless to them…a joke.

It’s infuriating. That’s dangerous.

Paul did not create that skewed system, if in fact it exists, nor did his Mother. But they may have died because of it.

My uninformed opinions only.

Do we know much about the housekeepers death? I'm wondering if it wasn't just an accidental but tragic fall. I also wonder if per AM's advice, the housekeeper's family sued him for damages.

I had a friend who was driving with her brother in law and they wrecked and she incurred injuries. He told her to sue him so she could receive money from his insurance to help with hospital bills.

Don't know if that's what happened here but thought I'd mention it.

 

[Cryptic]

If PM was the fed-up with last-straw target why kill his, from what I've read, very well-liked mother just as violently? How does MM fit into the last straw?

Objectively, she does not fit in at all. In a PM as target motive, she could well have been murdered to "leave no witnesses".

Subjectively, SC and especially rural SC, is a traditional southern area where individuals are always part of families- and families can be seen to stand as one.

Thus, the attackers could also feel that any direct relative of PM is nearly equally "guilty" as PM- since they are presumed to "have his back". This is especially if they did not publicaly renounce him.

Or, the "justification" for the murder may have been a blurry mix of both reasons. I.E.- We are targeting PM specifically, but are willing to include any adult relative who happens to be with him. Btw, we cant have witnesses.

Ironically, in this possible scenario, the murderers themselves would have probably continued to support a black sheep direct relative of theirs through thick and thin as well- and tried to help them any way they could.

But.... murderers also tend to exempt themselves from their own rules.

 

[stmarysmead]

Do we know much about the housekeepers death? I'm wondering if it wasn't just an accidental but tragic fall. I also wonder if per AM's advice, the housekeeper's family sued him for damages.

I had a friend who was driving with her brother in law and they wrecked and she incurred injuries. He told her to sue him so she could receive money from his insurance to help with hospital bills.

Don't know if that's what happened here but thought I'd mention it.

The housekeeper’s obituary also noted that she was very fond of the family…or something of that nature.

Obituary for Gloria Satterfield | Brice W. Herndon and Sons Funeral Home